PHB,

Way to go w/ your responses!

Very good! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Just wanted to mention something a little off topic.

In your sigline you have a recovery date.

You can't have a recovery day...it's a process that can't be pinned down to a certain date. I think you confused a day when WW said she wanted to try again w/ you as a recovery day.

That was just an "up" on this rollercoaster ride.

Also I was thinking about a new title for your thread...How about "PHB's saga...working my Plan A..."?

~ Marsh

SD, I agree w/you. Mr. W, I'm afraid a lot of that response is full of blame toward HB's WW. I'm afraid she'll take that to mean that she wasn't heard & will just push her farther away. The more the A is thrown in her face that it's so much worse than anything HB has ever done or mistakes he has made during this seperation, the more she will feel justified in what she's doing & the more it will be reinforced in her own mind that he will "never" forgive her if she does come back. I think he has to be very careful of his wording in any response.

ST...I agree

My response MUST be taken down a notch...I am only concerned with a legal response should this situation go down that road. I'd appreciate someone from a strictly MB point of view taking it down to the brass tacks for HB. I am far to wordy for my own good...let alone HB's.

If there are no takers...HB you do it and post it in your own words.

Don't teach. Don't preach.

Then proofread it AFTER re-reading exactly what LB's are on the main website and reduce it some more. IMO, some general response to the email as a whole as I suggested at the bottom is necessary to throw off WW that this is strictly a legal response and nothing more.

Mr. Wondering

Remember this too.


The stick of Plan A (by Pepperband)

Exposing adultery where it matters most. Exposure that takes the form of a swift and sudden unexpected tsunami of truth.

Not appologizing for exposure or speaking the truth in a kind yet direct way.

Directly communicating the hurt and devastation that the affair has caused.

Not accepting blame for the infidel's choice to become adulterous.

Let the consequences of adultery and infidelity fall freely upon the heads of the adulterous.

Establishing boundaries that disallow the affair to effect children of the marriage, financal security of the marriage, and otherwise ruin innocent bystanders.

Standing up to infidelity as a beast that must be slayed for the good of the family

I agree about the legality of it Mr. W. Maybe we could all pipe in w/some responses & HB, you can come up w/something that's a bit unique for your situation? A biggie in my experience was that LB be heard in what he said to me. I suspect it's the same thing w/your WW. Maybe there's some way you can validate her thoughts & still speak the truth w/o being overtly blaming? Can anyone help w/this? I can try, but I'm not sure how well I could do.

BTW HB, I'm proud of the way you handled the latest conversation. Probably set her aback a bit.

Finally...remember this:

Conflict is OK...it's a step up from withdrawal.

Further, HB's wife explicity wrote that she feels neglected, uncherished and unheard. Even though she won't understand nor hear his response...failure to respond at all signals withdrawal to her...like he just doesn't care. She may be in the fog but she thinks her feelings have validity. Maybe a couple "I understand"'s and/or "I am working on addressing my failures in the marriage as you have so painstakenly written out for me...thank you for expressing your concerns".

Care and concern for her should be addressed...not needy or desparately..but to some extent.

Mr. Wondering

p.s. - again, I concur that "no response" is generally the safer way to go...HB could even wait until friday or next week to respond. But the letter could hurt his custody battle position and a response could better his custody petition IF it ever comes to that. It's up to HB but a concise, well thought out, non-emotional response may be in order here.

That's exactly what I was thinking too, Mr. W.

Me too!!

It's an opportunity to show care and concern.

He should definitely take it!

~ Marsh

I'm not sure PHB didn't tell DD that her mother was going to he11. I think he mentioned that he DID say that and I think he even called WW the devil in front of DD.

It's probably best to find out for sure what he's said to DD.

~ Marsh

I agree too.

Something like this to start:

Mrs pBH,

I understand, like never before, your hurt and feelings of neglect (SP). I have read and reread your email and I have taken time to recall each time you mention. I have been working on my short comings with regard to our M and our problems. I have never done anything to try to hurt you our our DD.....

Not too long

Perhaps the response should be one of acknowledging what pHB's shortcomings have been in the marriage up until the A. A chance to acknowledge, and apologize for those shortcomings.

To go through the letter and catagorically address each of the issues will end up sounding like justifications and probably some Love Busting as well.

I don't disagree that some response might be appropriate, but it should be short, succinct and free of anything that could be construed of displacing blame, or love busting, IMHO.

