I wouldn't believe a word that comes out of his mouth right now.

Don't worry so much about what he says. It's what he -does- that is important.

You've made your statement.. now watch.. demand transparency from him to enforce your boundary if he agrees to it. If he -doesn't-.. what are you going to do about it?

Time to start recognizing some of his war-tactics. He will use his anger to make you back down. Its worked for him before hasn't it? C'mon Sink, who has the right to be angry here? Its not HIM.



Next tactic. WH admit to the VERY LEAST that will make them seem honest and sincere. He will lie to your face. He will lie after swearing on his childrens lives. You are only hearing the tip of the iceburg. He told her that he loves you? Not a chance. Maybe that he "loves" you but isn't "in love" with you.

You need to be a warrior for your marriage. You are entitled to anger, not him. Stop questioning him about his affair, because he is not ready to be honest with you yet.
You will know when you have a remorseful husband. Thats when you can get to the bottom of some of these issues. For now, stay away from relationship talk.

Do you know what Plan A is?

Just a titch....also german...and the big one italian...more of that than the other two....hmmm maybe thats why my XH feared me. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

ahhhhh, no wonder you are a fighter! I wonder about sink?

A young jediwon like her just needs coucil she does. Guide her we can. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

ready for this....Irish and Italian...I told you before I never considered myself to be weak until this happened. I am a fighter...and when I fight watch out. Unfortunately I don't have it in me in this situation yet. I am blown away by the way this whole situation has shaken my whole foundation. I just have to get my feet back under me and get back to who I have always been. I know he thought I would be gone...he knows that my family is my weakness. We are both from divorced families and he knows how badly all my life I have dreamed of trying to have a "normal" family. It is (or was) my biggest dream...it truly was my only hope in life. To give my children the stability and a father that I never had...so this is truly devistating.

I just worry if you wait to long to get that motivation he WILL take advantage of that and do something to serious hurt you and your kids. He's fogged he doesn't see or care that it's affecting anyone else...as long as he's happy. Stupid man...can't put the kids first....Can I flog him mel...please just this once.

It may be that he figured that you wouldn't leave even if you had an affair because of how much you wanted a "normal" family.
Cherishing

sink - he gets mad at you because it WORKS. Any time he thinks you might interfere in his affair, he pulls out his anger and lets you have some. Your response is to immediately back down and get out of the way - which is exactly what he and his girlfriend want.

Until you stop letting his anger scare you, he will continue to do this so he can go on seeing his girlfriend in peace and still come back to you.

He gets mad at you because it WORKS.
Mulan

My ex got angry at me when I told him to cut down on the relationship. He was really nasty. Said "You don't dictate my friendships."

And he went to work and talked to the OW.

He came home and said he talked to her about my finding the letter, and she was "mortified" and got right on the phoen to her husband, all upset, "XYZ 's wife thinks we are involved in an affair, I am so mortified."

OWH offered that we all 4 get together and sit down and talk things over, and also that we do mroe things together as families. I backed down.

"The families" went on a weekend trip to Sea World. "The families" stayed at a fancy hotel. Guess who didn't join us? OWH and their son, who had gone to England for soccer.

I felt like a mother in law on a honeymoon. Watched them together all weekend, so compatible, so similar in appearance, I smiled woodenly.

A year later, I got the "speech" that we all know so well.

10 yrs later, we are divorced.

My Achilles heel was that my family was a divorce family. I hung in as long as possible.

You're heading my way, sink.

I am really not making much progress...but gaining strength. I am still holding my ground. I know he will be more angry before this gets better. I am definately closer to confronting the two of them. I thought of sending am e-mail this morning and just cc to her...I guess that's petty though...Oh well, can't do everyhting right all the time. I obviously to my dismay didn't do the marriage thing right. She was at football last night, I kept daydreaming about just saying something to her...just something to just make a little progress...I did ask my kids to stay with me and not go to OW. They just can't understand...they are 3 and 5. They did do much better. It was when they were over there, that I was thinking of just going to get them and say something smart in the process. Remember I told you about that Italian and Irish blood...I fear I would do something regretable everytime I get close to her...I am little but very strong.... I know I can't go there, but I do have a bad temper so I keep my distance...I think my anger stage is good, cause it makes me see things a little more clearly. Maybe I will actually get angry enough to fight!

There is no winning a physical fight here... just ask LilSis.. it's nothing but trouble.

You are here to fight for your Marriage.. not fight the other woman directly.

You've been given the guidance you need.. it's up to you to act on it. We can't do it for you, but we can show you the way. The rest is between you, your husband and God.

The longer you -don't- act.. the further entrenched they will be.. you're putting pressure on him to cut her off, which is good.. but he's going to find ways to sneak around you. DON'T fool yourself into thinking this is enough.

Read the thread by Pepperband at the top of this forum.. look at the posts in there.. ESPECIALLY the carrot and stick of Plan A.

Plan A probably won't work.. but it'll get you to where you will need to be when you go into Plan B.. which is what -will- work.. if you follow the path. If you don't.. well, then you're just about guaranteed to lose your husband and your family as you know it.

