Very cool, Sadmo. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Just checking.

No problem.
<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
It just is all of a sudden so clear to me, that I do not need to have a man around to "make it" with my kids.

That was my biggest fear: That I would fail my kids. That I would be so impatient with them, that I would not enjoy them.

But now that time has passed, and I have mourned the loss of my R most of the way (I think) I am ok with the kids. We go out on my off days, I take them places, we planted flowers, we visit people.

It has been good.

The ONLY thing in my life that is suffering is my house. Which is AMAZING. I used to be SO ANAL about having a CLEAN HOUSE. And that was actually one of the things that annoyed WH. Now here I am, I had a weekend off, one of the things that I had on my list was to clean the house.... and did I? Nope. I had fun. I picked the kids up from WH's house, he grilled out so I did not have to cook, (YAY!) and me and the girls took a long walk with the dogs. Then we went to the park. We then watered plants outside, and laid on the grass and watched the sun set through the clouds. It was great. My little girls have such funny little personalities. It amazes me.

I sometimes look at them at think, "Wow. How could I have been so stressed out when WH left? My girls are amazing!" Then, of course, they start fighting, or whining.... But they are my little angels.
<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

I just see that I can do it, I have faith in myself, and it has given me peace. That I am going to be ok. Me and my girls, and my dogs, and cat. We are fine. And it is great. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Well today I get an interesting phone call from WH. He was chit chatting about this and that, then his friend called his cell phone (He has the walkie-talkie thing on it) He asked if I minded if he answered. I said no.

His friend is talking about some girl problem, my WH is telling him what he should do, how he should be faithful to his girlfriend, or she will get burnt, "just like he (WH) did." MY WH was talking about his R with OW! I could not believe it!

He comes back on the phone, and is telling me how his friend is so stupid that if you are exclusive, and it is decided by both of you, then you should be faithful.

I was like, "WTF??????" So I say, "well, I guess that you changed then." He said, "well, we have not been together for almost a year, I told you that I have no intention of ever getting back together with you, I have been fair in telling you this. We had our last hurrah the other night. We can still hang out, but I will not be introducing you as my wife, ex-wife, or anything."

I was kind of shocked. SO I say, "what is all of this about?" And he tells me, (now this is STUPID) "you know when you went up to the bar when I was talking to that LESBIAN couple (which I KNEW) and asked where your drinks were (WH was buying all of us a round, and his one friend told me to ask where our drinks were- because he was talking to these chicks for a LONG time. I said it with a smile, and left) HE then continued, "well one of the chicks said, "man, is she jealous or WHAT?" and then he realized. He could not be with me. He did not want to. He could never be happy with me.

I was like "WHAT????" I was not jealous at all!

So I say, "what are you getting at?"

He says, "I just want to make it PAINFULLY clear. I do not want a R with you, I do not want to ever be with you again. I do not want you to get the idea that if we are getting along, that I am getting feelings for you.If we are hanging out, having fun, doing whatever. That is not the case. I want to let you know that if I start seeing someone, or if you start seeing someone, that it is not fair to the other person. I want you to realize that we can hang out, do whatever, but it will be with NO EXPECTATIONS ONLY. That we will hang out, but we will NEVER be back together. If I meet someone that I want to date, I WILL date them. If you are OK with that, then we can hang out more, AND DO WHATEVER."

So I say, incredulously, "DID I ASK YOU TO HANG OUT MORE? Did I say that I wanted to?"

He said, "No. I just wanted to lay down the ground rules for if we hang out. I got to thinking that you may have thought that things were getting better, and I might change my mind. I just wanted to clear that up. We are two people that should not be together. Also, if you wanted to go out with me next weekend, that would be fine, but I am just letting your know."

So I say, "I did not know that you thought I was hanging out with you next weekend, but I wasn't going to.That is fine. Don't worry about it. I hear you, and I understand completely. Just do not think that I AM going to be your friend. I told you that. I am not going to be your "go to girl" whenever you are down, or upset, or needing a hug or a talk. That is over then."

He told me that I am being silly, but he understands that if that is what I need TO GET OVER HIM. Blah, blah, blah. He will be here for me if I need him to. But if he is short with me, or whatever, it might be because he is with someone that I may not want him around, and he does not want me being mad....Oh, that if he ever calls me again, sad, or needing to be cheered up he WANTS me to tell him that I am not going to listen to him.

I actually got SAD. I started silently crying. He did not know. I just could not believe that he was trying to set me up in the "fall back girl" position, and that he actually thought that I would go for it. Even though he acted OK with it when I said no.

It makes me sad that he thinks so little of me that he would put me in the category of "friends with benefits". I know that that is what he was getting at. He was trying to get me to be cool with it all.

I am not cool with it. I could not be cool with that. It is not me.

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />

So he got off the phone, telling me, "look I am sorry I hurt you so bad, how about we talk more about this tonight when I call to tell the girls goodnight? Ok? You sound a little upset, but don't be. Try to enjoy your girls, and do something fun with them. Maybe even cut the grass. It looks like it might need to be cut."

I told him that I was fine, and I was capable of figuring out what to do on my own.

So I guess that I will just stop talking to him now, or having any kind of needless contact with him (like when he calls to chit chat like he did yesterday when he had the girls). There is really no point. He did not seem mad. I was trying to be nice until I filed on Thurs. So he would be agreeable to everything. But, now with this attitude of his, maybe it is just best that I just check his azz to the curb now. Not meanly. Just silently. And be done with it.

Friends with benefits, HA! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />

I just cannot believe that he thinks so little of me that he would think that I was pathetic enough to go along with it! I am annoyed with myself that I let him believe that.

I obviously need work on setting boundaries. I seem to not be able to efficiently enough, or I am just being a big huge doormat.

Am I still in my own married fog, trying to do what I can to keep the peace?

He even said today, "if you do not like how you are being treated by me, then don't have anything to do with me!" This was said after I said that I did not want to have the kind of friendship with him that he wanted.

I am just disgusted that he is making me do the dirty work... again.

I had to tell him that he either had to shape up or leave. I then practically threw him out of the house.

I had to take care of all of our marriage responsibilities (kids, house, dogs, yard, etc.) with no help from him. And that was because I "kept him away with my attitude"

I am the one that has to file for the divorce, even though HE is the one that wanted it for a LONG time. He should have filed a long time ago!

He is making me terminate our 'friendship' so that it is easier on him. He is going to say whatever he can think of to get me upset, since I have not been getting upset, so that he will not have a 'reason' to keep getting along with me.

What a FLIPPING COWARD. It really gets my Goat. Which would be nice to have, since my backyard REALLY needs to be cut. Oh well. Just had to vent.

WOW!!

To quote George W in one of his finer moments.

"What a Major League A$$ Hole!!"

Why do all waywards have the same brain. FM wants to be bestest buddies so she can brag about how good her R is with her Ex. You know, b/c it's so adult like and responsible. She's also proud b/c she's decided that her new OM won't get to know DS like the first one did b/c that was her biggest mistake with OM1. Well isn't she the mature responsilbe adult who's getting ready to shack up with OM2 10 months before her D is final.

Sorry Sadmo, They're just a bunch of Fn idiots. Nothing we can do about it.

Well, almost nothing.

I did something, not sure if it was right, not sure if I care.

F it!

BC-
I hope you are not telling me to F him????? LOL!

He tried the whole, "let us be able to talk about this and that, and how much he loved OW (after she DUMPED HIM!!!)"

And I, I was being immature, and silly. Because I need to learn how to 'grow up' and deal with 'adult things'.

Grrrrr. I guess that I am just not 'cool' enough for his stupid azz.

SO he calls, to tell the kids goodnight. They were in the tub, so I answered. He was all SUPER CHIPPER and in a GREAT MOOD. I was not saying anything. He then said, "OH, what is wrong with you now? We can be nice and be friends."