Respectfully,
SD

I just thought of this.

when my wife was still fogged out I called Steve H. One thing he told me was to let her know that the very best thing that could happen was for my kids mother and father to be happy and in love again.

He said this was to show her that there was a path home. Maybe you can include this in your letter, if you write one.

******It's a start. If you haven't email me before please do so now at the address below. I've got a little information to share with you off-line. *****

Mr W I have emailed you.

Thanks I have good teachers.


I will fix this. Thanks still learning all of this


Done

I pretty sure I read it to her from the Bible. I didn't just come out and say it. She was asking questions and I said lets just see what the Bible says.

I have not called WW anything in front of DD except deceived. I have called OM many a thing in front of DD but she had her conclusion on him after the first time WW took them skating together. My DD is the one who told me about what was said to her and her cousin that day.

As far as to what has been said in front of DD. I couldn't begin to think about all that has been said to be honest about it. Not by just me though. DD has heard it from all of WW family. DD also was sat down by WW and OM and told that she would be living with them and she would be OK and get to play with cousin alot more. That she had to listen to OM when he told her something and all kinds of other things. I told her she DOES NOT have to listen to him. She said she knew that and she listened and then called him a homewrecker and told them it wasn't right and she would never live with him.

I know that she has heard to much. That is why I did not talk to her about it when I had her and did talk to her about honoring her mother. Just as I said to her on the phone tonight and WW heard that.

Ok, thanks for clarifying that, PHB.

Now we can get back to figuring out your response to her e-mail.

I'm out of here for the night...Cya tomorrow.

~ Marsh

I think I have answered all post now and will go and start a reply letter to her letter. I like the way M2L started the letter and I may use that and others suggestions and try to summerize into a short, sweet and to the point response. I will post it on here before I send it to her for sure so I can ge it polished.

On a side note, I have a friend who's wife has asked to leave and seperate. I have been trying to tell him to come on here and post his sitch but he has been reluctant. I am trying to help him the way you all have helped me. His sitch is diff because W isn't cheating. She said there just isn't anything left for her to give him and she ready to move on. If he comes here I may ask some of you to read his sitch and tell him who he needs to talk to. I can't lose you all yet but I told him he could borrow you. LOL I still need lots of encouragement.

I will say that repeating the things I have learned from all of you to him, sure helps me know that I am learning and keeps me focused on what I need to do. Its amazing how this works, I plan on being here for a long long time helping others as I have been helped. again THANKS to all and talk at you later.

Well, I think you would have best been served by not responding in any fashion to her letter. It was meant as a ploy to make you look bad in front of your co-workers, to gain sympathy for herself by that same group, and to bait you out into a response that would have 'proven' her allegations about you.

Silence in that situation is best.

As far as her calling you and asking to tell friends and family to 'mind their own business'...you're ONLY response to that should have been: "You sent them an email you didn't copy me on. Now you're getting responses to it...why would you want me to say anything to them about it? That what your choice to send to them, and you can discuss with them their responses as needed."

This falls under the 'let them suffer the consequences of their actions' stick part of plan A, IMHO.

Here we go..Thanks M2L for the start. I want to make this short and sweet response and work on those things she mentioned. Although I am not as bad as she made out in no way, but I can always use some refining...

I understand, like never before, your hurt and feelings of neglect (WW). I have read and reread your email and I have taken time to recall each time you mention. I have been working on my short comings with regard to our M and our problems. I have never done anything to intentionally try to hurt you our our DD. Although I realize I have because I acted in hurt and anger. I am working on my issues right now so that I can become the Loving, Caring, Respecting and most importantly THANKFUL Husband that I know I can be. I ignored these things for years due to immaturity and being complacent. I know now what I need to do for myself, to allow myself to be reformed into the Husband you have always dreamed of. I will allow myself to be your everything and more.
I am also working on my fatherhood. To be the father that listens, cares, loves and understands in order to become my DD's best friend. Who they can come to for Guidance and Leadership and Correction in their times of trouble as well as the good times.
I think both deserve to be raised knowing and seeing a father who cherishes his bride so they will know what to look for. My desire is to strive to become a role model for you and DD's, so when you, DD's and others look at this man, and know that he is what every Husband and father should be.
Thanks for pointing out the areas where I have hurt you and I will work on them without ceasing.


Ok I know this needs some polishing but like I said I am not to good with works. OK I am ready to lick me wounds so let me have it. LOL

I think it's too long and it didn't address Mr. W's concerns.

There's no rush here, so you can take your time figuring this out.

~ Marsh