Your call Sink... but -you- need to get off your knees, like yesterday.

Here Is why I question how hard to work on this...I always felt loved, but at the same time sometimes I feel like he didn't LIKE me that much. I would always run late...packing the car if we would go somewhere etc. I have four children all with -in 7 years. Instead of helping he would go to the car and be pissed and honk the horn etc. If I yelled loudly out in public if I was looking for one of my kids or something he would get furious. If I put my hair behind my ear he would say I looked old...I think even though he loves me, sometimes he's not a very happy man...that rubs off on all of us. He is the most sensative with his kids, and loves them very much. Not a caregiver though...the fun dad. and not very patient. They definately feel his love though. I'm worried he will chose to stay and then later regret his move, that's why I am still deciding whether to fight, or just use the get-out-of-marriage-free card.

Sending an email to whom about what?


Acting out of anger would be DISASTEROUS. You would not be in control if you did that and would only be handing them ammunition to use against you.

What is required here is a CONTROLLED, MEASURED, STRATEGIC assault on the affair. Waiting for some FEELING [of anger] to come along and motivate you is an exercise in futility [unless you are a silly teenage girl]. You will NEVER "FEEL" like fighting. NO ONE DOES. You must MAKE A DECISION to ACT.

Your feelings have BETRAYED you by paralyzing you with FEAR. That is why you are losing your marriage. If you are going to make it, you are going to have to put your feelings aside and ACT WITH DETERMINATION and RESOLVE. Reacting to your FEELINGS have got you into this mess.

Your FEELINGS are your greatest enemy right now.

I just felt like writing or calling to clearly say...I am not going to lay down and let you take my husband, my children, my family and my life. This is exactly why I am not actively doing something.....I float from one emotion to another day to day...I can never just get on track....I am going to defend my newly announced boundry...my feet are in firm now, and if he threatens to leave again, I will move into the guest room for now. Just till we decide together how to handle the children. I went and read the thread...I would like to print it out for him to read. I also just spoke to his best friend today that he needs someone to talk to right now. I told him not to defend me anymore, but just to help him work through his feelings and figure out what he really wants here. My WH sent me an e-mail yesterday asking me what exactly I needed him to do and when it needed to be done by, so he could figure out where he stands. by the way...I wish I was a teenager..I'm 38.

Don't you want your husband to put aside his "feelings" and DO THE RIGHT THING?

Same applies to you.

This isn't about feelings. Its about marriage, family, commitment, integrity, character.

DO THE RIGHT THING. Fight for your family.

NO NO NO NO NO NO.

What ar you THINKING, sink?

Don't you remember what I warned? DO NOT SHARE THIS SITE WITH YOUR HUSBAND.

DO NOT PRINT THE THREAD OUT FOR HIM. KEEP HIM AWAY FROM HERE.

MarriageBuilders is your secret weapon. Go back and read Pep's Carrot and Stick, and re-read all of our posts. To yourself.

Go back and read about exposure. Do not confront that woman. She is nothing. MASS EXPOSURE, and post what you plan to say/write here. We will help you get it clear, concise and right. The simpler the better.

Your husband does not respect you. That's what all the petty criticisms are about. He will dislike you intensely if you expose. But he WILL respect you. Likeing will return in time.

EXPOSE ALL AT ONCE. THE OW IS NOT WORTH YOUR ATTENTION. DO NOT GIVE ANY WARNING.

AND DO NOT MOVE INTO THE GUEST ROOM. [more about that later .....]

Follow Plan A. Unless you want to be in my shoes.

you know people talk about thse light bulb moments...I just had one. That is one thing I feel like I never earned from him. Everyone around us is always telling him how lucky he is etc....but he never sees it. I take on a lot with raising my children. I do things for him, I mow the grass...it's a lot. I clean, I cook, I parent, I always guess I thought if I could just do more and better he would respect me. I do everyhting I do with four kids in tow, just to not burden him any more than necessary. I don't know how he can ever gain that respect for me. He wanted me to work again...which how can I do if we would have to pay daycare for 4 children? So I started my own home daycare business part-time, where I earn almost what I was making when I was working full-time making almost $40,000 a year. . I don't think I can ever earn his respect. I bet she has his respect though, broke up a marraige and then another, raising two kids on her own, working and carrying on an affair with a married man all at the same time...wow, she is amazing!

sinkingin,

Your husband doesn't have much respect for you because you're weak inside. You let him treat you like a doormat. Your plan about talking to the other woman will accomplish nothing.

Not only do I think you're weak, but I also think you're selfish. You're doing tremedous harm to your children by not standing up for yourself, your marriage and your children's family. Why didn't you stand up for them... because you did not expose the affair like you should have done due to the uncomfortableness, shame, pitty, etc. that you might get from others when they found out. You're protecting your own face at the expenses of your marriage and your children.

Your weakness and low selfesteem will make your husband respect you less and less and that's something he can probably find and respect in this other woman or someone else.

said it before and i will say it again....go watch "diary of a mad black woman" You may see a mirror image a bit in the lead actress's role. I love how she eventually lets her anger out....and her grandma media is just awesome...if we all could be so bold. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />