Rin & Mimi,

I have told Drac on several occassions we will NOT be friends if we D.

He thinks that is Wrong and Silly.

I told him, I have lots of friends, I do not need another friend, I need my H period.

So, he likely needs a reminder of that. Hard to get him to SEE the reality of that in Plan A

It will be ineteresting when he calls tonight. I won't be home but he does not know that. I am going out w/friends and staying over

Mom and I are opening a bank acct in her name w/some of my money on Sat. Gotta have it for buying new house, but Drac can not find it!

I am virtually out of time on 'the move' as I need to get a house in the school district where I want DD to go. School starts mid Aug, so I HAVE to do something ASAP

Will be talking to Steve about this, too. How to make that work with trying to save the M??

Jaded - you sound like you have a great story to tell. I KNOW you can get a lot of specific help for your sitch,,,and think you should start a thread

Everyone struggles at all points along this rocky path. Now that you have started to post, use the wonderful knowledge of others here to help you!

Bugs,

How about you don't have friends who lie to you, betray you, have low morals, character, sleep with other women, and hurt you. I don't know about you but I don't have friends that do this, at least not very long and being an ex WW or WH doesn't change that

HAP,

EGG-ZACT-LEE!

Bugs,

Just wanted to add a couple things. I was very surprised to know that Drac is only 33. To be only 33 and so easily willing to give up on a 2nd marriage, tells me that Drac does not want to do the work when things get tough. Seven years in a M is not a long time. That's why they have the "for better, for worse, richer or poorer parts in your vows. It's because that is the reality of R over time, not just M. Also, the years in having small children are always the hardest on every M, including when most A happen. You just don't have the time, energy, & patience for your R, because so much of that is devoted to being a parent. It seems that Drac may not be willing to do the work it takes through the tough times to make a R work, not with you,or IMO probably anyone. Maybe it has something to do with his childhood. When things got tough, his mom left.

Bugs, I know that you have taken responsibility for your part in your M being in the state to make it vulnerable by not meeting Drac's EN. But, don't loose sight in his part in it. He wasn't meeting yours either. If he were you would have been more than willing to meet his. That's just how it works.

That being said, Bugs, you have learned & grown so much. Meanwhile, Drac has just moved from one R to another w/out doing any work, no growing, no learning, no self reflection. It doesn't sound like he takes much responsibility for any of it. So he can't change what he doesn't own. Whatever happens, if he isn't lucky enough to work things out with you, he will carry all of his bagage to his next R. Meanwhile, you are gonna be a kicka$$ partner for someone lucky & deserving enough to have you.

One last thing, I always said when I was in Plan A, seperated, tormented and still say now through roller cos. recovery, as much as I hurt, in the end, I am so lucky that I am not wearing his shoes. In the end, no matter what, you can hold your head up high and know that you did everything possible to save your marriage and one day (it may take a long time), he will have to wake up knowing that this was his doing, his choices that brought him where he is. And GOD have pity on the poor wrench he is with, until that happens or if it never does.

jade,

That is an excellent post and covers many marriages here and not here. You are so spot on!

I've been thinking about this a lot lately as my H and I have gotten closer than ever and I have realized a lot about him...reasons for his choosing to have an affair to deal with his personal psychological issues...

Keep in mind that FOR BETTER OR WORSE includes ACCEPTING the PERSONALITY FLAWS of our spouses, not expecting them to be any different than who they are/were when we chose to marry them...

Bugs chose to marry a man like Drac and she LOVES him despite those flaws..she's not going to change him...he has to want to change on his own...

This is a time for her to walk away if she chooses to do so from the man that HE IS..I don't mean the WS..the man that HE WAS..if he comes back, he will come back a BROKEN MAN that HE WAS. His basic personality will be the same.

