SC,

Hi there. I want to congratulate you on taking action in your marriage for NC. Big kudos to you and your FWH.

Have you guys talked about what he would do or say if she called him again? Ran into him? Or you, if she called the house? Talked about what your kids would do if they answered the phone?

Planning scenarios for actions helps in knowing the boundaries and boundary enforcements for your marriage.

Have you shared your belief with him that you choose to believe he worries more about hurting her feelings than hurting yours?

Seems like withdrawal to me, btw. I remember choosing to believe that, as well. Often hearing my DH's words in that vein. Had to own my own choice of perception--step out of it, listen and repeat.

Are you guys doing communication exercises? Intimacy exercises? You getting your 15 hours a week of UA?

My DH still has the same cell number he had back then. The difference is what we have in place in the event of contact. That's our power...our half.

And that means changing your home phone, as well. Did you already do that? Since you've spoken directly with OW on numerous occasions, you have to go NC, too.

I would stop calling his company to change his cell number. They know. They are responsible...they have the information. The request. You have documented them, I'm sure. You're doing your part, SC.

Way to go.

Have you thought about changing your screen name? I wonder...feeling crazy isn't being crazy. Remaining so? Hmmm. You're anything but crazy. The world may seem upside down and backwards...looks to me like you're making sure you're standing up (and for) your marriage, yourself and your family. No crazy in there.

IMO.

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

LA

I have to be careful what i say and when i say it but when i get the opportunity to bring things up i do. I have asked him to just hang up on her if she calls him again. That is my only plan of action because it does still seem like he can not be mean to her. Even though he told me about the call she made on my birthday he still spoke with her at least long enough to hear that she was offering him 350,000 dollars. She only called our house phone the one time but i did have that number changed as well.

I shared the feelings of me feeling like he cares more about her feelings than mine before but not for a while because of him being so adamant about not talking about her.

I guess it still just hurts so bad when i know that she contacts him.

Well at least you knew what i meant by Still_Crazy that it was feelings and not me. I do not think i am crazy just emotional.

I have not spoken to her since March 5. And have no intention of ever speaking to her.

SC,

Why do you choose to be careful of what you say and when you say it?

Are you sharing, instructing or manipulating?

I urge you to go for sharing. "I'm wrestling with my own DJs right now. Thank you for listening."

Only thank him if you are sincerely grateful he listens.

He's in withdrawal...this is a really tough time for you, for him...all around. Accept this is for right now. Not forever.

Maybe you had the expectation that once he contact stopped, the A was ended, that your deep pain would stop, too. Normal, not reasonable, and I think you know that. This is hard, too...gets better and better over time.

Now calls for the hardwork on your part...to see where your FWH's FEELINGS won't keep you safe. Nor will yours. Understanding how you really function in this life, where you act and react from and why...your own choices...will give you that thriving marriage down the road.

Feelings change. The signals keep coming and they change when beliefs change.

Check your own. How does it profit you to believe your FWH wants to protect OW's feelings more than yours? What if it has nothing to do with either of you? His own conflict avoidance, not an act of love...a reaction to fear?

Until you know HIS truth...can hear, understand, acknowledge his stuff as his...you won't recover, will you?

You have an incredible opportunity now in your marriage to know each other intimately, warts and all...respect each other's abilities to do anything (where previously you ruled out what he would or would not do, which is fantasy)...and get to know your own strength, power, wholeness and responsibility. And where it ends.

Build together again...which means you don't tell him what to do in regards to OW...you share your own ideas...what you're committing to doing yourself, your children...and ask for what his solutions are to guard the marital boundaries.

A bit of how we POJA'd this..."If she calls, you'll...what?"

"I won't answer if I see it's her. If I answer it because it's a strange number or I'm in a rush and don't look, I'll hang up." He dreamed she called, during withdrawal and it upset him for days. I checked the records. It really was a dream. His FEAR was huge...she mainlined him admiration...inundated his self-image with it...losing face to her wasn't about her at all...totally about him.

Your FWH doesn't care about the OW...he's crazy about his own feelings...the rush...the fantasy creates that rush...

