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Woohoo! I like this new attitude. I am getting that same who-cares-anymore perspective. Plan B full force. Stay dark like a ninja. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> But from one who knows, your feelings may change back in a day or so. We're here when and if that happens.
"Love the life you live, live the life you love." Bob Marley
BS(me)37
WH(37)
DS1
Dau from prev M 16
Married 4/06
D-day 6/06, again 11/06, again 4/07
Plan A'd all over the place, then
Injunction 10/07, WH moved in with OW
WH has own place 12/07
1/08 Plan B
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I've had a turning point though....after this past weekend, and the reaction (or lack thereof) towards the letter, and everything else.........I'm burned out....don't really care that much anymore.. As far as I'm concerned, if she's going to leave, it's her damn fault, and any fall out from this rests on her shoulders... I've done all I can do
Time to walk... I don't really care if she calls or not, reads a letter or not, it's time for the pictures to come off the wall. My feelings of grief have turned into indifference. Damn her. Tarnsy is right. If you haven't tried Plan B, then you haven't done what you can to save your marriage. What you have just experienced is a trigger. You sent the letter. Your mind knew that you weren't going to get a response, but your heart really really wanted one and hoped against hope that you might get one. But you didn't get one, and that hurts. It's a blow to you--your ego, your soul, your emotional well-being. It triggers an emotional response from you. What is it? "I'm done. I don't care anymore." After you vent some of this frustration out and spend a little bit of time, you will likely feel different and will be ready for Plan B. What you didn't do was take the frustration out on your WW, which is good. There will be times, however, when you will be tempted to lash out at your WW in response to triggers. Don't! It will be LB'ing, and it will make you look that much worse in your WW's eyes. Your response is completely natural, so don't feel bad about it. It's also predictable, which is why I tried to caution you about what your own response was going to be when the letter wasn't received the way you hoped it would be. I talk a lot about triggers because I think recognizing and dealing with them is a pretty big deal in Plan B. Does any of it make sense? If you can grasp the trigger concept, it will help you understand how a dark Plan B will work. In this case, you triggered yourself. There will be enough times when your WW triggers you, so from now on you should try to minimize triggering yourself. Dark Plan B = no contact = no opportunity for triggers. I hope this doesn't sound condescending--my matter-of-fact tone is because it's so much easier to spot this stuff for someone else. I still fight the triggers and my response to them myself.
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Hi everyone….
I think I’ve started Plan B, I just haven’t sent the letter to say it! Sd, you talk about triggers….it seemed I was running into them about 5 times a day!... I felt like puking every time I hit one. It’s interesting, in that I wasn’t expecting anything from this letter, so it didn’t cause any reaction in me, other than confirming what I really already knew. So the lack of response was more of a confirmation than a hurtful experience.
I was trying to describe this to my brother, but when I think about what has happened, I feel disappointment for her. I don’t feel a trigger being pulled there, it’s just that I feel really sad and disappointed that she has gone this far, and done as much as she has without trying to make it work….it’s more of an academic exercise than an emotional experience.
My big question is how to tell my kids how I feel, and where I’m going. Since this has happened, they have been great. They have been Plan A’ing her more than I have. I know they can handle and understand why I’m throwing in the towel, but I also want them to understand why…..that being the active affair and lack of commitment on her part.
I don’t want them to hate her, or think or say bad things about her (that’s my entitlement alone) , but when they know what’s happened, they will be pretty tough on her. I don’t want them to burn any bridges, both theirs and mine. If anyone can give me some suggestions there, I’d be eternally grateful.
And, onto another Plan B question, when you go there, what is the best way to start it…..I’ve been thinking an in person delivery would be good, but are there any other ideas? I want to tell her how much the boys know about her activities, and how much I know too. Is that likely to do any good? I think that shame from the boys might be helpful….I’ve kept them out of this, but I think she needs to know they know.
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Sounds like you are ready for Plan B. Please post your Plan B letter here before you give it to her.
