Ok - - I've been thinking and thinking about the TALK.

I'be been reading Love Must Be Tough. I need/want him to Respect me. I see very much that he doesn't. I think he (perhaps like many WS's??) sees my determined stance of wanting our M as crazy and weak, as well as just a way of keeping him from getting what he wants for no other reason other than to make his life difficult.

We all know that it wanting to save our M and the things we are all going thru is ANYTHING but weak! But, we are talking about the mind of the WS.

I posted above a draft of what I wanted to say when I inform him of the LSA being filed. I now think that we need a Talk BEFORE this,,,,,,,,, Similar to what you metioned above Mimi.

It's time for him to understand that me wanting our M does not mean that I am sitting like a subborn child in the corner refusing to let go of the toy trying to play some kind of tug of war with him.

Ok,,,,, I've been working on this post for a while. I think perhaps I was COMPLICATING something that doesn't have to be so complicated??

I have a feeling short, sweet, to the point, done with a breezy attitude is the way to go.

I am just concerned with being TOO wordy or inadvertantly giving him the impression that I will suddenly Cooperate with everything he wants.

YEP....

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Here's what I was thinking of telling him this weekend - -



I have been thinking about what you said the other day,,,, that you need me to understand you better.

I have thought about this a whole lot. Despite what you may believe, I think about your needs and trying to understand you a great deal. It’s almost all I have thought about for months.

You seem to have the idea ,(and perhaps I am wrong), that I am in some way trying to hold you in a marriage that you do not want.

That is not the case.

You are free to go.

I have learned a whole lot about what it takes to make a great marriage. I deserve someone who wants a great marriage, too.

The difference is that I WAS SETTING HIM FREE...UNTIL.. HE CAME BACK..

I DIDN'T WANT HIM UNTIL HE WANTED ME...

I didn't imply that I would find someone else..nor did I plan on finding anyone else...

I told him that I KNEW THAT he eventually would want me again...

THAT is the message I want to send!

See this is why it is so good to practice and bounce this stuff off others.

I want WS to want the OUR great marriage.

I am afraid I have just overthought this whole thing to the point that I just do not know how to say it.

Pep & Mimi - -

I don't want to tj Sis's thread or become embroiled in that discussion. However, I did want to tell you both that what you posted to Sis about having to be right rang SO true with me.

It really Helped Me, so thanks! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I know that WS views me as "having to always be right" and it is one of the things I have sincerely been working on. It's so hard to show that kind of change in my sitch. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

I think it's one of the things I have been struggling with in regards to the Talk with WS. How to convey the love I feel for him, the knowledge that we CAN have a M Better than before,,,,,,,,,,,,, without it coming across as I am Right and he is Wrong! The OLD BUGS way.

I don't want him to interpret it as DJ. Just honest truth.

That is where the Letting Go message is so Key.

How to I convey my total BELIEF in us, in him in our ability to have this Better M,,,,,,,,,,while letting him know he is free to go,,,,,,,,,,,AND COME BACK when he is ready to commit.

I know that is really the essence of the Plan B letter. I've just been feeling that BEFORE Plan B, he needs to be getting a glimpse of what is yet to come. For me to be able to show him some of this while we are still interacting for now.

Last night and this am when he called, I really kept the conversation short and sweet. He was on his way "to the bar" when he called last night,,,,,way earlier than normal as it was a Ho night. I just told him "Be careful. The kids will talk to you in the morning. Bye!"

This am he called,,, made a point to tell me he was doing something at work,,, which really CRUEL (IMO), as that makes it obvious that he spent the night with the HO. He started chatting about work, I made minimal responses, but was nice, cherry, upbeat. At the right pause in the conversation, I just said, "be careful out there and the kids will talk to you at bedtime. Bye!" Again, being friendly, but busy sounding.

Happy, friendly, but busy with my own life. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

I am still pondering the talk issue,,,,,,,,,any input is welcome.