Withdrawal is a real downer from that rush. Think about it...he's quit drugs cold turkey. He may not be allowing your love deposits to meet his ENs right now...his guilt, shame, remorse, anger may be so huge at himself that he's in CA mode with guns blazing. Not about you.

And the more you take to be about you...rather than what you own (your stuff--feelings, thoughts, beliefs, perceptions) and sharing it...making him the one with all the control over your stuff...well, that's the old marriage, wasn't it?

He's choosing you, period. Know that. His choice. Respect you cannot control his choices. Only your own.

Know reality from fantasy...bear it, swim in it, 'k? Watch the DJs...they can tank recovery over and over again.

Free yourself from them. Find all the ways you use them (false payoffs involve) and share with him what you find out about you.

Do you get copies of FWH's business cell phone monthly? Would that be a compromise you would make?

Thank you for going NC with OW. Each time something corrosively putrid she said comes to mind, love yourself enough to tell yourself the truth "She is not a part of our lives. She is not saying this to me now. She is nothing in our marriage." She isn't. She was an illusion...drug parephenalia, 'k?

You're real. Stay real. Know you are real.

Get present. Note the date of the last contact. He didn't guard his weaknesses. Okay. He chose not to...what did you choose? What are your predetermined, progressive marital boundary enforcements?

Do you hold yourself to them? If you're asking him to decide ahead of time how he'll choose to react with the big "what if"...then you do your part...and do the same.

Balance. Equality. Respect. Really important truths humans live by...when they are in reality. First to go when they don't.

"know that she contacts him"

That would hurt like a muther, SC! It's not true, is it? She contacted him when? Note the date. Is it today? Last week? When I say "watch your language", I'm not chiding. You want to live in the truth...check how you phrase and communicate with yourself. Telling yourself present tense (ongoing)...she contacts him...hurts like crazy. Is that the truth? She is contacting him right now? Each day?

No. Not the truth. Verify. Understand. Then phrase it in truth. "Hurts like crazy when she contacted him and he did not hang up immediately or not answer."

Took sometime for my DH to understand that blowing off the OW didn't make him a bad guy (we had a lot of the big bad guy blame cycle in our marriage)...having the A made him one. She was part of the A. She knew what she was doing. You see that...he's stuck in the "she was only a conduit" linked to his admiration EN. That's terrific in a way...because that makes her two-dimensional. You can choose not to make her powerful, three-dimensional, 'k?

Your choice.

LA

What i mean when i say i have to watch what i say and when i say it is i usually wait until he brings it up. Whenever i try to talk about it at all he just says is the past is the past leave it there and look to the future.

Every once in a while (usually when he has been drinking) he will bring up the A and then i feel like i can talk about it a little bit anyway. But if we get too much into it he just says i don't want to talk about it anymore.

And i know that i should not concentrate on her but i harbor such bad feelings for her because of all the harrassment and the things that my H said to me about her and the things he did for her that he did not do for me in our whole 22 years of marriage. I do not want him to keep feeling guilty. I know he is sorry for what happened. I just wish he would let me talk about things.

I am trying to get better about not waiting for the contact to happen. I just know from too many people in his company that it will happen again.

You were clear, SC. Don't doubt yourself. You said that you determine what you will share and when you will share it based on FWH's possible response.

You're his slave.

You are giving him your power. You aren't sharing your stuff because you hold yourself to be open, honest and intimate. You are moderating when you share based on him.

He can say he doesn't want to talk about it. That's his. You sharing is not a conversation. It's an O&H drive by...to hold yourself to your code of honesty.

That way, there's no "if we get too much into it".

That way, you're not his slave...a slave to your own choice to base your actions on his reactions.

You break the loop.

How to break the loop of focus on OW...

She's not harassing you now. She's not saying stuff to FWH, to you or your kids right now. She is no longer attacking your marriage. Don't do it for her, 'k?

Do not be her proxy and do so in your head, replaying and replaying. When you trigger, announce and own you are triggering. Repeat those words...she is not part of your life. Your brain will stop handing you those sounds and images. You cannot keep your FWH from feeling guilt or feeling guilt. His feelings are his own...they are coming to him, from his own beliefs and past actions...to him, about him. Not you.

