interesting, wish I had an aswer..

In many cases, the first coherent thoughts a BS has after the affair is finally busted, Plan B is ended and recovery starts (Mimi excepted - just joking you Mimi) are self protection related.

Basically: Do I, now that I have some time to think, really want to go through the rest of this long haul?

And related: The M was just as bad, worse in fact, for me as for WS but I didn't have an affair. So why should I put even more effort into a possibly lost cause? Why should I bare my heart again? I don't want to be here, now that I think about it.

This phase can last years.

So perhaps forum advice should tend toward the self improvement, here are your best approaches to self-protection and self recovery while also maximizing your marital recovery prospects kind of advice. Any other kind of advice will be misunderstood.

And don't forget, every newbie and vet here gets very conflicting advice from a plethora of posters. There is a lot of noise on the channel, all the time, here.

It's hard to think on-line at anytime around here.


With prayers,

[color:"red"] NoWay [/color]



If this was not an affair-affected marriage ... but one with a different marriage-killer ... say DRUG ADDICTION

the non-addict spouse stands aside and does nothing to stop the flow of family money down the drug-rat-hole .... the utilities are shut off ... there is no food or heat ... and the non-addicted spouse does not self-protect but stands aside and watches .... WHAT does that mean? Why does the non-addict not self-protect?

Is it as simple as you say here NoWay? They are simply decision-averse?

This comes closer to home for me ... as my WH was a then functioning alcoholic.

Pep

Same thing that keeps abused spouses in the marriage with their abusers?

A host of reasons...co-dependency, financial, kids, no support group, religion, shame, guilt, low-self esteem.

How do these people differ from those that stay in dysfunctional marraiges without ever seeking change or leaving?

SD

I think this is a question that has SEVERAL possible variations of accurate answers.

Like a person with abdominal pain...though they may present similarly [my stomach hurts!]...it takes some testing and prodding and looking through individual history to find out WHY.

I think there are definitely people who fail to fight because they view adultery as a get out of jail free card. maybe they were unhappily married but have religious or social objection to taking responsibility for ending the marriage.

There are people who fail to fight because they are straight up scared of any conflict...and fighting is by nature conflict heavy.

There are people who are deceived...their WS has more ability to sway their beliefs than any message board, book, or theoretical "plan" that they have no faith in.

There are people who are ignorant. They haven't studied or given any REAL intellectual consideration to what is being offered.

There are people who can't get their sh*t together because they just can not or will not step out of their reactions and look at a bigger picture.

There are so many more possibilities that all basically boil down to DOUBT. They do not act because they do not believe that it is necessary, or that it is in their best interest, or that THIS solution is the right solution.

They have no faith so they take no risk prefering to stay in the burning house rather than jump out of the window.

Oh crap! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" /> I just realized I'm 8 months short of being a vet.

Please disregard my previous posts. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

SD

Perhaps it could be compared to
what we call

"low bottom drunk"

maybe there is such a thing as:

"low bottom betrayed spouse"

their "bottom" is just too deep for me to fathom ...

I think this is it, actually

the BS who I cannot understand why they are just ~standing there~ as the adultery poison darts are flying ... why don't they duck/cover/protect ... maybe their tolerence level for abuse is so high that it is beyond my comprehension

hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

methinks prolly true

Pep

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />idjut <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

tap*tap*tap

waiting for the jokes.... come on people !

I attribute the lack of action to a few different possibilities.

Fear, for one. Many fears, actually. When you aren't SURE of what you want, inaction creates the situation where you aren't pushing things in any direction - therefore, you are not the cause of anything. Some see inaction as a course of action of sorts - wait and see what happens IS the "plan". Sometimes their own fears of doing the wrong thing, or making the wrong decision, just paralyzes them.

They see the safer decision to be to let others decide.

I think also there might be the "rescue" factor. Some may not DO anything, because they want the WS to do the work - whether consciously or unconsciously, the BS wants the WS to see their needs, to come back to the marriage, do the work of recovery, and fix things. Basically, the BS wants to be rescued by the WS, and is more or less waiting for that to happen.

Third idea, I do agree, maybe they feel that it would be better for the WS to just leave. Maybe they were shocked when d-day happened that their feelings were not exactly what they thought they would be. Lots of people believe that if their spouse were to cheat, they would divorce immediately. Then, d-day happens, and the BS wants to recover the marriage initially, but later maybe there are second thoughts on this for the BS. The BS might just have been blindsided by their own initial reaction - and the lack of action to recover the marriage is just the "more real" reaction after the initial shock has worn off.

Just some ideas on why inaction might occur.

I've been accused of being a wide-bottom drunk.

From a long-neck bottle.

hahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

My H was telling me during and after the affair that I was uncommitted. It was confusing.

My IC once told me, "You don't want to be in a marriage where part of your job is to keep him from having an affair."

In the end, self-protection means withdrawal.

Cherished

I also think it might be a "resentment" factor.

You hurt me, and now it's YOUR TURN to FIX THIS, or else.