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Hi Ron,
You asked what you should tell the kids about going to plan B, I don't know how old your children are and I don't know what the usual advice is here on this matter but I'll tell you what I did. I let my DD14 read my pbl before I gave it to WH, she seemed to accept it and said she understood why I was doing it.
As for DD8, I just explained that it hurt Mummy to keep seeing Daddy and then have to say goodbye to him knowing that he was then going to be with OW. I told her that I still loved her Daddy but that I needed to look after myself for a while.
My only advice is to tailor what you say according to your childrens ages and to be prepared for WW to use plan B against you by telling the kids that it's not fair that dad isn't talking to mum.
Tarnsy
Last edited by tarnsy; 01/16/08 01:21 PM.
BW (me) 40
WH 41
DD's 9&15
D Day 12 Nov 06
Married 16 yrs
PBL 24/12/07
WH lived with OW 07-07 - 07-08
WH returned home 08-08
Found out NC broken 29-10-08
WH leaves again 15-01-09
bruised but not broken
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Remind me how old your kids are? I want to tell her how much the boys know about her activities, and how much I know too. Is that likely to do any good? I think that shame from the boys might be helpful….I’ve kept them out of this, but I think she needs to know they know. I understand this completely, Ron, but don't do it. It won't do any good. She's a Fogged-Out Zombie. You can't reason with her. You might as well talk to your car. Actually, it might be more productive to talk to your car. Let's say you tell her that her kids know what she's doing and that it makes her feel bad. Which is the more likely result given that she is an actively wayward spouse? 1) WW realizes that what she has been doing is wrong, accepts responsibility for her actions, and renounces her adultery or 2) WW feels bad. She looks at Ron and thinks "Ron made me feel bad." She gets defensive and lashes out at you. Trust me, I understand the urge to reason with her, because you're right. What she's doing is hurtful for everyone involved. She will regret it some day. But you can't make her see the light. You can't control her, and trying to will make you crazy and hurt your chances for recovery. Whenever you think about trying to reason with her, just substitute the thought of talking to a crack addict. "You know, if you quit smoking crack, you could clean up, get a job, and rejoin society as a functioning member."
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LOL! SD....I have found that talking to my car is very useful! It's breaking down as much as my marriage lately!
The kids are: Our daughter 5 years, my sons (her step-sons) 15 year old twins, and a 13 year old.
She is very attached to one of the twins, less so to the others, although since they have been Plan A'ing, she has seen the good in them as well. She has told them that she really misses the 'family' life. I know whay you're saying about who will get the 'blame' for telling her, but I think that she would really be uncomfortable knowing that the boys know what she has been up to. That's only my gut feeling, I don't have anything to back it up.
There's no reason involved....she's still an affair junkie.
Tarnsy, thanks for that advice....I hadn't thought about letting the kids read the letter, but it's a great idea. As far as the big guys go, I want them to know why I'm going to Plan B. Basically, I want them to know that I've done everything i can....and it hurts too much to go on. I want them to know that the OM (who they know about) wasn't the cause of the problems and the separation, but is definitely keeping us from getting back together.
Before I go dark, I want her to know that her actions have hurt more than just me, and why. She knew all about how the boys reacted to infidelity and separation, and how it affected them. I just want to make sure she knows they know.....Not in a vicious way, but just to let her know. No, it won't bring her back, but I'm tired of seeing her eat cake.
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Hey Ron,
I've been following along. It seems like our sitches are getting more and more similar as time goes by. I understand what you're saying about being tired. I'm getting there myself. I thought I was going to plan B as well, but jennifer wants to me to hold out for another month. Not sure I can last that long, but I'm trying.
You've been at this alot longer than I have and you seem to be ready. This is where it's supposed to pay off. I'll be here and pulling for you!
DM
BH- 33
WW- 31
DDay- 6/07
Separated
A ended 10/07
A2 - WW dated OM2 12/07 - 2/08
Agreed to R 2/08, but WW not serious.
6/08 - ILYBINILWY - No longer wants R.