When you choose to compare what he did for you and what he did for OW...you are slicing YOURSELF open.

He didn't spend 22 years with OW.

He didn't know OW for who she really is...takes years, doesn't it?

He didn't father her children, did he?

You choose to speak or not. If you're speaking to get him to do/say something, then you're not sharing. You're manipulating. I'm not bashing you--in my really inept way, I'm showing you a monumental difference in your own choices.

You can choose to know your stuff and share your stuff. That is intimacy. Or you can choose to say your stuff and expect FWH to say something in return. One way affirms who you are, his partner, his equal, responsible for your own stuff...and the other says he is your cause, control and cure.

One furthers the burden which existed pre-A. The other gives new ground to build a new marriage of equals, from respect, acts of love...which you cannot conceive what he will or won't do for you...from his choice, his choice to love you.

First, you gotta choose...lay your half of the new marital foundations.

What is your predetermined boundary enforcement if there is contact in the future and your FWH does not report it to you? Does report it and mitigates it ("Before I tell you, I don't want you to go to pieces. I'm telling you and that should be enough.") Where are your lines drawn? What have you committed to doing if it occurs?

You decide, commit and let go. May not happen. You don't know. God made it so humans cannot change the past or know the future. For a reason. Only the present is our reality...where our choice has power.

Change your beliefs...and your feelings will change. Your "bad feelings" may be signals to you to change your beliefs...you causing this within you. You are your own cause, control and cure. Not others.

Sure can experience life as the opposite. It hurts. That's a signal you are living it not as it was designed.

What are you reading right now? What ways are you caring for yourself daily? What are your goals right now? How are you learning and growing and discovering your own stuff?

Beats the heck out of being OW's proxy by dwelling in the past, hauling it into today, doesn't it?

Do this for yourself. You're worth it. You've always been and always be lovable, whole, complete, with your own power and limits. Nothing and no one can change that. Only you.

(Alanon helps tremendously, btw.)

LA

I do not determine what i will share and when i will share it. I have tried and he just gets mad and then there is no communication. So yes i am his emotional slave. I have never been allowed to have my feelings. Most of the time in the whole 22 years of M when i share my feelings and they are not the same as his then i am not allowed to talk about them any more and just go on. You told me how you feel now never mention it again. And many of those times it did not change anything, my feelings were "wrong" just suppress them and move on.

And i know that i am dwelling on her and that i should not it could have been any person and i need to get over it, but i really feel betrayed all over again when she calls and he carries on a regular converstaion with her and yes i know that it has not been for a long time and i need to move on i am just having a hard time with that part of it. And i know that i am ruining my own chances at saving our marriage by doing so i just am not sure how to get past all the unanswered questions that i have. I mean we really have not discussed much of anything. What we have talked about is when he just tells me more about her. I mean since he has been back and supposedly over the fog he told me about how the other guys in the office were after her too because she is "very attractive". And when i say that hurts my feelings to hear things like that is when i get his standard. I love you the past is in the past leave it there and look to the future.

One day last week i tried to ask him something and he yelled i don't EVER want to hear her name again. I think I have came a long way since the begining but i have a long way to go. And i am sure there are plenty others out there like her but she was after my H from the get go (she is single) and kept pursuing and will not quit pursuing. That is why it bothers me so bad.

But i do have to move on and quit letting her win which is what i do when i think of the things he said about her.

Him getting mad.... isn't healthy for you or him and is NOT helping your recovery.

Mine did that also and I let him know that I bring this stuff out because he isn't helping me get the closure I need. Then I put him on the spot and asked him what his plans were to help me get closure. Open ended question. Now he had to come up with a plan to help me.

See when a Xws comes into recovery it is no longer all about him/her. It is about how the Xws can make amends to prove worthy of being a part of your family.

JMHO,
L.

Well i agree with you that it should be how we can help each other recover from this A. However that is not the way it is. What i have found out about the A i have found out on my own and questioned it and he would tell me that yes it happened and then the standard (I love you the past is in the past look to the future). That is what i get whenever i ask anything. I know very little about it though except that it happened and that he left me not once but twice in a one month period to be with the OW.