Well said Mimi and I for one don't think I could take my ex WW back without complete and utter remorse and repentance along with a willingness to "change" those things about herself (stinking thinking, character, values, beliefs) that could have led her to do what she did to our family. If I could not see a major, lasting and consistent change in the person she was before the affair much less the alien involved in the affair then I would not have her back.

My husband is 33 same as Drac. I'm not sure why but alot of people I've talked to when the guys hit this age are going through the same. I have been married 10 years, and he's willing to throw 12 years of us being together away like an old shoe.

I think maybe the guys mid life is hitting much earlier these days because of how many guys this age are doing the same thing.

My brother in law did it a year ago, and my cousins husband just left her and her 2 children and he just turned 33.

Who knows why, but God. We just have to realize that if we really and truly love that person it does not matter whose fault it is for the breakup. And if the marriage is worth saving then it's worth us taking the responsibility to assume full responsibility for everything.

Bugs is doing a great job getting her life in order and trying to mend the broken relationship !!!

God will fix it if and when he's ready. If we jump ahead of the Lord's will we will only reap havoc on ourselves. He will put that peace in her heart when it is time to move to plan B. Just keep it in prayer bugs.

Morning!

Just getting caught up here. It’s a yucky rainy day here and am feeling a bit sad alone at home with Drac & the kids still at the lake. They will be coming home later today.

Friday night I went out with friends from my original hometown. My friend M has a son who plays in a band and we went to see them play out. Talented young men, but they play all original music,,,most of which is not to my taste. If I can’t dance to it, slow or fast, then it’s not for me  Getting old I guess???

We had a great time. We had a nice group of about 15 people all together, most of which I knew growing up. If the music hadn’t been so loud, I would have gotten to catch up a bit with them. Oh well, will be doing that when I move back to the area soon.

Drac called kind of early in the evening. He left a vm, as I didn’t hear the phone (obviously the music was a bit loud! ) His vm said, DD called the house and got the machine, so am trying to catch up with you.

I walked outside called back and talked to DD and to DSS. Drac got on, acted like he could not hear me, asking me “where are you?”. When the connection got better, I simply said, “I’m standing outside. I’ll stand in one place and then maybe the signal will be better” There was NO signal problem when I talked to the kids?!

So we talked about their day, and he asks again “where are you”.

I AGAIN said, “I’m outside”

Drac “At home?”

Bugs “No, I’m out”

Of course, I am the light and breezy Goddess Bugs using her “It’s no big deal” voice.

He let it go and left it that we’d talk again Sat. am.

My friends and I ended up staying out til 3am! Haven’t done that in a few years! It was a great time. I slept in til after 8am, which is unusual. Had coffee with my friend and then headed off to Mom’s house.

In this area, especially at Mom’s, my phone signal is pretty spotty. I did not hear from the kids, so when we went to the bank, I had good signal and called them. Got vm, and just left a message “Hadn’t heard from you guys, so am just checking in. Love you!”

My Mom looked over at me after I hung up and say “Yuck!” and smiled.

She was referring to how VERY nice and VERY sweet my voice was in leaving the message. So, later Drac did leave a vm on the cell phone. He said they’d called the HOUSE a few times but didn’t get me??

Mom and I finished our bank business and ended up going later to check out a few houses. I am down to 2 that I like very much. Will talk to my A, she is on vacation this week. Need to firm up what my options are in getting the house. If I have to, my parents will buy the house in their name, using my money for a down payment, and then when finances are settled with Drac, will sell or transfer to me.

I have to get this done SOON so that I can get DD registered for school. I am simply out of time and with no sign of Drac making a change, I have to plan moving forward in Plan B. Drac left a message mid afternoon on the cell “Just trying to catch up with you so you could talk to the kids. We tried the house a few times.” I didn’t call back.

So, last night Drac has DD call the house first again. I wasn’t home yet, so HE called on the cell. I don’t understand why he has her call the house, but HE is on first when they call the cell? He says “Oh, you are there. Here she is”

Anyway, talked to her real quick and she said she had a sunburn. I told her to get Daddy to put something on it,,,, but I’ll bet he is not prepared with anything. Hopefully someone there has some stuff for it. Poor Baby!