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Before I go dark, I want her to know that her actions have hurt more than just me, and why. She knew all about how the boys reacted to infidelity and separation, and how it affected them. I just want to make sure she knows they know.....Not in a vicious way, but just to let her know. No, it won't bring her back, but I'm tired of seeing her eat cake. Nooooo! I know why you want to, but don't! It's a huge LB, and I guarantee you she won't see it the way you want. She'll twist it around in her mind. Even if you do score and make her feel something, she will just blame you for how bad she feels. You can't win. YOU can't make her come back. YOU can't make her see anything. Only SHE can figure it out. If someone else knocks some sense into her, great, but it's unlikely. Tell your car instead. Better yet, post it on here--exactly what you want to tell her (and why). See if anyone else thinks it's a good idea.
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I want her to know that James, (the 15 year old she's really attached to ) figured out that her and OM were having an affair, and told me about it. She really wants to keep an attachment with the boys, and especially him.
I wasn't planning on hitting her over the head with it, I just wanted to mention it to her so she has an idea of what other people have had to deal with. So far, she has got away pretty much scot-free on this, she hasn't had to deal much with people's displeasure in her actions.
It would force her to face that issue, because I am pretty sure that when I go dark, the boys will too.
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Trust me, Ron, the slightest mention of it will feel like (to her) that you are hitting her over the head with it. The first thing you do is talk to the boys, or let them read the PBL, which ever you choose. Let them decide (and give them a day or two to come to an agreement amongst themselves or with your help) as to whther they want to join you. If they do, you could maybe add a line into the PBL (maybe like a p.s.) that states that your boys know why she has left and would also like to refrain from contact until she can re-commit to the family...?
I don't know...my biggest fear is that if she freaks out over the NC stuff, she will try anything and everything to get to you (much like myfamilyilove is experiencing right now) and that she will try to contact James and put him in the middle or something. If she realizes that they are all of the same mind, she may be less likely to do this. No 15-yr-old needs to be put in the path of a wayward!!
What do you guys think?
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You are all right, I'm sure.....It just pisses me off though, it still feels like she's getting to have her cake. As far as her trying to break NC? I haven't heard from her in a week. I suspect that Plan B will suit her just fine,
Thanks for reading!
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FTBM asked me about the gerbil tagline on another thread, but I'm going to answer it here. There's a book "The Language of Letting Go: Daily Meditations for Codependents" by Melody Beattie. BrambleRose recommended it to me, and it became quite popular with some of us in Plan B, such that someone could just post a day, and then we would know to go look up the reading. Sometimes they are bits of wisdom. Nov 30 is a bit different, but totally relevant for those headed into Plan B. One day, my son brought a gerbil home to live with us. We put it in a cage. Some time later, the gerbil escaped. For the next six months, the animal ran frightened and wild through the house. So did we--chasing it.
"There it is. Get it." we'd scream, each time someone spotted the gerbil. I, or my son, would throw down whatever we were working on, race across the house, and lunge at the animal, hoping to catch it.
I worried about it, even when we didn't see it. "This isn't right," I'd think. "I can't have a gerbil running loose in the house. We've got to catch it. We've got to do something."
A small animal, the size of a mouse had the entire household in a tizzy.
One day, while sitting in the living room, I watched the animal scurry across the hallway. In a frenzy, I started to lunge at it, as I usually did, then I stopped myself.
No, I said. I'm all done. If that animal wants to live in the nooks and crannies of the house, I'm going to let it. I'm done worrying about it. I'm done chasing it. It's an irregular circumstance, but that's just the way it's going to have to be.
I let the gerbil run past without reacting. I felt slightly uncomfortable with my new reaction--not reacting--but I stuck to it anyway.
I got more comfortable with my new reaction--not reacting. Before long, I became downright peaceful with the situation. I had stopped fighting the gerbil. One afternoon, only weeks after I had started practicing my new attitude, the gerbil ran by me, as it had so many times, and I barely glanced at it. The animal stopped in its tracks, turned around, and looked at me. I started to lunge at it. It started to run away. I relaxed.
"Fine," I said. "Do what you want." And I meant it.