What does he LOVE doing FOR YOU that he can DO NOW?

How about COOKING?

Is there some special recipe that he makes that YOU especially LOVE and will trigger FOND MEMORIES?

"I've been thinking about that delicious XXX that you make. Can you make some FOR ME?"

In MB terms, it's the ADMIRATION NEED that you need to show the capacity to fill.

Another thought..even in MY TALK (kind of self-concious about saying MY), I used the wording.."I WAS SO WRONG"..it was a MANTRA that I kept repeating...I think he will HEAR it if you begin to use that phrase...that was MY experience.. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Admiration is a HUGE need for WS, for sure. Will try your suggestion

Do not feel self concious about your talk! I am asking/needing to know about it as I am at the same place you were in so many ways.

I am lost feeling rather lost in my efforts.

I am letting the combo of WS adamant claims of being DONE, his INSISTANCE that I go along with the D (understand him better), and the pending LSA, really confuse me in what I need to be doing

I want to stand strong for my M,, but not have WS interpret as my having to be RIGHT.

I want to meet his needs, but do not want WS to only be angered by it. I do not want to be viewed as the crazy Bugs trying to manipulate him.

Ohhh, my mind has just become a tornado going round and round in circles!

BUGS:

What do you NEED to be doing?

Putting on your best Plan A Face. Which you have been.

As for the Talk?

When the time is right, say simply: My lawyer will be sending over the draft LSA on xx/XX Date. Please review and return to my attorney. I'm not doing a D, but as long as you remain out of the house, I need to get this taken care of.

WH: WHat! I thought, sputter, sputter, what's wrong with Bugs! your double dealing!, etc...

Bugs: I do M, not D. And the LSA protects both of us as long as you stay out of the house.

WH Sputter, Sputter...

Bugs: "Whats for dinner tonight?" or: "DS Hit a home run in Little League tonight" or "DD got a Gold Star in math" Just change the subject.

Or, draft a short cover letter for the Attorney to send on top of the LSA. No need to talk at all.

It's just another formality, and something that needs to be done because of his actions.

LG

LG - -

Ah,, the basic advice of what I call the "K.I.S.S." - KEEP IT SIMPLE STUPID! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I've just grown so frustrated with WS assuming things about me and labeling me. Typical impatience on my part. Like many here, I want to badly for WS to acknowledge my changes.

He came by yesterday to pick up DSS. Of course, just shy of being 'late'. I had left his mail on the counter,,,next to impression with a starter list of our 'stuff' to give him the I am working on "The List" he sent dividing up our stuff.

DD and I were putting away winter clothes and getting out the summer stuff. I left out a container of WS's summer things that he decided to take with him instead of going thru it there. He then took container into our room to take even more stuff with him.

THAT HURT<<< OUCH,,,,, but I didn't let it show.

Instead, hoped he'd notice the few 'choice' things I'd left laying around (short short leather skirt he bought me when we were dating that now fits again,,,,,multiple Goddess style nighties,,,my skinny swimsuits, etc).

DD and I had worked together on a book where she filled in the blanks with things about herself. She's really taking off with her ability to read and wanted to read it to Daddy.

DD and I were on one side of the bed. WS on the other, leaning over the top of his container of clothes. I helped her read while he watched/listened. We traded glances off and on. He watched her most of the time,,, and was also forced to watch me pointing to the book with my Wedding Ring on!

We finished up and he was anxious to get going. I was happy & upbeat. Looking FAB in a rather sexy shirt he had bought me some time ago. I am calling him by pet names again - - Sweetheart, honey, etc.

I had put in his mail a note,,,,I know it's not Plan A practice to bring up the R, but it was something I really felt I needed to do. It just said that I want him to know that I am not viewing myself as "right" and him as "wrong"

I apologized for being that way in our R, that I was wrong, and that I was sorry for disrespecting him. I said that I choose the path of Love,,of our M,,,and it's a path that I want the two of us to walk together.