We have talked a little bit about why the M was where it was and that is part of the reason the A happened which is probably the most important part. Yet it seems like i have made all the changes to improve the M. It just seems like to me that he had the A and i am making all the concessions to make our M work. And i am not even sure if what i am doing is what he wants. If i am meeting his EN. He does not hear my EN. He listens to what i have to say but he does not hear it or chooses to not do anything to meet them or tells me my feelings are "wrong" and to move forward.

This your choice...this truly is your human choice of what you share with others and when you share your stuff. I hear you saying that you are choosing NOT to determine or own this choice.

I get that. I remember myself. Until someone pointed out to me a slew of choices I was making (some, by not making), I had no idea this was within my responsibility, my power.

I'm not saying this is bad or wrong, choosing to not determine what is yours...I'm asking you to see this as real choices, solely your own, 'k?



Sharing is doing your half of the marital communication...it isn't the whole (there are two halves), and it isn't a conversation. When you understand sharing as knowing and stating your stuff with your intent being to know and be known...then you'll see how you've signed up to be an emotional slave unnecessarily. Seemed necessary...all these years...and one of the keys I discovered in recovery is that I accepted what was unacceptable...and didn't accept what was essential.

Discerning the difference between conversation and sharing; where I ended and my DH began (and vice versa); setting my own boundaries; embracing my own limits; and understanding the extent of my own power...those, to me, are essentials in personal recovery from an A.

You switch your life from choosing your actions based on others' possible responses (which is living a DJ'd life, very painful) to living from your own code (creating and holding yourself to it) and letting the outcome go.

That's a reality-based life, not a response-based one.

There is a LOT of freedom in choosing to live within God's design for humans; and many other benefits including living from love and respect, therefore, experiencing a life OF love and respect.

Where does it begin? With choice. Your choice.

A great signal is every time you hear yourself (in your thoughts or words) say "I had no choice" to catch that signal as a lie to yourself. Absolutely may FEEL like we had no choice...we did. God granted in the way he made us.


Oh, I am not saying move on at all. I am saying that where you choose to dwell in your thoughts trains your brain to believe THAT is your treasure.

She is not what you treasure. Don't go there. Not to "fix"...to teach your brain that she is NOT your family, not what you cherish and focus on...you are. You're half your marriage...part of your family and worth every thought, kudo, discovery and delight within you.

Don't waste precious resources on fantasy. Use it to find the fantasy...what was your thought before she came to mind? Was it uncomfortable? A self-kick? A loving thought of FWH? What preceded the switch treasure switch? Be really aware of your thoughts, where they go and when...what's the order...so you can discover more about yourself, how you self-comfort, and know yourself really well.



Can you really hear yourself here, SC? Above, I hear you say you're powerless...because he doesn't think/believe/something his reaction...and here you're saying you're too powerful...you can single-handedly ruin your marital chances of recovery.

Again, half cannot do that. You can choose to divorce...that's your legitimate option. I believe once we choose to stay, to recover, that option leaves. It's not an open-ended for life option (though, in reality it is)...unless there is contact...another violation of the marital boundaries, then it's to be decided by the BS again.

You have two years to work through the fear, anger, depression, rage, resentment, disrespect, sadness and pain of his choices. I don't believe you cannot even begin to do any of this crucial grieving work without understanding your power and limits as a human in a human marriage.

Power is our choices.


Supposedly over the fog? I'm confused...do you mean you are supposing his fog-free or he is telling you that he is?

And yes, SC...OUCH! Ouch, ouch...I remember. I feel the echo of all those ouches from back then, three years later. They don't pierce...they bump...your pain is real, and the anger which follows your pain is real and valid. Do not react to the anger...state it. Say aloud, "Ouch! I feel pain in my chest when you mention her name. Then I feel this surge of anger, feels righteous and fearful, both at the same time. Can we call her by her last name (because that emphasizes she isn't part of YOUR family)? Or OW (those actual initials)?" Then you breathe and calm yourself, listen and repeat..."I hear you saying you and the other guys at the office thought she was hot, is that correct? I'm hearing that like an excuse to cheat on their wives, is that what meant when you shared this?"



