here's a link to your thread about their video... do you see me calling him a fraud.... nope...

great take home points
yep
bump

But God forbid I question the very high fees or that they are a business and not a ministry! Your argument holds no water Mel.

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/sho...e=0&fpart=1

It is very true, his telephone consultations are very expensive, the highest of any I found anywhere. If you can afford it, it is well worth it. Additionally, Dr. Harley's stuff really works. He is handing the business down to his children as would any responsible father.

I am forever grateful to have had this site and my personal consultations with the Harley’s help save my marriage. Still, I understand that it is a business. He earns his income from it but I do not view this fact as a negative.

I manufacture automotive parts for a living and do it to the absolute best of my ability and with the customer's satisfaction at the forefront. That is how I put food on my table yet it is a business before anything else and it is not a philanthropic venture even though I fight hard to keep jobs in America as an American supplier employing Americans. It is a business that I am extremely proud of and very grateful to be able to work it. My work is no more of a ministry than is his.

If you are correct in your statement that Dr. Harley believes he was called by God to develop this program, then he NEVER communicated to me that God asked him to do this. He has never referred to Marriage Builders as a ministry that I have seen. If it is a ministry then let him say it. Are you reading his religious beliefs into a secret religious agenda that he has? I really doubt that. The gift that he has is that he does not need to impart his morality or religious beliefs to others to help them recover from infidelity. To me, that is the most beautiful part of what he has to offer, he does not require faith. All you need do is to employ logic and reason with a good dose of common sense and the world is your oyster.

Please do not lump him in with “pass the hat” ministries that have an exclusive hot line to God. I am not sure that that is the intention but to me it comes across that way.

Mr. G

Nope, I never said you called them "frauds," you made that up, as you do with most things. Here is what you said about them making a buck:


There ya go. Now, I will ask you again to back up your claims. Lets see ya put your money where your mouth is for a change, MEDC. Here is your big chance since you claim you "speak facts":

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The harley's make a lot of money(and good for them) by having nice little catch phrases about how every marriage is vulnerable to infidelity. Just like Dr. Phil makes a ton of money on his ways too. This is a business first and foremost and don't believe for one second that the Harley's don't know what does and does not maximize profit.


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I would like to see EVIDENCE of how much the Harleys make off their little so called "catch phrases" and evidence of what he does or doesn't know about maximizing his profit here.

Mr. G...you and I are not in frequent agreement...but on these points I feel you hit the nail 100% on the head.

MEDC you are right - the disparaging way you speak of the Harleys is plain for all to see.

As for your disparaging remarks about Mel's board, you have no way of backing them up.

He HAS communicated that to me and numerous others. Sorry to disappoint you.

Secondly, Dr. Harley does not have a clinical practice and does not charge for his services, outside of MB weekends. He gives FREE counsel over his radio show and via email.

MEDC, still awaiting that evidence. You stated you speak in "FACTS;" time to ante up!:

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The harley's make a lot of money(and good for them) by having nice little catch phrases about how every marriage is vulnerable to infidelity. Just like Dr. Phil makes a ton of money on his ways too. This is a business first and foremost and don't believe for one second that the Harley's don't know what does and does not maximize profit.


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I would like to see EVIDENCE of how much the Harleys make off their little so called "catch phrases" and evidence of what he does or doesn't know about maximizing his profit here.

hey Mel... do you KNOW what charlatans means... or did you throw a word out there that you don't know the meaning of.

They do make a lot of money ML... 2x the medicare amount of 99.51 per in office visit. One of their catch phrases is that every marriage is vulnerable to an affair. Clear enough???

Now how about you... you said I called them charlatans... last time I checked my yankee dictionary, it meant fraud, imposter or quack. Does your dictionary say the same thing Mel since you are denying it now????

still awaiting those "facts", MEDC....

and if you are asking for a dollar amount now you are being even more manipulative.

Hey Mel... prove to me that you are not drinking anymore...or prove to me you are not an active WS....
What you can't prove it??? You can only state the facts that you know....

as far as maximizing profits... again.... charging a VERY high rate for services IS maximizing profits. Is that a tough concept for you Mel?

Mel... charging 2x the medicare amount is a fact... are you disputing that???? or are you still working on the math?

It's not a catchphrase MEDC - it's a fact. Most infidelity experts say exactly the same thing. It's not unique to Dr Harley.

I am still awaiting "FACTS" to back up your assertions, MEDC. You claim to speak in FACTS, I am only giving you an opportunity to demonstrate it.

MEDC if the fee they are charging is so outrageous they would have no takers would they.

$185 - 99.51 = 85.49 cents above the medicare allowable rate for services.
okay, I did the math for you.

Now that is 86% higher that the medicare rate. And about 150% higher than HMO reimbursements.

"It is unbelievably INSULTING and UNTRUE to believe for a minute that Dr. Harley HOPES people will have affairs so he can make a BUCK. How dare you say something like that."

Ooops.........................

Actually, Dr. Harley charges NOTHING, outside of his bi-annual weekends. He does not do phone counseling. Folks can call in and talk to him and email him FOR FREE. And get a FREE book for the call.

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MEDC: The harley's make a lot of money(and good for them) by having nice little catch phrases about how every marriage is vulnerable to infidelity. Just like Dr. Phil makes a ton of money on his ways too. This is a business first and foremost and don't believe for one second that the Harley's don't know what does and does not maximize profit.


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I would like to see EVIDENCE of how much the Harleys make off their little so called "catch phrases" and evidence of what he does or doesn't know about maximizing his profit here.

still waiting for them "facts!"

"Oops" what?

and the fact that most infidelity experts say it does not make it a catch phrase how????
many diet books have a similar message too...but they ARE catch phrases intened to get peoples attention.
Publishers are in the market to make money too. Of course they will include the things that sell books. I will repeat what I said earlier... I am in awe of their business acumen and from a business perspective, it is brilliant.

So, Mel.... tell me, did you ar did you not use the word charlatan? Did you then look up the meaning?
How does your saying I call them frauds...or your word charlatan, co-exist with the link and my comments about his video. How does that co-exist with my saying he can charge those fees because of his reputation????

MEDC - I think its time to drink some of that koolaid. The rest of the bunch will be along soon.