I am not choosing this path to try to force him to do anything. It's simply my choice, as his choice will be his.

He was supposed to call DD last night at bedtime, but never did. We called him this am. He complained to me how tired he was ,,,,,,,,,,, he worked so hard last night doing laundry, dishes, and cleaning.

I WANTED VERY MUCH to point out that if he wasn't so busy with his HO, he would have had time to do that since I had the kids the entire weekend. But, I didn't.

I called him back, as I had forgotten DD has a pizza party tomorrow night to celebrate reading all of her books for the year and that I would take DSS with us.

When I got to work, I emailed him and told him that he is More than Welcome to come with us!

He emailed back,,, it's the worst day of the week for him at work so he doubts if he could make it. He asked about DSS's cell phone.

My response was "well, maybe it will be a great day and you will be able to come. I'll think positive thoughts!"

i answered his question on DSS's phone and left it at that.

So,,,,, trying to Plan A,,,,,,,,,,,,,still a little rocky in my thinking, but I keep reading up on Plan A to get in the groove!

YOU ARE DOING GREAT!!!
<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Thanks, Mimi!

The rollercoaster has felt like I've been stuck hanging upside down with all of the blood rushed to my brain - - keeping me from being able to think!

I don't want to act just on my 'emotion' of the moment, but want to work the Plan! It's hard sometimes when in the middle of it all to be able to see if I am really working it or not.

Thanks for the feedback!

I have to tell you that I have been dreading getting out my summer clothes,,,,but I figured out it was FUN!

TONS of things that were too small now FIT! It's like having a whole new wardrobe! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Of course, all of the smaller sizes are Much more Goddess like! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

WTG bugs!

Excellent plan A stuff.

Are you feeling OK about it? (Just taking your temperature on Plan A....)
Do you still look forward to interactions with WH?
Are you getting tired?

Lexxy,

I do look forward to interactions with WH,,,,,,but have more and more trepedation about them than I did before.

I am getting tired. I had set tentative Plan B date for the end of the school year, which is approaching very fast.

I have to get LSA in place. That's my #1 right now. I'd like to Plan A thru that negotiation. I don't want to file for LSA and go immediate to Plan B. That would give the message of "I have to be RIGHT and do it MY WAY".

Once LSA is in place, I will know what my options are from a financial standpoint. I will be moving. I want to buy a house in the area where I have family support (about an hour 1/2 from our current home).

If I do not get a house right away,,, I do have the option to stay with family while looking/buying. I will likely do that and implement Plan B at the same time.

It will be much easier to Plan B that way. Right now, I have almost daily interaction with WH because of DSS. I pick him up every day from sitters, along with DD. WH then comes to our house to pick him up OR I have been taking him to FIL's (WH spending more time 'at work'almost every night)

Although I hate the idea of not seeing DSS every day, it will be a fact of life I will have to face if/when WH goes to Plan D. DSS will, unfortunately, suffer a great deal without me & DD around. Breaks my heart, but is not something I can do much about. I have no 'legal' rights when it comes to him,,,, am only at the mercy of WH on that.

The thing is WH wants me to be "MOM" to DSS because it is CONVENIENT for him. My treating DSS as MY son with visitation, etc. gives WH the freedom for HO interactions. Yet, WH does NOT want me to be MOM when it comes to things like not taking DSS around her. TICKs me off!

So,,,,,,,,,,Plan A will be drawing to a close in the near future.

I am trying right now to focus on Plan A, as it is easy to be distracted/confused when thinking or reading too much about Plan B at the same time.

That poor kiddo.

I can see that you handing over 100% responsibility for DSS will definitely curtail the romance. (which is a plus)
But it is so darn awful for DSS (the minus)

And from what you describe, that little boy wants you and needs you so badly.

What a crappy situation for him. My heart just breaks for him.

Lexxy,,

Everyone I talk with about this sitch,,,,,their FIRST expression of concern is for DSS. They know that DD and I will be OK eventually, no matter the outcome with WH.