"Ouch" doesn't say where the pain is coming from...until you do. Hearing her name, that she's "quite attractive" hurt a lot. Break it down where the hurt is coming from...if you hear him saying that she's more attractive, if he couldn't help himself, whatever it is...hear it in your own head. When you begin to see all the places you make your own choices (no powerlessness, no helplessness), the more you'll hear where he makes his choices.

Or you may hear him working through his own whys behind his choices, probing his own choice to fantasize, justify. About him. Not you.



Yelling isn't okay. Not for you, not for him. When you revoke your permission to yell, you'll enable yourself to enforce your boundaries around yelling.

Your WH isn't a victim...OW cannot make him one. Do not make him one in your mind. Extraordinary precautions work. As a team, you can protect your marriage. I know this bothers you terribly...she may have pursued (or may continue); his rejection is essential. He is rejecting infidelity in his marriage.

So are you.

She can't win anything...OW is a fantasy. She's not part of your marriage.

Have you given your WH Joseph's letter to read?

Not that this will change him...I'm asking you to do your half, your part, and let the outcome go. Your choices are yours...your own understanding is what is important. You're here. You matter.

LA

LA,

I REALLY hear what you are saying about the choice being mine to make. I have made my choices and shared my feelings with the same response every time (his standard). What i am saying is my choice is to share my feelings but what good does it do to share them when he does not listen (or hear) them. I do not want him to do what i want. I want him to make those choices on his own but as of yet he has always chosen to take the path of the OW feelings.

I have had these thoughts from the discovery. Every day from morning until night it is like a stinking obsession I hate it and i hate myself for having my mind go there over and over and over again. I do not enjoy my life anymore, i used to be the world's best mom (according to my children anyway) and that brought me great joy. Now i do not enjoy anything. My thoughts are ALWAYS on the STUPID A. I check his cell phone every day to see if he talked to her i mean i am ridiculous.

They day he told me that all the guys in the office were after her because she was VERY ATTRACTIVE. I told him how badly that hurt my feelings to hear him say things like that about her i just received the standard response. When i try to go further with my feelings he just gets mad and yells and then is pretty much silent for the rest of the day. So i chose not to talk about them because i do not like to be yelled at by him.

The reason i say that i feel like he thinks her feelings are more important than mine is his reaction to things. Like when she did call him he carried on a conversation with her. When he went back to work after his 5 month illness and she sought him out in the office he would carry on a conversation with her. He said he works in a small office and could not be rude to her in front of everyone.

The supposedly "over the fog" comes from his reacdtions to her. In my opinion if he can not chose to ignore her when she tried to contact him then how is he over the "fog". He knows how badly that hurt me and he chose to do it anyway. THose are his choices to make but it makes me feel like her feelings are more important than mine and when i state that i get the standard response.

The reason i say i am ruining our chance for recovery is what he says to me. I will never let it go and he does not want to live his life that way.

Last night he told me that his boss said they can not get him a new work phone. I asked him what he planned on doing if (and i am sure when) she contacted him again and there was just silence. So i asked if he could just hang up on her and he begrudgingly said "YES I WILL". So again i feel like that is a choice he is making for me not for himself. So i asked him what he wanted to do if she contacted him again and got the standard response and he changed the subject.

And i am not trying to make him the victim. She may have been the pursuer but it was his choice what he did with that pursuit and he obviously made a bad one. I just am not sure what his choice will be if she continues her pursuit (which i am sure she will).

I have given him many things to read that just get thrown in the trash with the standard response. He just plain does not want to talk about it at all yet he has no problem telling me things about her on the work front and things she has said and done to the company even though i have palinly told him i do not want ot talk about her in that way. I got more stories last night after the conversation about not getting a new cell phone.

The only thing i know to do is (like usual) just try to put my feeling aside and move forward and never talk about it again. I am just trying to figure out how to do that.

Still,
What are your boundaries? It is obvious that he doesn't want to feel bad about his A. He only wants to discuss parts of it that make him feel good. This is not a man who is helping your recovery in any way, nada.

