No, I don't really either. It certainly sounds to me that Sis is not Done, and if that's the case then she should keep doing what she's doing. But I would be interested in the Harley's assessment.

They've been doing this long enough that they must have some kind of data set built up. Not all waywards are alike. I would imagine they have some observed some generalities over the years (WHs who do X and Y and who were Z pre-affair are more likely to do ABC; WWs who do N but not P are much less likely to DEF). They know things we don't.

If they can see anything in Sis's situation that tells them it's time for her to bail, maybe they will tell her. If they tell her there is still plenty of reason for her to not Be Done, I would think she might want to know that, too.

My recent consultation with Jennifer was somewhat clarifying in that respect. Anyway, that's what I was thinking.

just remember...

you are not accepting that your marriage is over.

you are accepting, that for today, THIS is your reality. tomorrow is another day.

I think we get lost when we try to accept too much - too much stuff that is conjecture and not fact...

Honestly, I don't think that anyone telling me anything would move me anywhere at this point. The work I need to do is internal; WH is separate from this struggle.

WH is what he is, he is where he his; this is the reality. This is Truth, right now. The Harleys could speculate about his status, but that's all it would be: speculation. No one can see the future.

I intend to just move on with my life within the present sans-WH reality. This is the only option.

I think you are correct...it's a continuum:

At one end is Being Done = emotionally moved past the deep hurt. The scar is there, but the wound is no longer raw and bleeding. Life and full acceptance of one's own self-worth has filled the hole left by the A. I would imagine that there is true peace here and comfort with the new life into which one's been thrust.

A little further down is Acceptance = not emotionally past the deep hurt, but able to function and see reality. The A has left a deep, painful hole, AND there's a recognition that the WS cannot fill the hole....this can only be done by working on myself. There's an "acceptance" that the BS needs to turn away from the WS in order to heal and grow. It is the beginning of an emotional separation.

It seems that here is the point at which there is a hesitant, tenuous peace. The new life doesn't quite "fit." There are ups and downs, but you know the direction you need to go. Like learning to ride a bike for the first time. It's wobbly, feels scary, and you scrape your knee, but you know that you have to push through it to achieve the goal.

Further down the continuum is D-day, and the utter devastation...self-blame, needing to control, wanting to fix, clinging to everything that WAS. Panic, fear, anxiety. Not even wanting to LOOK at the bike, let alone get on it or try to ride.

So, where am I on that continuum? Well, I'm not putting any eggs in the WH basket anymore. I'm not even close to mastering all the areas of "acceptance," but I have accepted that we are getting divorced, that RT is in the kids' lives for now, and that the ILs are not part of my life.

I accept that I need to be on top of everything...there's no backup for the logistics of parenting or homeownership. I've made major changes in my work schedule, gone to court...faced lots of challenges...at the same time moving towards acceptance. Taking things as they come. Working through things, step by step, fighting every step, kicking and screaming.

Unfortunately, I still have a tendency to stare at the eggs that WH splattered all over the ground and fixate on the mess instead of just stepping over it.

Once I can take that step with some degree of effortlessness, then I will Be Done.

But I think getting There takes time. That continuum is a LOOOOONG road....or a TALLLLLL mountain to climb.

I look forward to meeting ME at the top. And planting my flag.

Gee....maybe I need to come up with just ONE MORE analogy...just A LITTLE more imagery so you all get my point...

sheesh.

I was starting to picture the mountain climber game on "The Price is Right"; the little man making his way up the mountain whilst yodelling "Yo de yo de, yo de yo de, yo de yo de ohhhhhh!"

Sis, you'll know you're done when you get there, so you KNOW you are not. It sounds more like a fight with yourself (oy, do I get that) than a fight against anything else.

Just keep climbing, or biking, or river rafting, or ice skating, or whatever you need to do. As Dory would say "Just keep swimming, just keep swimming, just keep swimming, swimming, swimming".

LMAO...SL that was a good one...price is Right...you're SOOO cool!

