This is all pretty typical, Ani. If it wasn't traveling that came between you, it would have been him CHOOSING to extend his hours at work (where his OW was, just coincidentally <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" /> ).

Your reactions right now, your rollercoaster of emotions, is pretty normal. This is when many people want to contact their WS again; stick to the darkness. Talking to a wayward is just not worth it. It will hurt you much more, and feed his LB with EN's being met by you. You want him to SUFFER the loss of you doing ANYTHING for him.

He made a string of choices, that lead him toward the A. They had nothing to do with you. It's only after we realize that we've made bad choices that we then try to conjure up the excuses to match the behavior. His excuse is that you were growing apart.

It's also not uncommon for a WS to say that they have been unhappy for so much longer BEFORE the A. I've heard this myself; I heard this just a couple of weeks ago.

I call Bullpucky on that! We may not have been dancing in the streets, but we were happy for quite a long time during the course of our M. It really wasn't until after he started working at his current place of employment that PWC expressed ANYTHING about his unhappiness, or dissatisfaction. By then, he was well on his way to his first A.

Ani, you will find that WS's say a lot to justify their behavior, when it's really unjustifiable.

You are conflicted right now, up and down, on that coaster ride. You'll know how you really feel when you level off a bit, and that won't happen right away.

I know I love my husband. I just get so mad when I think of all the stupid things he says to justify his affair. What really bugs me though is that he truly believes it. If he ever gets out of the fog will he see how stupid those comments are..or do they still somehow want to save face. I don't think I could ever be with him if he doesn't understand how insensitive he's been. Do they realize one day that they were insensitive? After he moved out the second time he seems even more fogged out. I'm not so sure that he is with her though. He appears to be very cross all the time and not happy when I see him. (at drop of and pick up/ from afar) Last time when he was cake eating he was really happy and sweet to me. This time he actually appears to be still mad over some exposure. How long will that last? I thought they got over it. I think it's been two weeks.

It will take him however long it will take him, Ani. I know that's not what you want to hear, but it's true.

My FWH hasn't expressed that he understands how cruel he was. He hasn't expressed much about his behavior at all, except to attempt to justify it (early on).

I've heard that many WH's express remorse later, when the fog has completely cleared, which could be a significant amount of time. I see the fog as a safety net for the WS; it allows them to hide from the truth, from their own pain, and disappointment in themselves. This is just my take, from my experience. I think it depends on how easily a person can turn the mirror on themselves and face their demons, as to how long the fog exists.

Just let you WH have his anger. DO NOT take it in any way as your FAULT. It is not. His resulting anger from the exposure is his to own. When we lie, we pay the price, especially when confronted with those who won't stand for it.

Again, it's early in this whole thing, Ani. If you continue in your darkness, he will be forced to deal with his anger by himself, as long as you step aside.

I'm out for now. I hope he's hurting as much as I am. It's sad to have the holidays coming and think he's happy about the way things are. My only hope is that he does seem to cry a lot (at least before..not sure now). I feel like he's depressed and doesn't sleep well. Maybe he's fine now that he's moved out again. I just hope that at times he does struggle with his choices.

I have no idea whether he struggles or not. If i were to hazard a guess, I would say that this decision is not as cut and dry as you think. For my FWH, he said that there was much that he missed about home. The flip side of that coin is that there was much he liked about being out there on his own, running around, doing whatever, answering to no one, probably not even himself.

Ani, you will know you have made progress when the thoughts you have of your WH are fewer; When your focus is more on personal recovery. What you are going through is normal. All of the speculation and such, is normal. In order to begin healing, though, you must force yourself to stop asking the questions ( which no one but your H can answer), eventually, and start focusing on your own anger and pain.

Update...Spoke to WH on the phone about Christmas plans with the kids. He didn't seem angry and was actually nice. I kept the talk about our plans only. Question...He wanted to know if he could switch weekends because his work Christmas party was when he had the kids. I said I would check my calendar and get back with him. I did however (just being honest) say that I will not watch our children so he can go to a Christmas party with her. He said don't worry she's not going to be there. I left it at that. Do I switch weekends? I could offer to watch them on the night of the party only. Opinions please.

Ani, have you ended your Plan B entirely?

NO Mel...needed to square away the Christmas details. He contacted me. I know I'm suppose to have intermediary contact him, but some people say if contact is about the children and you keep it short that's OK. No other talk.

Here it comes......THWACK!!!!(2x4 upside the head)

Ani, what the h3ll are you doing TALKING to your WH? This is Plan B, girl, stick with it!

He got a fix, and now you've got to deal with the emotional knocks you are going to take over talking to him. This is not Plan B. If you MUST communicate directly, have it be through email. No voices, no tone, just business. Did you ever secure a new intermediary? If not, then stick to email until you can. Do not pick up that phone again.

You are teaching him that you don't stick by your word, and that you will break Plan B whenever, no big whoop. He won't take this seriously, Ani, and he will feel no real consequences, for you will loosen up even more over time and then Plan B will be non-existent.

