Look...I have no problem with someone's opinion but I do have a problem with members here posting replies to me that consist of "oinks & snorts"...This is not only childish but pointless and there is NOBODY on here telling them off besides myself.

I answered Noddles question, I now know what this website is about and you have just confirmed what I felt this website is about.

When you have someone questioning your motives to the point where they think YOU are having sport with their heart ache... you should take a closer look at your words and WONDER why you were getting the response you received.

It might be helpful.

I think you'll find that the vast majority of the 'oldtimers' here will disagree with that statement. Now, I'd also bet that they'd almost all agree with "Twice a cheater, always a cheater".

Once can be bad judgement, based on the situation and circumstances. We've seen a lot of people here that made the mistake ONCE.

Twice indicates a behavior pattern. Doing it again after seeing the results and knowing the pain you cause the BS is a choice, not a mistake. Big difference.

Suggestion...lurk here a while and see what you learn about what's actually said. You saw one thread and jumped on it. Wait and see and read a lot of the other threads, and you'll start seeing the pattern.

One of the reasons I called you out was to give some highlight to your warning because I think that there is an important message in there that is being lost.

People often become desperate to halt the action that is rocking their personal boat and as a result do tend to settle and rush and as a result do suffer lots of what we call false recovery.

Usually it comes about as a result of pretty much what you described...you felt guilt or whatever [no crystal ball into your head, right?] enough to GO back but not 100% and not with a willingness to seek and try turn over every rock.

You pretty much went back...had a look around...decided it wasn't better or good enough and then dismissed it and moved on.

It happens and sometimes people just AREN'T willing or able to do what it takes to recover. Personal limits are real and I think people would do well to respect them.

What I would take from your story and perspective is to take it slow and make sure that both partners understand and are willing to committ to a recovery plan wholeheartedly...not with one foot out the door.

If you have one foot out the door you may as well just put the other one out with it because until you go one way or the other..you aren't going ANYWHERE...noncomittal never won any wars or races.

You are right in your approach and I have tried many times to have the sexual attractiona and could not, it is not his fault it is mine. What I was trying to say was that my ex husband is still wanting "US" back and even after 2 yrs it is not what I want. I am on here looking for the advice he has been receiving and stumbled across a situation like ours and have been accused of many things but no one but you and owl have asked for the real reasons. If I knew that there was any hope I would try it again because marriage was important to me but there is not. I am happy with my current situation and wanted to find out why he won't let it go and now see that no one would stand up and tell him to let it go. He is a good person and I want him to be happy but we can't be happy together. Any suggestions on how I can now make him move on and find the happiness he deserves?

No, because this is out of your control. He has to chose this not you. You can not MAKE him do anything! Sorry!

One of the foundational principles of MB [marriage builders] is that one person can't "make" another person do anything.

Learning to respect each others bounadries and autonomy is a very important part of any respectfull relationship.

He can't make you desire to reconcile and you can't make him give up his desire for it.

Are you still in contact after the divorce?

I got on his site due to the subject line it was very close to my own experience, the more I read his story the more I realize that it was very familar to me. I am not messing with anyone, I am stating my experience and was looking at why my ex husband is still on this site after two yrs and I have made it clear I do not want the marriage any longer. Most on here has been very unkind if you disagree with them and the only statments I really have made to that guy was that he should ask his family for advice as they saw it for the reality it is. Not you or me could see the whole picture as we are not there. We can only offer our experiences and it was ok for you to offer yours but not ok when I offered mine. Something is messed up here and it is not my going on his site out of curisoty.

And given that your situation didn't work out, the best advice you could give that other person in a similar boat would be the reasons why it didn't work out and what steps he might take to improve his own odds. Again, marriage-BUILDING site.


Well, the ONLY reason there isn't any hope is because YOU have made the choice not to GIVE it any hope. Kind of a catch-22, you know? Because YOU CHOOSE to not give it any hope, it can't have any hope.

If you TRULY, DEEP DOWN DECIDED that it had a chance...then it WOULD have a chance.

The only thing holding it back is you.

If there's nothing 'wrong' with your ex...and nothing 'wrong' with you...then the only thing stopping it from happening right now is YOUR CHOICE to keep it from happening.

Again, read what you've heard from a couple of us about feelings following choices.

As far as helping your ex...well...in truth your beyond the point where you have that option. As long as you CHOOSE to remain where you're at, there isn't a single thing you can do to help him.

He won't let it go because he knows the reality...it DOES have a chance. As a matter of fact, he likely knows (since you say he's been posting here) that your relationship with OM is far more likely to fail within the next 2 years than anything else. Do a search on the internet for these kinds of stats...they're out there to read.

Guess what...he still wants it because he loves you. He knows you better than anyone else ever has...and has been hurt by you deeper than you can possibly imagine (take it from a man who's been there)...and he still loves you.

Food for thought my friend.

Thanks for the input on this. Yes we are still in contact as we have a mutual friend who neither of us want to lose and we have made it a comfortable situation. Don't get me wrong I do not hate my ex husband. This is the reason I want to try and help him move on with his life, he deserves better than I gave him.

About the family...

That is one point we will have to disagree about.

Family is usually the LEAST helpfull avenue for advice or perspective because they ARE so emotionally invested and no matter how well intentioned that does bias their perspective.