So again, what are our boundaries? What are the things you need to reoover? You need to lay it out there. Heck write a list, give it to him. If he is not willing to assist in your marital and personal reoovery then what are you going to do about it?

Are you willing to accept this forever?

Your H is not stepping up to the plate.

Stuffing your feelings, is NOT the answer. Resentment kills M's. You can not find a loving, healthy R stuffing your feelings. It's already a huge problem.

What is your plan?

I have written a list and asked him to read it and he refused. I get the standard response. I have left it in a drawer and told him where it is and he has not looked at it still.

Like you said he does not want to discuss any of the "nasty things" about the A. So i am just at my wits end i do not know where to go from here. I do not want to feel this way for the rest of my life.

I keep telling myself that if things do not change by the time my youngest child leaves the nest (about a year and a half) that i am leaving with my child.

That is my plan i know not a very good one but a plan none the less.

He refused?

Ok let me get this straight
-Your WH (he has not earned the F) will not discuss the A with you. He won't give you details and he won't validate your feelings.
-He discusses the OW when he sees fit and he does it with fondness.
-He will not commit to NC. He still will talk to her if she calls.
-He yells at you when you express your feelings.

Is this accurate?

Still, to answer your title of this thread...no this is NOT recovery.

Why have you settled for just this? Can you last a year and a half?

Can you call the Harleys?

Yep that is it exactly. You hit the nail on the head for sure.

And i guess i have settled for this because of my children more than anything else. I do not want them to have to go through a divorce.

And i think i can last that long. I am hoping that i do not have to. I still have hope that he will some day see the error of his ways.

I do not think i can call the Harley's as i do not know where i could go to make the call. My children know of the affair but i do not want them to know much more because i do not want them to think that the way we are handling things is the "right way" so i keep as much from them as possible.

That is why i came here to i guess at least like you stated validate my feelings that i am not crazy for having the feelings that i have and for wanting more than my H is obviously willing to give.

First off i want to say that when i said exactly to your other post regarding my WH. There is one word i would change. He does not necessarily speak about the OW with "fondness". I do not think fondness is the correct word. It is more like "no big deal".

Like the evening that he said she was very attractive was in speaking about another person at his company that was resigning at the same time as the OW. This guy had sold us a car and was at our house and he as my H put it "undressed me with his eyes". And my H then proceeded to say something about how this guy was that way he used to grab the OW and push her up against the wall and act like he was doing something with her. And then i do not remember what i said but i said something about it and then that is when he said well all the guys in the office messed with her because she is very attractive and liked the attention. So i do not know if that is fondness but it still hurt my feelings and i told him so.

I also don't want anyone to think that he is some terrible ogre and why am i even wanting to try to save my M.

MG When you talk about preA boundaries (in the other post) i am not sure that any were set because i did not feel the need to set them. I mean he had always been a good H and father but he has ALWAYS been bad on the EN side for all of us. For the last 24 years (until Dec 2006) he has always went to work every day and came home every night, never went out with the boys, we spent all of our time together with our children as we both have the same feeling that is one of the most important things of bringing up a family is being involved in their lives. In the beginning of our M he played softball and i went with him before kids and after kids we all went. The one boundary that we both had set from the beginning of our relationship was the one i broke in saying that if either of us ever had an A the other one would be out of there.

I am not trying to make excuses for my H but like i said before the one good thing that we have done is talk about why it happened. Our M IMO had suffered for the last 4 years due to letting a family member live with us whom i did not really care for so we quit spending as much time together because he felt like he needed to entertain that family member (the family member is male by the way) and the family member is a total alcoholic and i did not like being around him so i kind of think we were not as close, then he lost his mother and he had issues with her (that i will not get into) that were unresolved, besides life in general there were stresses with his job etc. Even though i had the same stresses and did not chose to have an A so that is why i am saying i am not making excuses.

And then i set boundaries basically during the A. At first he was put on a job with the OW and they started talking while working together like any normal people would do. Then due to her damsel in distress ploy because her XBF was trying to hurt her, he tried to fix her up with the family member that was living at our house. In doing so they started "hanging out" together because i was working a second job and not home. She did not like the family member but they all hung out at the bar together. I know he put himself in the situation and one thing led to another.