Morning SIS! I can totally relate I think to where you are...I think the thing that helped me was Matthew 19:3-21 (?)..

The first time I read it I was hung up on the part of the M being held together but then I read it several weeks later and what stood out to me at that point was discovering the issues related to me, finding MORE of MY part of the M, where I could have done better...so that I put myself in a better position in the future...not for anyone else, but for me...

I was talking to E last night and through his experience I "SAW" another part and I was SOOO amazed...something so simple...and now I'm having to go through not really a struggle but it is acceptance of myself that I DID DO that and that I projected my own feelings onto my DH during the M...my issues, my self-esteem...

So climbing the mountain, I hear you, but IMHO, I'll never graduate but there are milestone that I can stick my flag in on the climb and when I do reach the top of this one...I'm going to look over and see another adventure and I'm going to want to climb that one too...the key...BE kind to yourself...would you treat OP as you treat yourself? Or would you be nicer to them?

Sometimes I think we Have to get out of our own way...

LMAO...just talking out of my head this morning...

(((SIS)))
<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I remember that too well, SL. Yodeling all the way...

Rin, you are right...I don't think I will ever get to plant my flag forever. There will always be new ways to grow. I wouldn't mind if the way were not so steep in the future, however.

Any thoughts on how to let go of resentment? We got about 6 inches of snow last night and I'm out there at 6:45 shoveling (I couldn't get the blower started), and of course I'm cursing WH the whole time. Thinking about how he had probably made sure that RT's driveway was nice and clear, and probably checked in with her to make sure she was careful on the roads....

....meanwhile I'm shoveling, and slipping and sliding on icy roads in my lightweight 2WD Vibe driving the kids to school.

It also fueled my resentment toward FIL, who has NEVER once (in spite of how much he "loved" me) offered to help--even last year when we were still close and I was so weakened from weight loss--not with mowing, with raking and bagging leaves, with gutters, with snow removal...

Does the anger and resentment ever really go away, or does it just wane? And even if it wanes, does it rear its ugly head from time to time when circumstances are a reminder?

Actually, I feel a little better now....just having vented. Maybe I'm just crabby today.

I realize that resentment is a result of unmet expectations. Reminding myself of that also helps.

Someone remind me, though: are there are EVER realistic expectations, or is ANY expectation is a pre-meditated resentment?

I think I’m also bothered by a remark that I UNWISELY solicited myself. The boys spend Weds. night with WH, so yesterday afternoon I was checking in. I didn’t ask anything about what they did…just if they had a nice time, etc. But I couldn’t resist…with a smile (so as not to make DS12 feel guilty), I asked him if dad seemed happy.

He said yes. Evidently dad seems much happier now that he’s in his new house, and DS told me how dad’s working on stuff, buying stuff and fixing things up.

So as I was out there this morning shoveling, I was remembering how enthusiastic WH was about our house when we moved in, and for several years after that. Refinishing floors, stripping trim, painting, putting in a garden…all his idea. It was about a year before the A started that his enthusiasm fell off. It got to the point where he resented doing anything around the house. Our garbage disposal gave out one day pre-D-day, and he pissed and moaned the entire time he was replacing it…directed at me…as if it were all my fault and he was doing me some big favor....as if he himself never benefited from the garbage disposal.

So in my little fit of resentment, I’m wondering how long it will be before the novelty wears off on the new house, too, and he tires of doing the maintenance.

Sorry…I guess I needed to vent some more… <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Feel better now! Time to focus on work…

Here is what The Portable Therapist by Susanna McMahon has to say about resentment:

“Why am I so resentful?”

"Resentment occurs when we are not giving enough to ourselves. It means that we are giving too much of ourselves away to others and that we are feeling empty, lonely, abused, misused, whatever. Resentment is not defined as a true feeling. It is a feeling, probably anger or sadness, that has been rationalized or intellectualized by our “computer brain” into what we call resentment. In order to deal with resentment, it is easier to get to the source of it-to get to the underlying feelings.

