Yes Mel I agree…and with that she also asked for opinions/explanations on whether we think a 2 x 4 is worth it or not. During my opinion/explanation on the topic I also stated how those different type of 2 x 4’s affected me personally. Obviously the way those 2 x 4’s affected me helped to form my opinion about the worth/value of it and that was the opinion/explanation I’ve offered to her in my post. There is nothing wrong with stating an opinion and viewpoint about something and as much as someone can’t be prevented from posting in a certain way, someone can’t be prevented from stating an opinion about something. People state their opinions/viewpoints all the time and there is nothing wrong with that. Anyway, Orchid did ask for opinions too when she said "MB 2x4...... worth it? Yes or No w/ an explanation, please" and "your opinions are greatly appreciated" and I think my reponse was totally in line with her requests.

"MB 2x4...... worth it? Yes or No w/ an explanation, please"

This the title of the thread. She asks yes or no WITH an explanation.


Graplin... I see the same thing occur here at times.

melody,


Everyone's replies were in keeping with the subject of the thread: "MB 2x4...... worth it? Yes or No w/ an explanation, please" It was hijacked by folks who didn't like some of the answers, and so there were attempts to misrepresent those opinions and mock the people expressing them.

No one here can do much about which direction their threads go.....it's a public forum and it's very typical for threads to morph and evolve. If the subject matter is "fruitless", "futile" or just frustrating <to you>....you have the option of ignoring it. If Orchid really didn't want opinions....she wouldn't have said she "appreciated" them and I think she can speak for herself. Instead....you've decided to be derisive and defensive...apparently for the purpose of shutting down the discussion. And then accuse other people of hijacking???

I think people are capable of choosing which discussions THEY find fruitless....or do you wish to decide that for people too? The only hijacking I see here is the attempt to disrupt the discussion and dismiss the opinions of others.


The discussion is about 2x4's....whether they're worth it or not....and why. It calls for and requests opinions on that subject. A 2x4 is not a person...so there is no endless scrutinizing of others unless you decide to take this "personally".

Now, Star, you and I both know that a 2x4 is an inanimate object. It can only be moved by a PERSON, so it is silly to say this is not about OTHER PEOPLE. Unless one wants to believe that an inanimate piece of wood can be "caustic" or "harsh" or "poisonous." Maybe on the Disney Channel, but not in real life. So, there is no mistake that the scrutinizng is about PEOPLE, and not WOOD.

But hey, if you feel it is somehow productive - or enjoyable - to make endless posts about the sorry behavior of these other poor bastages, have at it. Perhaps some day you can straighten them all out. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

An MB 2x4 is a "metaphorical" term we created here....not an object. It has no weight, no volume...it takes up no space. We aren't discussing tables or books.....it is more akin to a discussion about politics or religion. It can be easily discussed in the same way we discuss love, infidelity, trust etc. I can discuss the ins and outs of an issue without attacking the individual beliefs of others.

*editted to change "philosophical" to "metaphorical" which seems more acurate to me.

A "philosophical term" describing the behavior of a PERSON, star. The behavior of people on this forum, not people on MARS. A term does not behave in an animate way, a PERSON DOES.

But, like I said before, if you feel it is somehow productive - or enjoyable - to make endless posts about the sorry behavior of these other poor bastages, have at it. Perhaps some day you can straighten them all out. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> Take care, Star.

[color:"red"]Dear Suzet [/color]



It's like we're having our own ~private~ discussion on this wild 'n' crazy thread <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I like that !

"will probably make that poster act defensive"

I'm not as concerned with this as you ... I think the defensiveness is brought TO MB much of the time.

haven't you experienced even your most benign remark/opinion/comment being met with a defensive stance?

When that happends to me, I figure either that person and I are not a good "match' (communication styles conflict) ... or they just need to be defensive for their own reasons

I've had attacks directed to me ... and not become defensive ... I've simply turned my attention elsewhere ... because I am not in the mood for a fight

Sometimes I enjoy a good sparring, it keeps my tools sharpened <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

"MB 2x4...... worth it? Yes or No w/ an explanation, please"


Yes 2x4s helped me:


About 3/4 months after my DDay my wife wnated me to move out of the house. I did for 5 days. I came here to talk about it and you know what I got.

Pep; "M2L, you really pi55 me off". This came from Pep, the kind, helpful person that I always thought came across as kinda a Kindergarten teacher. THAT hit me head on and I moved back home that day.

When I wanted to give up and get a D WAT asked me;

"M2L, do you want another man playing dad to your kids?" Again - hit in the head like nothing else could have. Not too much of a 2x4, but more so getting hit then him oulling me along with kind words.

I'm glad that 2x4s were used on me when I needed them.