Wow. I AM a doormat!

So I say, "tell me one thing that you are proud of about yourself. One behavior that you are proud of." He asks why. It tell him that I just want to know.

His answer:

I am proud that I started to play my guitars again, and I have been putting music together.

So I say, "Ok. If you were to die tomorrow, THAT is what would be on your mind. That you played your guitars."

He said, "No. That I was a GREAT father."

I said, "Oh, a great father, huh.?"

He said, "Yes. I am a great father. My kids are the most important thing to me."

I say, "oh, they are?"

He says, "YES THEY ARE! I spend JUST AS MUCH TIME with them as you do! How can you say that I don't!!!"

I say, "Every second weekend you have them, every Wed. from 4-8, and the other weekends you watch them while I work. Does not seem equal, does it?"

He says," So, what is the big deal! You get every second weekend to do what you want, just say the word, and I will take custody!"

So I say, "NOOOOOO. I just wanted to know how you were a great Dad, that was all. I did not complain about having the kids."

He hung up on me.

He called back, and apologized. He gave me the, "we should be friends for the kids' speech.

I told him no, I would not choose a friend like him. As far as I can see, I do not agree with a lot of the choices he has made in life, he does not act like he cares about me, He is NOT my friend at all. Therefore I will not be able to be his friend since I do not respect a lot of the decisions that he made in our lives.

Silence. Then "What do I have to do to prove to you that I care about you as a friend?"

I said, "It is not what you have to do now to prove to me, it has to do with what you represent to me. You are not someone that I would choose to be friends with, how you are now, with no family values. So I am choosing to not be your friend. You offered me 'friendship' but we both know that is not what you wanted.

He said, "I DO care about you! I do care if we are friends! I DO value you!"

I say, "No, I am saying that you have chosen a path to go on, a path that I do not respect, nor understand. I do not see why we need to be friends.

At this point I started to cry. Why? Because I was sad that I married, and had kids with, such a loser. A person that I do not respect. It breaks my heart that I had such poor judgment. Respect, loyalty, honesty. Things that I admire in a person. I remembered talking to a woman not 2 years ago. She was upset, her husband cheated on her. I confidently thought to myself, "Wow. At least I KNOW that I have a good respectable man."

And now it is not true at all.

So he asked why I started to cry, said that he was sorry he upset me.

I told him that I was sorry that I could not be his friend, that I do not respect him at all. I need to respect my friends. I need to believe my friends.

He said, "we can talk tomorrow more. Don't be silly."

I said, "I am not going to talk to you tomorrow about this. You made up your mind, I made up mine. There is nothing to talk about."

He said, "FINE. It would be better for the kids, but that is fine. Be ridiculous if you want!"

And he hung up.

And I felt sad. I felt sad that I do not respect him. I do not trust him. I do not love him. I do not think he has any integrity. He is not loyal.

All traits that are good (in my opinion).

And I realized, it is for the best that we do not stay together. How could I be with someone that I do not respect? I can't. And that was my problem with him a year ago. And it is no better.

I feel that I failed myself. That I picked a no good loser. I failed my kids. That I picked a loser.

At least now I can set up boundaries, to protect myself, and my kids if needed. And it will be fine. I just am in awe of what a loser he is. In total awe.

It is better for the kids if you are civil. That has nothing to do with being friends.

If the kids aren't a good enough reason to work on the M, them why is it so important that you be friends b/c of them.

Apparently, the kids have absolutely NO weight in his decision making and he's using them to try and continue his cake eating ways.

I'm sorry that you are having to deal with this [email]cr@p.[/email]

I understand the feeling of failure, but we're not failures. We're successes. We get it. We're gonna be fine.

All I can send you is love and support. and you know, the jokes.

Hope you feel better tomorrow.

BC-

Thanks!

I am sure that I will feel better tomorrow.

I was just frustrated at what a loser he is.

Looking forward, not back!

He is babbling because you found a nerve and pinched it. He may eventually apologize. Let him. He needs to.


