Another 2 days... the same day she leaves..sheesh <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Hang in there Dev....

Still

Thanks. Actually I'm ok now. My sis was worried about me and asked me last night how I was taking this. I told her that since I'd made the decision that I couldn't change things on her end, and that I could only change ME, it was like a burden off my shoulders. Its like I relieved myself from my self-imposed duty of making this marriage work, at any cost.

Now I'm trying to figure out what my approach shall be after she moves out. I think a lot will also depend on what I find as I look through her phone records in 2 days time.

Bump for more opinions... anyone else can advise me as to my approach after she moves out?

Well, since you told her this:


It sounds like you'll have to allow her to make some contact with you (unless you plan on keeping her from her stuff or finding an alternate to let her in and take her calls.)

That pretty much kyboshes any chance you have of an effective Plan B.

Don't cha think?

Mys

*slaps himself on the forehead*

Hmmm, I can always say I've thought about it and she's free to come in during lunchtime to get her stuff, since she has the car. I won't change the locks unless she decides she wants to call it quits after enough time thinking it through.

What do you think? Better to seem resolute and not do a good plan B, or appera wishy-washy but do a good plan B?

Oh, I think at this point you're stuck with it for at least 30 days. Chalk it up to "Another lesson learned in thinking before I speak." and make the best of it. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> *nudges you playfully*

Flip flopping again is just not a good idea.

Let's talk about what Plan A might look like while she's out of the house. What do you think her needs are going to be during that time? *hums the jeopardy song*

Mys

Thats a tough one mys.. she's going to stay over at her best friend's place, and I know they have a whole lot of events lined up (like a party this Friday to celebrate her b'day early at a local club) and other stuff like shopping sprees, planning for a trip to Bangkok in May (I have tickets too bought earlier, but won't be going now).

No idea if she will hook back up with OW, or if she already has for that matter. So many unknowns. We pretty much agreed to give each other space so me contacting her will be a sign of weakness on my part and she may just think i'm being clingy or something.

I really have no idea what her EN's will be like during this period and it will be certainly be impossible to fulfill them as she's staying far away and I'm most likely not welcome at her best friend's place <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

She'll try to pack as much stuff as she can think of so she "won't have to come back and arrange for a time for me to be home" (she was annoyed when she said this).

Should I do a pitch dark plan B when we had agreed beforehand that I would give her time to think and consider the M?

I've made a mess of this, haven't I?

Right. There's nothing you can really do to stop her from seeing OW if that's what she decides to do.

I think the best thing you can do is focus on doing something, anything else, but your relationship, what she's doing, how she's doing, etc.

If I were you, I'd stick to the 30 days thing but then make your preparations for a Plan B after 30 days if she's not willing to come home -- and it sounds like you're not particularly expecting her to decide to come home at that time.

That means, don't mention anything early, but when the time comes: she either comes home or moves all the way out. Meanwhile, work on outside interests and .. about 10 days before the deadline, start working on your Plan B letter.

Right now, Plan B and a Plan B letter will be an empty gesture because you're sort of stuck because you have all her stuff. Flip flopping around at this point and asking her to remove her stuff is just going to reinforce that you don't stick to your agreements and that you're too mecurial to build a life with.


Right.

I think your best bet is to act like you're moving on -- you're busy. If she calls for stuff, don't be too difficult but don't jump at the chance to see her either work her into your schedule when it's truly convienent for you. But, when you do see her, you want to be pleasant and upbeat. Instead of asking her about what she's doing -- you should start telling her about something interesting YOU DID. Find something interesting to talk about so that you can keep yourself from trying to find out what she's doing/done.


Not yet. I think it would have been better if you had arranged things so that you could go to a dark, dark Plan B when she left. I won't lie.


Oh, I wouldn't say you've made a mess of it. I do think it was a mistake to tell her that you were changing the locks when you did. I wish you'd done a better Plan A -- meaning one without all the relationship pressure.

I think your best bet right now is to show her a consistent strong, disciplined man who says what he means and means what he says.

Mys

Thanks mys, it really makes a difference getting a 3rd party's perspective on this... I think I'm sometimes so confused that I make a mess of things cause I'm either not able to keep my emotions in check else I act out of impatience...

Just a quick one: Tomorrow or the day after I'm going to get access to her phone records. She has said she has had NC apart from one time last week when OW showed up at her office and talked with her colleague. I somewhat don't believe her. Close to every day, she has been clearing her text messages inbox and sent items folders, and sleeping with the phone next to her, none of which were common pre-A. I really do suspect that they may be starting to meet up or at least talking again.

If the phone records show that she has been calling her, should I confront her about it? I don't know if she's still lying to me, and the not knowing is the hardest part.

Well, it depends on how well you can keep focused and your emotions in check if you do it.

Let's just assume you discover contact:

I think it's important that you let her know, each time, that contact is hurtful to you. I'm thinking of something like: "I was sad/hurt to see that you called/texted/contacted OW." THEN DROP IT.

I think it's also important that you, somehow, manage to keep that from becoming one more "permission" for you to try to manipulate her with your anger (give her a guilt trip) or turn back on the relationship pressure.

You would be better off, IMHO, letting one instance slide without telling her how hurtful it is, then letting the last real interaction with you before she goes off to consider the relationship be a massive LB fest -- particularly since you have a tendency to grandstand and say things you regret later when you get upset. Then, you flip flop it around and change your mind and that is just not doing you any good.

Given your present emotional state, I'd probably skip it. I might not even look until after she was gone if I were you since there's not going to be much you can do about it if she is contacting OW.

You do have to let go. You keep acknowledging that she has choices with your words but your actions still seem to indicate that you are trying to hold on to some control of her actions through vigilance. It's almost like the magical thinking of a child warding off monsters -- if we leave the light on then they can't come get us.