So, he got on acting like he was in a big rush. Said they’d called my cell in the morning, but got a message that said something about the provider not being able to be located, which is why they left a message at the house.

I just acted like it was no big deal. Just said “Ok, no problem. Sounds like it was a nice day” He said it was. I replied, “Well, great, I’ll talk to you in the morning” I gave him back a bit of that in a rush, gotta go, attitude, which seemed to confuse him a bit.

So, that’s it. Will hear from them sometime this am on when they will be home.

I am a bit Confused as to why Drac seemed VERY curious about where I was most of this weekend. What does he care?

Gonna post this, then respond to the previous posts above,,,, some good stuff I want to acknowledge. Also, have an update on Drac’s finances that you will find interesting!

Remember Drac seems like he cares about where you are because in the "Taker" mode they have to be in control.

By not telling him where you are you are taking that control away from him. It's okay for them to have their Cake, but they want to know that we are sitting back and waiting for them to make up their minds first.

Hence the delay in the D proceedings.

You are doing it exactly right. Don't give into your taker mode, stay in the giving. You are doing great !!!!


Please check my site today if you get a chance...I could really use some input.

Thanks.

INeed,

I was just headed over to your thread to catch up!

You ARE like me, I think, in once you get your hands on some knowledge (Giver/Taker), you study it and put it into action! Thanks for the reference and encouragement!

Jaded about this -



Thanks, Jaded! This is EXACTLY what I have said several times. From the beginning, I promised myself that no matter WHAT happened, I would conduct myself in such a way that I can ALWAYS look back and hold my head high in regards to MY actions!

This is VERY important to me. It applies to what others see, but mostly to how I feel about MYSELF. I have told Drac several times, I have to be true to me, I have to do what I feel in my heart is right. He doesn’t have to agree with me.

I have a new Bonnie Rait album and love the song I Will Not Be Broken. That’s ME! Or should I say the NEW ME?



Mimi, about this,



YOU know that this has been a HUGE for me to know and finally understand/accept this. Which I think I do now.

Just a couple of other quick items to update you all on.

I am pretty sure Drac bought a motorcycle. A large envelope came last week from the company that administers our 401Ks at work. I could tell it had a smaller envelope in it.

I know Drac test drove a motorcycle a couple of weeks ago. He’d also told the kids last weekend that he and R had been out riding all day. I know they weren’t riding 4wheelers, because they are here at the house. I also know that he would not have been riding on the back of R’s bike! It was after that when Drac gave me the speech again about how I just need to accept that this is what he wants and that the D should be over by now.

So, I have access and have been tracking the transitions in his checking account. Last week 2 checks cleared for a total of $XX thousand, and there was a single deposit in that amount.

I am sure he’s keeping it at R’s house. I went by there yesterday and tried to look in the garage, but couldn’t see in.

I am keeping this knowledge to myself for now. Holding back to bring out later if necessary in the financial negotiations.

Can anyone say MIDLIFE CRISIS at 33? INeed,,,, am sure this is familiar to the examples you gave above!

I did go by the Ho’s house and verify her car was home. Couldn’t tell if SHE was really there or not.

I am really feeling Plan Bish today. Last night after talking to him, I was pretty angry. I am getting tired and as time is now forcing me to make some decisions; I am feeling better about taking things forward.

Having the full support of my friends and family in the area where I will be moving is very helpful.

My mom talked a lot about how Drac is really painting himself into a corner financially. She also talked about how very soon he is going to look around himself and wonder how things in his life got so bad. He doesn’t have any clue what he is truly giving up.

I am putting together a plan for a solid life for me and DD. Drac is planning very little, and what he does say he is planning is NOT based in reality. It is based more on his on going theme of “I want,,,”. Well, he has taught me very well that WANTING something to be a certain way doesn’t make it happen!