DSS, has just his Dad with some support from Grandpa & a couple of Aunts. But the day to day life,,, it's just the 2 of them and with WH concerned First and Foremost with his A,,,, DSS is at risk.

He's been abadoned by his real mother, which was tramtic enough. WH had several other R before I came into the picture. Since we have been together, he has hadthe most stability of his entire life.

I even paid the court costs and legal fees when WH went to court to legall get FULL Physical custody of DSS,,,,,,,,,,funny how WH has conveniently forgotten little details like that.

Or how I made sure he was evaluated & diagnosed with AD/HD. And I was the one that explained to him about the surgery he had to have for an undecended testicle. and on, and on, and on. YET despite all of that, my POOR relationship with DSS was one of the reasons WH had to leave me.

SORRY for the tangent there,,,,,,,,,just slipped down that slope of WH's lists of my failures. Caught myself just in time!!

Don't get me wrong,,,, WH can be a GREAT Dad. I Admire him greatly having fought for his son and having raised him alone. It's just his actions as a WH has made him less aware of the impact his actions are having on DSS.

I have requested in my LSA for DD to have no contact with the HO,,,,,,,,but nothing I can do about DSS. My lawyer tells me that it won't fly in court,,,, but I had her put it in there anyway. I have to atleast TRY. Even if it is for 6 months, to give DD some time to adjust, it will be better than her learning Daddy's not coming back one day and then having to meet his "new girlfriend" the next.

WH wil only see it as me trying to control him but that's gonna have to be too darn bad. Maybe someday he will know better.

Just dropping in to say hi and I was thinking about you...

I'm sorry to hear that things are not going so well...take care of yourself and DS...

Godspeed to peace!

Hi Strivin'!

Thx for checking in!

Just talked to WS for 20 minutes.

He is taking kids camping this weekend. This is good because they will love it. Bad because he is doing it AFTER I told him I was taking DD camping

Also I suspect Ho will be in attendance AND he acted like this just came up. FIL had already told me about it.

WS thanked me for the letter I gave him yesterday. I get the impression he took it as my way of saying that all of this is OK with me!

He said he knew it was hard for me to write. That he knows things are changing and that things HAVE changed. He wanted me to know that he 'appreciated' it

Lord is he REALLY that stupid?!

He then was mr chatty again all about work, etc

He really thinks we are going to be friends and that I am happy being his babysitter!

I just want to throw up. But, instead I have to get DD to bed. Then I will puke and cry

Oh, yeah I can see a Plan B rolling in the sunset, brillant in Bug's colors...

Can you see that he's trying to smooth the waters? Almost like if you see HOW HAPPY HE is that you'll be okay with it...

Sure you don't want to just get pi$$ed off like I was all day? LMAO

Feels better that braffing...and well, I've done my fair share of crying today but your know what I'm going to have these rings around my eyes tomorrow...How attractive?

SO, if you decide to hold off on the crying part too, I've got you covered!

I'm so sorry that he's being an donkey...

((((BUGS)))))

Well after a good cry I usually move to a really good pi$$ed off mode, so we will both be in good company either way!

Do as I do and pull out that heavy concealer in the morning! I think I should buy stock in it!

Yep- Plan B is going to be here soon. I was just thinking about how I can make it work

My concern is DSS. If I implement correctly, I run the risk of DSS feeling rejected,,,as a set schedule means less time with me and DD. If I do not do that, WH gets totally off the hook. Gonna have to think long and hard on the specific logistics

I have IC appt tomorrow, so will talk to her about it. Hope for some good ideas.

Think I will call my 'girls' over for the weekend to help clean out the attic, since WS will be out of town.

That is After confirming Ho is not camping with MY family. Thin I will call her house late Fri and early Sat to be sure she is home. If not, I may be taking a road trip! UUHH! Let's hope that is not necessary!