Look, devastated, right now she's not committed to the marriage. You are right not to trust what she says because you also have to realize that she's not at all motivated TO convince you or TO earn your trust. This behavior, today, is not an indication of future events SHOULD SHE DECIDE to commit to the marriage. Since you know she's not committed, acting affonted that she's not acting committed is just adding to the pile of resentments and feeding her perception of you as controlling. Your expectations should be that she's not going to behave in ways that are conducive to keeping the marriage - that's what she means when she says she doesn't know if she wants the marriage. She's giving you fair warning that she's not acting as your partner right now.

Obviously, you can't accept that non-partnership forever. Right now, it's what you're working with.

So, I suggest you practice letting her go by not looking until after she leaves. If you can't bring yourself to do that, then I suggest you take a good, long, hard look at yourself and decide whether or not you presently have the emotional control to pull this off without it getting away from you. Based on that data: make your best decision.

Mys

P.S. I can almost guarantee that she's still lying to you -- if not about contact then about a whole lot of other things she probably doesn't want you to know about. A majority of that is her fog, her recent immature actions (mid life crisis maybe?), and her sense of entitlement. Part of it, though, is caused by the dynamic that you are feeding of parent/child in this relationship. The more you try to pressure, control, or steer her towards the direction you think she ought to go -- the more she's going to rebel. It's like when you were a teenager -- there were probably a whole lot of things you never told your parents, right? You didn't feel bad about it, either, did you? Well, this is like the same thing....

There's no question that she's acting immature. A better way to deal with that is to have good, strong boundaries (and consistency!) rather than assuming the role of her parent. Does that make sense?

Hi mys....

Yes, that did make a lot of sense. The part about me loving to grandstand... lol, it didn't occur to me before, but I agree with it.. I am a drama queen, aren't I? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

OK, tomorrow after work she's coming back to load up the car with all her luggage and then going off to her friend's place. I'll tell her to text me to arrange to meet should she have forgotten something, and either change the locks or ask for her keys back, for the time being at least.

I've asked myself -so what if she's back with OW now? Would you still want to work it out with her, or plan D? I don't know.. I've set one boundary and that is I will not be part of a 3-way marriage -but have not really considered HOW i"m going to enforce that boundary.

I don't miss her anymore -I certainly don't miss sitting at home every night wondering where and WHO she's with. I don't miss this immature, selfish being who is most likely telling me she wasnts space to consider, when she's probably looking for an escape route to pursue the A without hindrance. At this point, I will let her go with a smile instead of tears -and I won't look at the records till Friday..

Well, she just left. Didn't even have a 'last dinner' with me, said she had to take some passport photographs for some visa application and she then grabbed a bite alone. Whatever...

So she packed up all the stuff and made 3 trips down to the car to load up her stuff. I didn't help her, and she didn't ask. At the end of it, she gave me her house keys and picked up her bag to leave. I said "No farewell hug for me?"

Then she came over and we embraced and she remarked that its "weird that she's leaving". I just said "well, you think real carefully". She nodded and I walked her to the door. When we were there I couldn't help it, the tears came unbidden to my eyes to see her go. She saw and looked pained. Then she leaned forward and kissed me on the lips and said "Bye baby" and turned and went away. I closed the door and the tears streamed down my face. Not as tough as I thought I was, apparently. But I did not grovel or beg for her to stay, wouldn't and couldn't do so.

{{{{{dev}}}}}}

I'm sorry. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Try to be kind to yourself today.

Mys

Thanks mys,

Going to bed soon. Feel a lot better now than a few hours ago... not sure how the world will look like when I wake up tomorrow -but I'm optimistic! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Guess this weekend I'll busy myself with cleaning up the house, relocating her stuff to a corner of the store.. man, I'll have a bachelor pad again! lol.

Update: Checked the bill today... and... she'd cancelled the itemized billing service the same day she'd activated it. She called in front of my, activated it, and then cancelled it right after!

So I have no means to record or track her calls. Smart little thing eh?

I came up with 2 plausible reasons for this:

1. She HAS something to hide, and cancelled it so that I wouldn't find out

2. She figured that since she was going to split up with me, then why continue to pay monthly for a service she doesn't need?

My bet's on No. 1 now.. what's yours?

Dev,

My bet is also on number 1 also. I would assume that she is still having contact.

BTW I gave my WH my Plan B letter last night... don't think he read it he calle dme this am. Asked him again to read my letter.

Still

Looking through her email, I found one in which she was chatting with some friends, telling them that thay could stay with her cause she should have her own place in May. Looks like she's indeed planning to move out for good, and this "one month to think" is just an excuse for her to find a place to store her place in the meantime before she moves.

I'm kinda pissed off that she could be so heartless, and still continue to lie to my face when she'd already made up her mind, to continue to dangle the *hope* of a carrot before my eyes when all that's waiting is a large stick.

I'll wait till first or second week of April, then I'll call her and tell her to move the remaining stuff out of the apartment or I'll leave it on the corridor outside. Move forward and do a sudden plan B on her. Any advice folks?

Hi still,

Hope your plan B goes well.. Harley said that most of these 'cases' had to go to plan B before it would work. Anyway, hang in there! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Dev,

I'm not holding out much hope... I'm thinking he was just looking for a way out. I'm kind of numb this morning... I was surprised I didn't cry myself to sleep last night <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

I guess this is really it. Although miracles do happen but I can't live my life waiting for him.

With your wife do you have a way to continue to monitor her e-mails? If you do I would do that before making any decision.

Were you planning on doing Plan A while she was gone that month?

If she were to get a place does she have to sign a lease?

Those are things I would be thinking of. And if a lease does have to be signed then I would seriously consider plan B closer to May. If you can wait that long.

Still