Same reason why doctors do not treat or operate on family members..they just can't detach from the situation enough to make clear and accurate assesments.

A family might encourage a person to leave the marriage prematurely because they want them to FEEL better...they do not want to see them suffer.

They might also encourage a person to remain in an abusive situation for a variety of reasons and this is historically one of the BIGGEST hurdles for a person who really NEEDS to leave but is afraid...lack of familial support.

I will read yours and noodles comments again. Thanks again for your input and thoughts. My boyfriend and I have been together 2 yrs after my divorce and I cannot see my life without him. We are planning marriage next summer and hopefully a family together.

Thanks and good luck to you

I agree but I disagree, if we had listened to our family we would have saved alot of hurt in the end. Thanks for your input and help and I wish you the best of luck

It is a choice.

Feelings are a result of observing/experiencing something and intrepreting it. This causes a repeat cycle where those feelings are reinforced or dismissed. But the intrepretation is the choice.

What if you got a dozen red roses from someone who did not leave a card. What would your opinon of that anyomous person be. How would they make you feel? How would you feel about them? Intrigued, attracted, angry?

What if an hour later you found out the flowers were from a relative, the ex, or your lover? Would your feelings change? Why? Same flowers, same effort, thoughtfulness, cost, time, to send them.

Its your intrepretation of the act that drives your feelings and that is a choice.

I hope you can see that.

What did your family say?

Were they opposed to or did they have concerns about the relationship prior to becoming aware of your dissatisfaction?

Oh and a few thoughts in regard to Owls thoughts on possibilities and your position that reconciliation is impossible.

I think you are both correct but that it ties together.

No one knows what is possible if everyone actually DID the 100% effort of recovery.

Your ex knows this. He knows that saying it is impossible is an exaggerration.

On the other hand...it IS impossible because you have chosen not to do it. You don't WANT to make that effort and invest any further in that relationship.

So while it may be possible if everyone were willing...the fact that you are not willing renders it IMpossible...that is your choice...you choose no.

I think owning that choice might go a long way actually in achieving said goal of exH moving on.

Saying things like "It's impossible" when it clearly is NOT impossible does simulataneously blameshift [it's not ME I would do it if it could be done..it just can't be done] and create hope [because he knows that it COULD be done...he perhaps has studied relationship dynamics and seen example after example of couples who have indeed accomplished this very impossible thing].

Saying instead...I know it may be possible but I don't WANT to do it and am not WILLING to do it...I choose NOT to do it makes for a much tougher nut to crack and probably helps a person move towards acceptance and let go because as we all know...we can only control ourselves.

If he believes that what prevents you from reconsidering is your belief that it is impossible [but that you would want to do it if it were] then obviously he wants to show you examples of success and try to move toward that goal.

If you own that choice as a choice then really...it IS easier to allow that choice to be YOURS without him thinking that there was just some dark curtain or piece of information he failed to reveal.

Hmmm..I may have gotten a bit redundant here but I think i circles..no reason why you all should be spared reading my thoughts in them.

I second what noodle said.
If your "ex" has been here for two years, he knows he cannot "make you" do anything. But if he respects you at all, then he will believe that you can be reasoned with, if you hav a flaw in your logic.

if you say that you cant come back becuase "it's impossible to get those feelings back", then your "ex" knows that is flawed logic, because there are waaayyy too many people who have proven it is not impossible. (even people who have once claimed themselves, "it's impossible" <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

If on the other hand, you acknowlege the proven logic, and then say "yes, I understand it is possible, but I choose not to", then your ex has nothing left to argue with you there.

Yes..that's pretty much exactly what I said but more articulate and concise.

Now ..how do I get the little winking emoticon so I can stop typing "wink" when I want to?

Hello Bosslady,

I'm going to try to explain something from my experience. My marriage did not recover. It happens sometimes, and it happened in my case. It takes two to rebuild a marriage and stbx did not want to do his part.

I did everything that was my responsibility to do. I loved him (the verb) long before my feelings of love returned. He loved me (the feeling)--and still does--but he didn't love me (the verb) as was needed to rebuild the marriage, and still doesn't.

I accepted stbx's decision to not rebuild the marriage because that is his decision to make. I continued to do my part because that was my decision to make--even though he wanted me to "move on". Doing my part, leaving no stone unturned, was part of my personal recovery, the recovery that will prepare me for relationships and/or remarriage that is everything that I wanted my marriage rebuilt into.

So, don't worry about your xh not "moving on" because he probably is. He's just moving on in a different way, and in his own time. If he's doing the recovery work and making the changes that he wants, then he'll probably move on to a passionate and fulfilling relationship--in his own time. Don't worry, really, because there is no need for worry at all. Recovery is a good thing, even if the marriage doesn't survive.

Bosslady, I'd like to suggest that if you have the slightest twinge of regret about not giving the marriage everything you could have then read the info pages of this site and reconsider your options. For many, it seems that the BS will always be there if the WS changes their mind. But there does come a time when it's too late. I encourage you to search your heart and search the info pages to be sure that you are making choices that you will be content with for the rest of your life.

Take care

Finally someone who truly understands when it does not work. I respect your information and will definitely think it through again although I know the answer. I am very much in love with my boyfriend and have been for two yrs and most likely when my ex husband pressured me into moving back in. I will say this, I have no regrets other than I did not want to hurt him, I made a mistake.

Thanks again for your input.