One hour later, the gerbil came up and stood by me, and waited. I gently picked it up and placed it in its cage, where it has lived happily ever since. The moral of the story? Don't lunge at the gerbil. He's already frightened, and chasing him just scares him more and makes us crazy.
Detachment works.
Today, I will feel comfortable with my new reaction--not reacting. I will feel at peace. Excerpted for review from "The Language of Letting Go: Daily Meditations for Codependents" by Melody Beattie (HarperCollins).
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Ah, yes that is a perfect story to mirror Plan B.
Thanks SDGuy
"Love the life you live, live the life you love." Bob Marley
BS(me)37
WH(37)
DS1
Dau from prev M 16
Married 4/06
D-day 6/06, again 11/06, again 4/07
Plan A'd all over the place, then
Injunction 10/07, WH moved in with OW
WH has own place 12/07
1/08 Plan B
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Thanks SD, that is perfect...
I've begun to feel that way, as you may have noticed in some of the previous posts. I'm tired of running after that damn gerbil! I have reached a point where I'm more comfortable with the idea of her not in my life. The only worry I have is dealing with the loose ends (kids, financial stuff, that sort of thing). I do know that I'll be fine, great, even.
Occasionally I catch myself, or step on a trigger, but I can honestly say that last weekend was a watershed moment for me....it showed me what she is like, that my efforts have gone largely unnoticed, and that right now I am waaaay better off with her out of my horizon.
Oh, and by the way, I have received a reply to the pre-Plan B letter!
Here it is... Salut Ron, How are you? I have received and read your letter and I will respond to it soon.
After that she goes on to talk about unrelated stuff (kids clothes etc). Then she finishes off with "Thank you. Call me if there's anything" Once again, not surprising, I don't really need to see the answer to know what it'll say. More fuel to the f*&k off fire!
Anyway, thanks again for that excert SD....that was really well timed. So for now, I'm back to ignoring that gerbil!
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'scuse the spelling.....excerpt!
But, having talked about how much I'm ready to move on...Do I ever feel bad.... This shift.....the abandonment of all I held sacred is hurting me more than I can describe...
Last edited by ron43; 01/19/08 01:13 AM.
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Yeah, don't worry about that. You're still on a roller coaster. How you feel about things will change every five minutes or so. It happened to all of us (Killer Bees).
Chances are, your feelings for her will still be available if and when you need them. That's the whole point of Plan B.
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Has there ever been a situation where Plan B went into effect, and the WS didn't care? I'm going into day 10 now, without having had any contact with her, and I haven't even started B yet!
I wonder if the official B letter is even worth it??
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Hi Ron
Don't waste your energy puzzling over how she may feel. It will send you crazy.
The PBL is worth it and you should send it right away. It will make it easier for you to stay dark as you can just refer her back to it via your intermediary. I found establishing communication exclusively via an intermediary very difficult. Also, if she does ever snap out of it, then the conditions for her return to your marriage have already been laid out. She will probably pay little attention to the PBL right now but it would be surprising if she didn't hang on to it and refer back now and again.
If your experience is anything like mine, there will be times when you feel very sad indeed and, from your other posts, you seem to be experiencing that already. Unfortunately thoughts of her will continue to dominate your mind for unwelcome long periods and quite frequently. If you ever find an antidote to this, please let me know.
It won't feel like it for a while but I'm starting to see that darkness is actually better than the maelstrom of Plan A when the WW is still having the affair.
Good luck!
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Hi Ron,
I haven't got any advice for you I'm afraid but I just wanted to say that I completely understand the wondering about how plan b will or will not have an effect on the WS. It's something I still struggle with but I am now finding that those thoughts are getting less frequent. I try to remember to "just be still".
Have you posted your plan B letter for the experts to critique?
BW (me) 40
WH 41
DD's 9&15
D Day 12 Nov 06
Married 16 yrs
PBL 24/12/07
WH lived with OW 07-07 - 07-08
WH returned home 08-08
Found out NC broken 29-10-08
WH leaves again 15-01-09
bruised but not broken
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