I think he actually wanted to get caught because the he told me when he took the family member to her house and i threw a fit and told him that i did not like that and he would not like it if i did it either but i think by then he already was in the "fog" by then because it was one week later when he did not come home until midnight (this had not happened in 24 years so why would i not be suspicious). I asked him where he had been and he told me. He was filthy drunk and had ran into a pole with our vehicle (he had never drove when he had too much to drink before either because we were always together and i am not much of a drinker so he had a built in designated driver). Because he was so drunk he said a lot of things that night, he did not deny anything that happened. That is when i set boundaries about NC and the consequences for those boundaries. He chose to leave to think about it he was gone for three days (i am sure he seen her during these days but he did not stay there as he called me from where he was staying several times during that time frame and i have caller ID) and asked if he could come back home and i told him only if he could follow the boundaries (this was on a Friday). He said he could and i let him come home. For the next week i sensed he was not following those boundaries so i was watching him closely. The next Friday he came home late again and i asked him where he had been and he told me. He also told me he wanted to be with her so i made him leave. He came home on Sunday.

At that time i told him that he had to quit his job or we could not stay together. He started looking for a new job but two weeks after he came home is when his illness hit and i then became his nurse because he was so sick, he was out on disability for five months and during that time we put the A on the back burner and got him through it. The family member had left our house and we became very close again because he was so sick and i spent all my time getting him well and he relied on me and that is when we talked about what happened in our M and how to make it better.

But then when he had to go back to work is when my fears struck again because i could not handle contact with her again. And i guess for me i started dealing with the A in June 2007. By then he felt everything was done and over and i had nothing to worry about. He has been the same H he was preA since he went back to work except the things i have stated before. He is very loving and tries to show me how he cares, we have date nights now, lots of things, are M seems to be really good so why do i feel like i need the answers to my questions about the A. It really just sucks maybe i should just leave the past in the past and look to the future like he says.

Still, I understand a little bit better now.

Because of his illness you had to stop the A discussions, thus never getting the answers that you need to recover. Unfortunately, his refusal to discuss the A now, just is not going to work.

You've got a wound that is scabbed over, but it is getting infected. The only way to heal is to open it back up, and clean it out.

I can see why he feels this way...he thinks that after all of this time already, you should not have this need, but he doesn't realize that the details were not available to you on a uninterrupted timeframe. You never got what you needed then, but you still have the need.

After DDay I discussed the A daily for weeks, after that I would bring it up maybe once a week, then slowly it has dwindled to rarely. That is normal. If I had had to wait due to illness or absence or whatever, I would feel unrecovered until I got the information I needed.
They say it takes 2+ years to recover from an A, but only if the proper steps are taken during that time. Unfortunately, due to your H's illness, those steps were skipped.

There's a post out here somewhere describing the need of a BS to learn the details of the A. It's called Joseph's leter and I'll see if I can find it and post it to you. You should print it out and give it to your H.

ah, here it is:


Still,
What if you calmly told your H that you lovd him and want your M to work. That you need to discuss the A with him, but you understand that it is painful for him. Ask him if he'd be willing to open the conversations for a set period of time, maybe two months. During these two months you are allowed to discuss the A and ask questions, but you will stick to those particular questions during that session. You will remain on topic. Also these diecussions will have a time limit, say 30-45 minutes. And during those sessions you will try to remain calm and just listen.

After you will need to thank him for his honesty. And if you need to, you come HERE and vent, because some things you will learn will be painful. You don't want to scream at him for being honest.

And if he is not willing to have a face to face, how about a written conversation? You write the questions, he answers on paper. This has worked for me in the past.

Do you think he might go for it?

MG,

Awesome letter thanks for sharing. This looks like something i can do and maybe it will work. I will certainly give it a try i guess it can't make it worse. I will keep you posted on our efforts and thank you so much for listening and understanding you do not know how badly i needed that right now. Thank you, thank you, thank you.

You are welcome...and I'll be crossing my fingers.