Resentment occurs when we give an “unclean” gift., a gift that has strings attached. For example, we give something, our time, our energy, or maybe a tangible thing, that we do not really want to give or that we are giving for a reason. We are giving something in order to get something back and the purpose of the giving is the getting back. We expect our gift to have rewards. We wait for our expected reward and when it does not occur, we feel resentful. We are angry that we have given our gift and we are angry at the receiver of the gift. They have not followed through and lived up to our expectations and we are resentful. We would like to take our gift back. Resentment can only occur when you are not taking care of yourself. Remember the cookie jar theory: if you only bake cookies for others and never bake them for yourself, you will feel resentful when others eat your cookies. You will not feel resentful if you are filling your own needs. Before you give a gift to someone else, give a gift to yourself. Take care of your own needs first and then your gifts will be clean.

Resentment is probably the second most self-destructive concept, after guilt. Resentment can be thought of as the cancer of the spirit. It is almost impossible to love or want to be around a resentful person. It is the opposite of responsible. Resentment means waiting for someone else to know what we need, to act on our needs, and to take care of us. And when others do not do these things, when others cannot do these things for us, resentment occurs to externalize the blame.

Think of resentment as the disease of the addict. Everything we are and everything we need has been externalized. We are no longer responsible for the way we feel. Someone else is. We have become martyrs in that we give and give to others but no one is giving back to us. The addict is waiting for something external to fix him or her. The addict feels justified in being angry at a delayed fix. The addict feels justified in blaming the external world for his or her problems. The addict is truly self-centered. When we feel resentment, we act like addicts. We are refusing to take responsibility for our behaviors. The gifts we give to others are too costly. They are manipulative and demand a much higher gift back.

If you are resentful, begin to change by focusing on what you need, rather than what you are giving. Take care of your own needs. Try to stop being angry because others do not know what you need or do not give it to you. Stop taking care of others. Stop being codependent. Seek help. Think of your resentment as a cancer. Many cancers can now be cured. Your resentment can be cured. Who would choose to have cancer when they can be cancer free? Be prepared to do whatever it takes to get rid of your resentful feelings. You will have to try new behaviors and you will have to take care of yourself. You would do this if you had cancer;do it to get rid of resentment. It eats away at your soul and stops you from having self-esteem. Who needs it?”


LS,
I find a lot of truth in what's written about resentment above. You've been forced into a situation that you didn't choose. Maybe, if you've reached acceptance of where you're at, if you now consciesely (sp?) choose this life, for now. Maybe even have a little ceremony committing to this life, even if you're the only one at the ceremony, you'll feel empowered by choosing this instead of feeling as though it's been thrust upon you.
Hugs,
PF

PF: Perfect! Thank you. I just needed to be reminded of all of that today.

I'm going to paste that in my personal file here at work so that I can read it when I need to give myself a kick in the pants...or a change in perspective.

Acceptance is still the key. I wish it were smooth, but it's a few baby steps forward and every now and then a step back.



I LOVE how it talks about turning it on its head: when the feeling of resentment creeps up, think instead about what I NEED. I often feel like I NEED help: juggling work, house, kids...it can go from being manageable to being overwhelming very quickly.

It is those times that the resentment jumps out!

It's because I NEED something: in this case, I need help. Even if it means I have to hire the help...if it helps me to keep from feeling resentful, it's probably worth it.

Very practical advice. Thanks again.

Resentment had been eating away at me for so long. It really is self-destructive, and erupted, for me, in to not so pretty things. All that blackness that I created and put upon myself.

Sis, I know that you did not choose this, however, this is now your life. You will shovel alone, but it's YOUR driveway now. Even when you are WITH someone, you still have to weather things on your own. My FWH can't heal me. He can keep from being further cause of pain, but he can't take away what's done. That is for me to deal with, to let go of.

Does this all stink to high heavans? Yup

It's the hand you are dealt. It's scary and freeing all at the same time to realize that you are the only one responsible for your happiness, and only you can really hinder that happiness.