I have done this time and time again, and it doesn't "feel like" I'm playing a victim to me at the time... but darned if it isn't just as paralyzing.

HAHAHA...IRL I got a BA in BS...does that help! LMAO


SHot...I think I have a long way to go... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Cherished I have to agree with you that self-protection does mean withdrawal...Have you heard Omarion's song "Icebox"

That was WH's ringtone on his phone before I left...

Here you go:

Ice Box lyrics


Fussin' and fightin', we back at it again

I know that, it's my fault, but you don't understand (no)

I got memories, this is crazy

You ain't nothing like the girl I used to know

Good with ma, good with pa, cool with all my [censored]

I should try, truth is I wanna let u in, but no

Damn these memories, and it's crazy

You ain't nothing like the girl I used to know


[Bridge]

Girl I really wanna work this out, cause I'm tired of fightin'

And I really hope you still want me the way I want you

I said I really wanna work this out, damn girl I'm tryin'

It's no excuse, no excuse

But I got this


[Chorus 2x]

I got this icebox where my heart used to be (but I got this)

I got this icebox where my heart used to be (said I got this)

I'm so cold, I'm so cold, I'm so cold, I'm so cold

I'm so cold, I'm so cold, I'm so cold


Why can't I get it right, just can't let it go

I opened up, she let me down, I won't feel that no more

I got memories, this is crazy

She ain't nothing like the girl I used to know

I don't mean to take it out on you baby but I can't help it

'Cause my heart is in the same ol' condition that baby left it

And I, I apologize, for makin' you cry

Look me in my eye and promise you won't do me the same


[Bridge]

Girl I really wanna work this out, 'cause I'm tired of fightin'

And I really hope you still want me the way I want you

I said I really wanna work this out, damn girl I'm tryin'

It's no excuse, no excuse

But I got this


[Chorus 2x]

I got this icebox where my heart used to be (but I got this)

I got this icebox where my heart used to be (said I got this)

I'm so cold, I'm so cold, I'm so cold, I'm so cold

I'm so cold, I'm so cold, I'm so cold


I don't wanna be stuck up in this cold cold world ('cause I don't wanna be) [2x]

Don't wanna mess this up better keep your eye on me girl [6x]


[Bridge]

Girl I really wanna work this out, cause I'm tired of fightin'

And I really hope you still want me the way I want you

I said I really wanna work this out, damn girl I'm tryin'

It's no excuse, no excuse

But I got this


[Chorus 2x]

I got this icebox where my heart used to be (but I got this)

I got this icebox where my heart used to be (said I got this)

I'm so cold, I'm so cold, I'm so cold, I'm so cold

I'm so cold, I'm so cold, I'm so cold

WHY should it be MY job to keep an eye on him? I got so tired of fighting for NC and my M... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

At least "I" feel like I did my best... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Hey, I count as as a vet! Woohoo!

From personal experience, I'd say that some people have invested so much and for so long in being nice, kind, gentle, innocent, vulnerable people, when it comes to doing anything that changes that perception of themselves, they are utterly paralysed.

Many do a stellar Plan A, whích allows them to maintain the self-image of being nice, kind...etc. But when it comes to your actual Plan B, which forces them into a position of being tough, unco-operative, disobliging, unlikeable, they are overcome with fear. Some people are averse to being seeing as strong, because it's vulnerability that has been their protective force all their lives.

I know - because I'm one of them - that some people had their self-defence mechanisms disabled by faulty parenting. They have no 'real' concept of their right to self-defence, and absolutely no idea of how to implement it...no matter how good the advice.

I sought the services of a tough IC to hold me to the actions that I intellectually understood were necessary, but found almost impossible to execute.

On the other hand, I suspect some come here who hold both an intellectual ideal of maintaining the marriage, and a deep-seated emotional disgust for their spouse...which they can't admit even to themselves.

How can you tell the difference? Hmm, I don't know. I don't even know about myself, ha.

TA

I so agree with this...I'm understanding that the faulty parenting includes abuse...

My IC told me the other day that my SD had taken all of the fight out of me "in certain areas"...

I also don't know...I didn't do Plan B...went from PLan A to D...I love my STBX but there's a matter of safety to be concerned with...if I had my choice, I would have my M...not a healthy M...a better M...

And we lay-advisors attempt to encourage new posters to do the same tough actions, with only our battle scars as credentials.

It takes a huge amount of resolve to gather ones self to do the intellectual work when the world as we knew it has become so utterly devastated.

Some got it, some don't?!

SD

Hi, Pep.

Quote:
=========================================
How can you tell if/when a BS is fatally traumatized to the point of not being able to come up with a self-protective plan ... or if this is a BS who really has no desire to save the marriage?

THIS is where I stumble....
=========================================

It seems to me that the ratio between fear, anger and apathy is the best indicator.

Gimble

[color:"red"] TA [/color]

I'm not sure if this is what you meant, so I am asking...



is this the same (in practice) as having a victim identity?

Pep