The Ws is 90% azz, 10% brain and NO heart. What a scary creature. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />

L.

I've been following your story for a while and I really only have one thing to add.

You really need to respect yourself. You seem to have no self respect or any self esteem at all.

You need to realize that you are worth FAR FAR more than you think you are.

It is this reason that you have continued to allow yourself to be walked on by a person who currently isn't worth the shoes he's wearing.

Lift your head high know that you did everything possible to save your marriage to someone who doesn't want to be married.

Now you just need to work on loving yourself enough to realize you deserve better.

Please don't allow him to suck you back into his web. Because he will. And based on your past patterns (at least from what I can read), because you desire to make your marriage work, you will allow yourself to be used again.

Please don't let that happen again. You are worth so much more.

May God grant you peace during this time of turmoil.

Sadmo, do you see now why I wanted you to cut him off awhile back?
Cut him off now. DO NOT FALL FOR THE NEXT PUSH-PULL BIT HE DOES WITH YOU.
Get those papers filed ASAP Thursday. He has not paid at all for what he has done and its time he felt the real world.

PS-
I do not think that it is that I do not have self respect, or self esteem. I really don't. I think that what it is with me is that my brain just can't seem to totally wrap around the fact that he is NOT my H. He is just a WH.

I don't know what that would be, but I do have self esteem and respect for myself. With everyone else.

I just got so carried away with wanting to give our M every chance... I did not marry lightly. And it bothers me that I chose to spend my life with someone who did not feel the same way.

I think that I was giving him every chance in the world so that I would KNOW. Know if he had changed, know if he was now a total selfish person.

But like I said, I told him the other day that I have no reason to be friends with him. He is not even friend material for me. It was kind of like a 'wow' moment.

He has his issues of whatever he has to deal with himself. He is just going to repeat the same patterns with whoever he decides to 'date' next.

Whereas I am still working on me more.

It was almost like the other day that I saw that he is who he is NOW. I do not see him turning back. And I was hurt that he just thought that I would go with the whole 'friends ' thing... and that hurt my feelings that he even would SUGGEST it to me. And I saw him totally for what he was: A selfish, uncaring, world revolves around me type of man. And it was a sad sight to see.

With everyone else I have self respect, I think that I have decent self esteem. With him I was just a pile of clay. He could mold me to suit his purposes. He would throw out a line, I would jump. But I do not want to do that at all. I have not wanted to do that at all.

I just get HOOVERIZED by him. But if he tries to talk to me about anything other than the kids, I am not going to respond, and then get off of the phone. I will not have to see him until this weekend when he watches the kids, so I should be ok.

Thanks for the input. I feel apprehensive about Thurs. I am sure that it will be stressful. But soon there will be a light at the end of the tunnel!

Well, he called to talk to the kids tonight. My D answered. So she talked and talked and my younger D 'talked'.

She gave me the phone back. I said, "Ok, well, goodnight then."

He said, "Is there something wrong?"

I told him no, just that I was busy.

He then asked if he could pick up the girls after work tomorrow. He has been having a lot of fun with them.

I said sure.

Which is great. My one friend called to see if I wanted to go out to dinner, I did not have anyone to watch the kids, and now I do! So that is good.

I am supposed to have an 'agreed on' child care setup for tomorrow. As of now, it is every second weekend, and every Wed. 4-8.

The girls love him to death. He is good with them (except when he brought them around the OW).

I do not want to say, "NO, the agreed time is ONLY on this and this day."
I feel like I would be depriving them of their dad, and they would be happier if he spent more time with them.

So should I be flexible with it? Or do you think that he is just trying to 'snare' me again... with a show of being mr. wonderful dad (which I will admit, makes me feel nicer to him.)

This is just so hard sometimes. Trying to be 'fair', without being a doormat, trying to not 'ruin' the kids, trying to do what is best for the kids, when sometimes it would be SO EASY to hurt him, by withholding them from him.