Maybe this doesn't make much sense; I can't find the words to express how much happier I am, now that I have taken responsiblity for my safety and happiness. I give to myself, take care of myself, and have no expectations that anyone else will be responsible for ME.

That's not to say that I don't hope for better from my FWH, from life, but it's up to me to MAKE it better.

Anyway, I understand all the anger, frustration and sadness. I think many of us do.

Beautiful post, SL!

So how about sharing on YOUR THREAD, Miss LIGHTNING BOLT!!

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

PF, Sis,Sl, Mimi,

I just have to chime in here to say 'great stuff", too!

I sure got a lot out of this for both my own personal application, and in handling my thought processes about Drac.

Thanks!

hi, I'm still around, I just didn't have anything to add...the only thought that came to mind was: Expectations are pre-meditated resentments!

Rin

*thwack*

Enough said.

I think venting out your feelings of resentment is okay, especially if it's here. I've noticed that when something is nagging at me a little bit but doesn't seem significant enough to really complain about, if I go ahead and post about it anyway, I almost always begin to feel better about it. Instead of letting it eat at me. Another one of the benefits of this place.


Yep. Hire it. There must be some strong-backed, under-cashed high school students around. Or guys with insanely-large trucks with snow blades looking for excuses to use them.

Think of new ways of getting what you need.

...or better yet, figure out how to do maintenance on my snow blower. It needs new 50:1 gas/oil, but I should probably drain out the old stuff...I have no idea how to do that. Maybe new spark plugs, too? Does it HAVE spark plugs? How do I get them out? Where's the darn manual???

Evidently I should have taken some kind of mechanics class in high school.

ILs have struck again.

MIL just left a VM asking if she and FIL could take the boys this afternoon to the Christmas tree exhibit.

Ummmm....what's wrong with taking them on WH's weekend?? The exhibit will be up for another month or so.

Last time I let them take the boys on my weekend (after they tried to highjack DS9 from school), they brought them home 45 minutes late, and my sister and her kids were here waiting to see them.

It just seems so presumptuous. They never call or have any communication with me, and only call when they want to take the kids during MY time with them...which is limited on the weekends as it is.

Simple straight to the point answer = No.

LS:

LS To IL's: "Sure, what time do you want to meet at the exhibit?

IL's: "Well, we just wanted the boys!"

LS: "Great, your son has them next weekend, work it out then."

IL's: "No reason to get snippy about it!"

LS: "No, I'm sorry, I'm not being snippy at all. I'm not part of your family anymore. You make no attempts to include me in events like this, but have no problem including the boys, during the times that I have them. Since your plans do not include me, please make plans for the boys during the times that your son is responsible. When you wish to include me, I will be more than willing to consider it. And Merry Christmas!, Bye!"

Does that work better than "no"? Although S/L recommendation works, it really doesn't help you get to a better place, because the requests will keep coming. And by stating WHY you do not want to agree, because of thier actions, then you lay out your boundaries.

Just my .02. It seems if you just ignore, or don't address, it sends a message that your at fault. And that you should send a message that THIER choices in this have consequences as well.

LG

you won't win any arguement with them...and don't make assumptions that this request was selfish and over the top on their part.

You are expecting and assuming that they "get it".

I bet they just woke up and thought it would be nice to do a outing with the kids. That the kids are only availalbe to them on their son's weekends has probably not occured to them.

they are offering to be a part of your children's lives and offering to spend time...

this is hardly a bad thing.

if you don't want them to go...there is no need to say anything but, I am sorry, we already have plans.

Anything else will simply widen the gap between the kids and them - and that is NOT good for you kids.

this is a good example of boundaries vs control.

you can not control what they do or think.

you can't even KNOW what they do or think.

Trying to force them to get your point of view - as if it is the only RIGHT point of view - is going to simply waste your precious time and energy.

They made a request - take it at face value.

You can take it or leave it, thats your boundary to enforce. But to try to stop them from making the requests...or seeing things YOUR way...thats the waste of time.