Rolling Stones “You can’t always get what you want”

Think I’ll go throw in a load of laundry

I am sitting here waiting for Drac to bring DSS home. He is already 1 3/4 hours later than he said and has not bothered to call

He also did not call until after 3 this afternoon to let me know they were on their way.

So, I jumped in the car and am at the store. He should pass by here taking her home.

Talked to FIL. He confirmed that Drac is spending nights away again. He also confirmed that Drac was not home Wed night AND left the house without telling FIL Mon nite after the kids were in bed.

Also confirmed that Drac bought a motorcycle. Drac did not tell FIL, guys at work asked FIL how he likes Drac's new bike! What a dumba$$! Some secret when he show it off at work, when both FIL and + work for the same company, even if it is different locations!!

I am feeling VERY VERY VERY ANGRY right now.

I have really HAD it with the total lack of respect from Drac!!

Have I done this to myself? Made him convinced that he is so D*mn great that I will just be here no matter what he does or doesn't do?!

Oh yea, it was the Ho with him Wed night. Wonder where he stashed her while taking DD to the Aunt's or if he had them go pick her up?

I do NOT want to see him tonight as I am Very afraid of what I might say!

(((((BUG)))))

Definitely time for PLAN B..after talking with Steve...

Until then, try to avoid him as much as possible...

No R talk..

No LBing..

OK?

I said a prayer before talking to Drac and the Lord held my hand thru the whole thing! I started off almost blowing it, but I pulled it out

I walked in and Drac says 'I need to tell you something, before it gets blown out of proportion. '

I waited

He says 'it wasn't planned. I swear. '

I said 'I know Ho was there'

Drac ANGRY 'how do you know that?'

Bugs 'because I am not stupid'

He was MAD. 'So, you already know before I tell you so your mind is made up on how it went! Plus YOU have that little girl TERRIFIED because of YOUR problem with S. She it scared to tell you anything about it. It is YOUR problem, not hers'!
'
Bugs 'I am sure she is upset. I am sure there are things she may not want to tell me, just like she is afraid to tell YOU things, too'

Drac ' oh really? Like what?"

Bugs 'Drac, it does not matter. You never believe anything I have to say about it so there is no point saying anything. I am sure she will tell you for herself someday,

Bugs. Very calmly. 'Drac, if the story is about you taking "her" to the lake, I don't want to hear about it. If it is about something else, I will be happy to listen'

Drac 'it wasn't like THAT. I am not seeing her. We haven't eve been talking. I did not take her.

She and her friends that always go there were at the dock and we just ran into them. It was cordial, so we agreed we could all hang out at the same cove. That's it'

Bugs says nothing.

'I KNEW you wouldn't believe me. I worried about it all weekend. I kept saying it all weekend. '


I just looked at him for a while. Letting it settle. Finally I just said ok.

He was quiet for a bit, started to say something, I just kept quiet waiting (old bugs would have been talking the whole time)

He shakes his head and says 'never mind'. So I move the talk to things I need for my lake trip. He brought me the tent and I gave him the 'that is terrific, thanks so much!'

He then says 'I KNOW how you are unhappy about our situation, and I do understand how you feel about me and Ho. I know when I thought you were seeing someone I was angry. ' (THAT is a first - he never admitted THAT before)

He then went on asking 'you hang out in the same circles, have you heard why we split up?'

Bugs 'we are NOT in the same circles'

Drac 'well, you talk to the same people'

Bugs 'yes, but I do NOT talk to them about HER'

Drac 'Well, it was because she agrees with YOU, that we should not be involved while we are still married'

Bugs rolls her eyes, 'really? Why stop when it was already done. No going back'

Darc 'well it was because it was causing issues with our kids.'

Bugs 'oh becuase you all could not take your weekend trips together'

Drac 'No, becuase you and I had a fight about it'

Bugs rolls her eyes. Drac asks what?