But, I am not that type of person, I told him from the get-go that I would never do that. It just is hard sometimes.

Being too flexible sends a message that you are wishy washy.

I realize you want him to enjoy the kids but as long as he is being a WS, that's just a ploy to get you t/b what he wants and for him NOT t/b controlled by what is right.

IMHO, you should stick to the schedule and keep yourself and the children busy.

L.

Orchid-
Thanks. I have been a wishy washy woman with him for too long.

And you know what is sad? Is that I am going to feel mean if I do not let him see the kids as often as he wants to.

That my kids are going to be sad, and upset (mainly DD4, who worships her Dad) if they do not see him as much.

But I see what you are saying. He would not agree to have any other set time with them, therefore, he should not be allowed any other times to see them. He had his chance.

Makes sense.

The WS does not make being nice or good easy. Instead the WS taunts the BS and family and wants to invoke guilt to sustain their selfish course.

Look deep and long term. Would it be better for the children to placate the WS' attitude or better to keep the values and respect for them in honor so that the WS is NOT allowed to control the interaction with you and the children to feed his Ws ways?

Think long term.

L.

HI Sadmo, I just wanted to throw in a comment or two here...

Please don't allow him to speak to you the way that he is in regards to comments like:

" Be ridiculous if you want!"

"Don't be silly."

This is giving you room to doubt yourself, accept his POV!

repeat after me: "THis may be your POV, but mine is different, please do not call me silly or whatever"

You know that you are not being silly or ridiculous...create a boundary and don't allow yourself to hear these kinds of things...

Just a thought floating around in this little head of mine...take what you like and leave the rest!

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

Outside of that, how could I not agree with Orchid? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Sadmo, how did today go?

Worried about you.

Mojo-
Thanks for asking.

I am ok. I just kind of have been hit with the "it is over". Which is kind of sad.

Do I want to be married to someone that acts like he has been? NO.
It just is a little sad. It affected me in the manner that I got testy, I have been on edge. It is like, "wow. So much time spent with someone, and it did not matter to them."

Felt a little sorry for myself. I am sure that that is natural. Chickened out a little. I did not say where to send his papers. Work? Home? I got flustered. The paralegal told me to call her when I had decided. Then I can finish.

Honestly? I feel like I am in a fog. I feel almost like a little kid.... "I am not going to deal with it, someone else will have to!!" But, I know that that is not the case.

Then I have WH... trying to "snare" me.

He came to the house last night, after I was sleeping. My dogs (love them!) went crazy, woke me up, I went to the front door, looked outside, and there he was. At midnight. Sitting on the steps.

I opened the door. Asked him what was going on. He said nothing. Then he just sat there.I asked him again, and he said that it had been a boring night, his one guy friend that he was going to hang out with left early, and he didn't know.
So I said, "either come in, sleep on the couch or go home. There is no sense in you sitting there." He looked at me, all grateful, and said, "thanks Sadmo."

I went in the house, and I went to bed.

I know what it is. He is feeling a lot like I am. "is this the right thing to do? Is this really what I want?"

I know it is. But he will not admit it.

And you know what is bad? Is that I do not have any interest in dating at this point. Any interest in any of that. And it makes me kind of just want to leave things alone. But the reason that I want to leave things alone is that I do not want to deal with it. And I have to. It is just hard.

And I am feeling a little sad. Tomorrow is fathers day, and we will not do our usual thing. (a big cookout). I am having the cookout, but it is just for my dad. My Grandfather will not be there, my WH will not be there. And it is depressing me a little.

Just been a little down. It will pass.

On a bright note, my SIL told me that she is so happy whenever I tell her about all of the fun I have been having with the girls, my friends. She said that she thinks that the happiness that I have now is what my WH was chasing after (family, friends, fun) but that he went about it in a bad way, and that she does not think that he is happy at all in the way that he WANTS to be. And I tend to agree.

So that is what is going on. Me in a fog, testy, a little down. But, I am fine. I have my girls, my house, my friends, my job, my dogs. It is good.