Good question BTW

LOL

I'm over it now

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Late to the tape discussion, but Duck is a specific brand name for tape, kind of like Band-Aid for bandage, Kleenex for tissue...so Duck Tape/duct tape.

This thread reminds me of my parents, Dad who is very literal & strict, a 2 X 4er. Mom, "get more flies with honey" hugger.

I have a little of my Dad, reference my knowledge of Duck Tape <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />, but Mom was the one who explained things to me so I knew why I should do what Dad said.

Just like some of us don't know duct tape can be Duck Tape (easy example, I'm not making fun) we post what we know, what we have experienced, learned, and can convey.

thankee, hunny! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

MEL<--------REDEEMED <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

Mel:


And you've just as frequently taken the exact opposite stance...and what has it ever availed YOU?

If I believe something is RIGHT, I'll continue to hold my ground.

As, I'm sure, you will.

I've no intentions of changing or quitting. As, I'm sure, is the same with you.

I'll continue to post my opinions, my advice, and whatever else I feel is valuable. Just as you will from your own perspective.

And when a thread comes up on this subject...just as this one did...I'm sure we'll continue to remain on opposite sides, and continue to post our own perspectives.

I've no expectations that you'll ever change your "style", or the tactics you use. But, on the same front, I will not back down on mine either. Just as you will, I'll continue posting and responding as I feel is right and appropriate. And if you expect that I will back down on this, that suggests that perhaps you're hoping to change how I post? By your own standards, that's a waste of time at best, no?

And for what it's worth, I think that 2x4's are useful tools to help get the attention of a poster who, for whatever reason, isn't tracking. There are times when you've got to tell someone that they are their own worst enemy.

Oh no, objecting to your endless attempts to change others is not "taking the opposite stance." I have never tried to force you to change your posting style to suit my personal dictates. I don't give a hoot about your posting style and never have. Yet you continually do this to others here and have even appealed to the mods to do your bidding for you. [I believe it was Tempest who told you to quit whining once] To no avail.

Surely, you are grown up enough to understand that you can't change others? You can't have missed this simple truth in all your years.

Isn't that the definition of insanity, Owl?

Nice tact Mel! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Now you're questioning my sanity?

Lovely...

definition of insanity: doing the same thing over and over again but expecting different results...

Does that shoe fit?

*edit***********I'm guilty of letting it bring me to a level I'm not proud of. I'm slowly building an ignore list... it's much more peaceful for me.

Melody,

2x4s are a form of communication....not necessarily relating to <behavior> at all (except in a moment in time....but not as a "whole"). I'm sure if you choose to....it's possible to imagine slights and personal criticisms in every post you read....even the ones about "metaphorical communication".

Particularly triggering posts <for you> appear to be those you believe challenge your "style".

My comments on this thread are about what *I* consider good/poor communication (as it relates to MB 2x4s)....not "poor bastages" and not poor Melody. You are not besieged by folks who want to make you weary and change your style....that's a "victim stance".

Do I think you're a poor communicator sometimes?

Heck yeah!

....and I think the same about myself!

Sometimes I hit the mark....and sometimes I don't. Sometimes I'm gentle and sometimes I'm harsh and blunt. Sometimes I'm effective.....and sometimes I'm not.

That pretty much describes every single person on this board....regardless of their STYLE.

The same person can write a great motivational post one day....and be scathingly disrespectful one the next. That has nothing to do with "style"....it just "is"....we are complex human beings living complex lives. Each of us has issues we feel passionate or sensitive about.

You reserve the right to speak passionately about things you believe in....but you seek to squelch the right of others to speak just as passionately from other viewpoints.

It's not all about <you>....deal with it.

Just had an interesting thought. If this is the flat, straight up truth, why is there a forum at all? Why is there an MB website? What use are psychologists, psychiatrists, counselors, etc...?

Of COURSE we can change others. Heck, that's the PURPOSE of all the professions I just listed. It's the PURPOSE of this site.

We help others to change, by motivating them TO change. By making them WANT to change.

If that didn't work, what the heck good would plan A be? Or plan B?

Isn't this simply a method of behavior modification through positive/negative reinforcements? Hmmm...when we raised our kids, didn't we help modify their behavior by rewarding positive behavior, and punishing the negative?

OF COURSE we have an impact on those people around us. We do EVERY DAY. Ever notice how if you smile and tell a joke to the cashier that seems to be down that she perks up? How sometimes, your mood affects the mood of the entire office around you?

How is this any different here?

Have you ever read your own posts, dear? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

Are you kidding me? CLUE BAT! The purpose is to CHANGE OURSELVES. You cannot change another person, you can only change yourself. People come here and go to psychologists to CHANGE THEMSELVES, not their NEIGHBOR.

Do you go to counseling to change YOURSELF or do you go to change your BOSS? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />

WOW!