Bugs 'Well I am pretty sure she is playing you,m but I am NOT going to sit here and talk to you abou the ho. I am not your friend to talk to about your other relationships'.

Drac 'you know we need to get to the point where we move on with oiur lives'

Bugs 'Don't worry babe, I have that covered. You will get what you want. We'll go to court and go our separate ways, but I do not want to have this conversation now'

Drac 'you NEVER want to have this conversation'

Bugs "well, regarding a D, there is not anything TO talk about. We will go to court and it will get settled. I will go on with my life and you will go on with yours.

Is that what I want? No it is not. Do I want us to go forward together? Yes I do. Do I think we could be incredibly happy and have a great marriage? Absolutely I do!

But, you know what? If that does not happen, I will be fine. I will live a great and happy life

BUT, we will NOT be friends. Our lives will not connect. We won't swap stories or talk about our days

I HAVE friends. I don't NEED you as a Friend, I NEED you as my H'

He did not respond.

However, he did stay anotherr 30 minutes telling me all about their trip.

Left and says 'call if you need anything'

Am going to post this and THEN will add the REAL info I got from DD during her bath.

I told DD that she NEVER has to keep a secret from me ever! I asked I'd Daddy had told her not to tell me that the HO was there, she said yes.

I was very calm. We just 'chatted" all about the lake trip during which I found out all about it.

The did 'just meet' there. Ho was with her friends staying on a house boat.

During the convo, I made it clear that Drac had told me about the Ho being there and DD says 'you aren't MAD?'.

I just said 'honey, I will NEVER be mad at you for telling the truth'

So, I am doing ok with it all until I find out that DD slept with one of the girls in the cabin and she 'didn't know where the Ho slept'.

We had some confusion, but it came down to the fact that the HO came back with them to the cabin and stayed the night. Drac took her back to the houseboat this am and then they packed up and left.

I want to KILL HIM! I knew he was lying, but DAMN him!

So,,,, what do I do?

I thought of playing it real cool - asking in a TM how the boat ride was this morning, just to let him know that I know

One other thing, in the conversation Drac said 'Remember, you asked me who was going and I DID tell you eveyone. I swear'.

Bugs 'and if YOU remember, I asked you one time only. I did not grill you. I took you at your word. I believed you.

If I had not believed you, I would have made a big deal about it'

The convo included how I thought DD said they has switched cabins and I took that comment and turned it into the Ho being there

I explained 'at the time, the thought crossed my mind, but I let it go. I had TRUSTED you had told me the truth.

But, when you started off the way you did tonight, YES my thoughts immediately went there'

What I really wanted to say is that I can NOT trust you because you are a LIAR. You have proven yourself a LIAR!!


UUUGGGH.

Ok, gott dry DD's hair now

Bugs:

Plan B.

Save it Before he kills it.

Drac knew that Ho was going to be on the Houseboat, at the same cove.

Expect evil Drac in next two days.

Your the goddess, but now is the time.

(((BUGS)))

LG

I know it's time.

I still have the question - Do I let him know that I know?

I just want to strangle him for what he did.

AND

For thinking I am STUPID!

AND

For the whole play tonight. Being nice, friendly Drac. It would have been easier if he'd been Evil Mean Drac tonight.

Why did he not just walk away after telling me the lie!

Why sit there and have the whole talk about the details of the weekend? Why sit there and listen to my Mantra yet again? He KNEW what I would say. And after what he'd done and after standing there lying straight to my face AGAIN, he let me say it!

b/c he got a fix. The FOG is nice and thick again. You know how thick the FOG gets at the Lake.

Sorry about all this Bugs. I was one that thought you were gonna Plan A his sorry a$$ all the way back home. Unfortunately, HO is a PRO and knew just when to resurface.

After you give him the letter, report to the Killer Bee thread to register and receive your gear.

Good Luck