Rin,

I will do more research on narcisism. I do know my WH is very controling. Had to have his hand in everything. Never wanted to let anyone else do something because they wouldn't do it right.

I remember on night I was makng cookies and putting the batter on the cookie sheet and he came up behind me and rearranged the cookies!!! I mean come on.... and I wonder why at times I feel insecure about my choices.

My friends couldn't understand why he had to have a say in the curtains I picked out. Not because of price but because he wanted to approve of the design.

I mean this man would notice if a piece of furniture was slightly out of place and ask why... I do move furniture to vacuum.

No one could do something as well as he could... at least in his own mind.
Now why do I want that back... he won't change because he thinks nothing is wrong with him.

Vent over...sorry Rind for doing this on your thread.

Hope you have a great day today.

Still

Morning, I didn't sleep well last night! I have to recenter...

I just feel really stressed since yesterday...just need to pull myself up today...

You know it's hard when you start feeling lonely...and there's no one to call b/c you've had to give up all the friends that you had...

Seems like they are beliving STBXH and his great appearance...this also explains why I rarely got presents...didn't get anything for our Anniversary this year....V-day...only got something for Christmas because he thougth he was getting something expensive from the jewerly store...nothing for my b-day, mother's day...

Last Christmas I got my laptop, benefitical to him, and a pair of diamond earring...when I found out about the A, I asked him if that was the only reason I got that stuff for Christmas...b/c he was feeling guilty...he said no, that he thought I deserved something nice...

All the blaming...he even said once that he knew that he had a problem with blaming others...didn't stop him...

I guess it's trying to make sense of it all and perhaps this one time there is no sense to be made of the sitch...just accept and move on...grieve my loses...

Then, as much as I don't want someone new in my life right now...I crave it...having SF dreams...I don't ever remember that happening...

Just needing someone to lean on...if I stick with my orginial thought that I'm Med until the final date of D...HAHA...then it's going to be one long year...I guess it's a matter of wanting to know that I'm loved by someone b/c my reality of being loved by STBXH has been scattered...

That's a huge OUCH for me...to think that he never really loved me at all, that I was a pawn in his game to get whatever it was that he wanted...that alot to soak in...

personally, I don't think that I have a problem with my self-esteem...I mean I could afford to lose the weight I gained this past year, but for the most part...I'm pretty, smart, and have alot going for me...

It's a mess, really it is...strong, yes...a fighter/survivor...he!! yeah...

LOL...I had a mental imagine Still of you helping me off the floor...LOL...So I'm up, just a little weak in the knees!

Then, I'm having to revisit the idea of auto insurance...which he is suppose to be paying for...if I go and get my own and he doesn't, my name's on the truck...if he has a laps in insurance, then I think that we both get flagged on our license...

I'm thinking that the best way to avoid this is to just transfer the autopay to my account..he'll have to pay me back for this b/c he had to pay for it according to the courts...not to mention IC...

By the time that we get to court, he's going to be into me for a small fortune...no help supporting the kids...I'm doing that!

So, Frog, like I mentioned before I'm not worried about supposing myself...I'm doing it...

I'm handling my business! LOL, like a real, LIVE woman! LOL

Thanks Still, I'll check out that song...last night I downloaded two new songs to my cell...STBXH is paying the bill, I thought what the he!!...

I'll be around...taking care of business here and nosing around MB...

Rind,

We can help pick each other up off the floor. I know you have done it more times than I can count for me. There are going to be days like this, the only thing I can think of is to try to get through little portions of the day at a time (like CJ recommends)

I can relate to about SF... I miss that so much. It has been about 15 months fro me. And when he was home when ever I tried to initate he would just tell me no or move my hand away. That fact that there isn't anyone there to comfort or even kiss and hug you. I miss the physical contact.

I too think about how long should I wait. There are times that I think well he's doing it why can't I. But I am still married. I don't know how long I can go after the D. I know I need time to heal and all but I've been without for sooo long. I don't think I could go a year or two.

Rind have a great day today... and think of your friends here whenever you feel like you're being pulled down.

Still

Rin,

IMVHO the idea for not dating until after the D is to make sure you fix your Picker.

You have a sponsor, who loves you. You have the people here who think you are great.

The SF part truly would kill me too but I think I could figure something out on my own. LOL.

Each day is a challenge. Even if you weren't getting a D it is a challenge.

But you can handle it if you keep your head about you. Which I know you will.

Wow.... Umm.. reality check here... I think that IC is carrying you away a bit too far there.

make that a LOT too far.

Usually, it's the WS claiming "I never loved you"... and they're not usually right about it either.

S4B,

I gotta go with Techie on this...and advise caution. No true professional makes a diagnosis of a patient they haven't even spoken with.

Also, the link to the definition of a narcissist that SlimJim posted on Slick50's thread was the best I've ever read...no lists...shows the progression...which begins with living externally.

I definitely saw my narcissistic traits in that description. Truly eye-opening.

If you're gonna label someone that way, include me.

And it's YOUR choice to believe your WH loves you...or not. Always was and will be your choice. Choose to believe he did, does and will...because "not feeling loving" isn't not loving.

You know that.

Watch the self-stabs and do the deep breathing. You're worth it. You can do this.

LA

LA,

Could you put a link to that post because I know there are alot of us that would be interested.

Rin,

I agree... I'm sure your WH does and did love you. Your whole marriage wasn't a lie. There was love there at one time. We have to believe that or what is that saying about us for loving them?

Still

I would agree with Techie as well.

IMVHO sometimes what we think we hear isn't what was said.

Even the most broken person loves in most cases.

Maybe with his problems it isn't healthy love.

I could maybe buy into he loves/loved you but in my professional opinion it is not what most would define as love.

Frog- I think I can handle my own easier when I get back into my houes!

Techie- Thank you for point that out...it was a hard concept for me...MOF, I was thinking about the time him and BF made plans for a dinner cruise...mostly BF's idea...it was V-day...they called my boss and arranged for me to get off the day before and we drove to MS...

It was a surprise...about six or seven years ago...

IMHO, things started going downhill when I got PG for L...

LA- I would also like the link...I tried looking for it but am having some trouble...

Then, we can take the symbolic coffee from the HO store...in his own way, he was showing love...so, I do have to agree with you guys...

I was thinking earlier today..."I might not like this IC, but I guess I should go to more than one session to determine that!"

From what I've read, he's not extreme in his behaviors...even with the abuse...but I can look back an see progression...

I think yesterday was just really emotional for me...I think you all know how I feel about IC to begin with...I was really nervous

I going to have to remember to do what I do here and in AL-Anon...take what I like and leave the rest...

Thanks for keeping me in check!

OKay, I've been looking for that link and can not find it...

A little help please...LOL

as far as IC's go...
I think one session is all it takes, to figure out what they are like.

it sounds like this "individual counsellor", boosts your "individuality", by setting you up targets of other people to resent, and blame.

Hey, it "works"... it sure strengthens one's sense of self. but...

Did you look behind the milk?

I find a lot of stuff behind the milk..not always good

Rin,

IC's are not always right and they are not always right for you.

When I was looking for one, I called around. YOu know there were some that when I heard their answering machine I knew I didn't want them.

Didn't like their voice or the way they talked.

I know it sounds stupid but you really need someone that you can talk too. Do not pick someone and stay if something doesn't seem right.

HEck you are there because something doesn't seem right and now you are talking to someone that you can't open up to etc.

Sometimes ask what do you mean? There are times they may be saying something and then you think you know the meaning but you don't.

You will do great. Stop reading all the books for a while, sit back and relax.

If you are going to read a book make it one about what to do in your state that is free and fun.

I am going to a civil war reenactment this weekend with my family that we didn't even know existed for the last 15 years lol.

HI techie,

I think I'm going to have to treat this like my meeting...take what I need and let the rest..

I'm going to give her a shot...I mean it is free the next two times...not hurting to try...

I think that first session was so dificult because I had to start from childhood to present...THAT is a lot to deal with...

I don't need to revisit all that stuff...not going to change anything...what's done is done...

I have identified my part in my M...I can look back and say to myself I could have handled this or that better...I could have been a better mom in this area...

I believe that regardless of the person my STBXH is I still had 50 percent of the M...had I known what was going on at the time I could have made better choices...

I can't exactly do what my STBXH is doing and blame everything on him...I have a moral issue with that!

BC-the milk...let me see...

Hold on...

Wait....

No, NO, it's not there either!

maybe the dryer...will you check? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Here are the links LA was referring to (I think):

Slick50's Thread--SlimJim's response on pg. 15
The Mind of the Narcissist
Do Narcissists Have Emotions
Narcissist vs. Psychopath

These articles are all written by Sam Vatnin. He is a Doctor, but he has a doctorate in another area and is not a psychologist or psychiatrist. HOWEVER, he is a leading expert on Narcissism.

So there ya go! Read! Learn! Enjoy! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Your faithful friend,


CJ

(Edited to add) May I politely point out that it is unusual and someone unthinkable for a counselor to "diagnose" someone sight unseen, having never met the person. However, I suspect that you counselor was trying to say that BASED ON WHAT YOU HAVE DESCRIBED SO FAR that your STBX sounds like he may have Narcissistic tendencies. Please note, that is WAY different than diagnosing Narcissistic Personality Disorder!

Also, I want to point out that every human being has SOME Narcissistic traits...so if you see some of those traits and go, "Wow--*I* do that!" don't freak out on yourself. I think what makes it a disorder is when there are most/all of the traits at the same time, and it is extreme. For example, at times I think of myself and think, "I love me!" which could be considered grandiose--or I behave a bit selfishly...but I don't use others to promote myself, nor do I think I'm above the law, etc. Does that make sense?

found a sock....no link

The links were on top of the refrigerator!

GEEZ!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" /> Who put them there????




<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

LMAO

That explains it! I'm 4'11"...I CAN'T SEE UP THERE!

Hey Rin, you've got my FWW beat by an inch. She is 4'10". (maybe 4'10 1/2 on a good day) <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I'm 4ft. 10in., and my whole life I have wanted to hit 5 feet tall!! Rin--who knew that we were peanuts together1

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

BTW--did you see my post on the bottom of page 25? I really did find the links.