About your plans, that's up to you. He can find babysitters if he needs to, just as you can, in a bind. You don't necessarily HAVE To rely on one another for that sort of help. I know what you are thinking too; that he will be angry if you say no. Well, tough break toots! When you come home, we'll discuss sharing the load, until then, you are on your own!

Wow, that was an angry outburst--Don't use that! Anyway, you need to start making decisions for you and what's in the best interest of the kids, NOT YOUR WH. If you would relish the extra time with your kids, by all means, take them that night, but don't do it out of some guilt trip you are putting on yourself.

TALK by email.

Any contact at all defeats the purpose. No email, no talking, no smoke signals.


Unfortunately, some people don't understand plan B.

I would just abandon plan B because it is causing more damage to do a half assed Plan B than staying in a perpetual Plan A. Continuous contact in Plan B defeats the purpose, ruins your credibilty and comes across as giving him the cold shoulder. It also helps him stay out there longer because he knows he still has complete control over you.

Honestly, if you don't think you can DO Plan B, then don't do Plan B. But this is not Plan B.

He now knows that you will not stick to the darkness.

No talking to him, AT ALL, unless someone is bleeding from their ears. It's not neccesary, at all, so don't make excuses. Get an intermediary.

If you want this to be affective, you've got to stay dark, otherwise, it's not Plan B.

You are not in the business of pleasing him anymore, Ani. You are in the business of enlightening him as to how things are going to be without you in his life. You talking to him shows him more of the same of what you two have been doing.

Thanks girl. I can always count on you for the tough stuff. Email will be a good option. I will email him back regarding plans. Do they really get a fix from just one call. Itwasn't like we talked about us. Anyway, this is my suggestion. I offer to watch the kids Sat night for his work party and he can have them Sunday night also. (usually I have them). That gives him an extra night with them. Sounds fair?

Again, this is your choice Ani. Life isn't fair. If he wants to GIVE UP his time with them, that's his choice. It's not for you to coddle him. It's a fine line. I would want my kids to have time with their dad, FOR the kids. I would NOT like to pick up the slack for a WH. Fine line.

If you can get an intermediary, please do. It's the best way to show your seriousness. If you cannot, make sure to inform him that he is NEVER to call you at home again or work or cell, barring a REAL emergency having to do with the children.

Ani, you should not contact him via email, contact is contact. That is what the intermediary is for. Like I said before, it is better to not pretend like you are in Plan B if you are not willing to do it. If you are not willing to do Plan B, just end it and go forward.

EMAIL is not an option for plan B and never has been.

I put that the wrong way. Everything is optional. You can do whatever you please because it is your life. BUT....if you want Plan B to be effective, all contact must end. If you don't want it to ever be effective, then keep doing what you are doing.

What is truly not optional is doing something the WRONG WAY and expecting it to turn out right.

Ani, it's also not just about his fix, but yours. Every time you pick up that phone, you are HOPING that he will give you some glimmer of hope. UNTIL he is complying with the points you laid out in your Plan B letter, talking to him is futile.

It's like quitting smoking, yet having one now and then, to cut the craving. Then the smoking becomes more frequent, and EXCUSES abound as to why you need just one more ciggy today, then you are a full blown pack-a-day smoker again. The best thing to do is go cold turkey and make the decision that the bad habit STOPS here.

Ask a close friend to be your intermediary. Tell them what all it entails (filtering emails, calls, just business relayed back to you, and the same FROM you to him. No voices, no emotions, nothing). Let them know that the WH could get snippy or try to circumvent the system, and you will need them to remain neutral. Have a rule set up in your email that his mail gets auto forwarded to her, if it comes to you first.

So email is not an option either. I just emailed before I got these messages stating I would watch the kids Sat night and he could pick them up when he is finished with his work party. Also, offered to let him have them Sunday night if he would like. He replied "why the email" then went on to say he will take care of next weekend. I replied back OK.

He replied "why the email"...(thoughts in his head)..."we were having such a good rapore on the phone now, and things for me are much easier that way, so why the email. C'mon Ani, let's just co-parent. Let's just be buds and forget this whole mess; act like it's all okay, for me, okay?"

YUCK, Ani!

Well, so you emailed, so what, now get that intermediary, and have this all go through her, resending the PBL, stating (by the intermediary) that Ani can no longer have direct communication with you, unless and until you end your A, and agree to recovery Otherwise, all information is to be funnelled through me (the intermediary), via this email address and this phone number. Please do not contact Ani directly.

Ani, this is really an important step, Plan B. You need to stick to it for it to be at all effective.

Ani, I suggest that you consult with the Harleys in order to set up your plan B if you haven't already done so. Everyone's situation is different.

I certainly don't want to mix it up with Mel, but Jennifer is the one who told me that email communication was okay and that "it's not realistic to have zero communication when you have small children." Her words.

When I was using an intermediary, it was behind the scenes--mail from my WW got forwarded to my intermediary, who screened it and sent it on. At one point, I asked Jennifer if I should tell my WW about this--that she was being screened. Jennifer said no, I shouldn't bother. Jennifer has told me that "if she comes back to the marriage, it won't be because of anything that I do."

This is my take, based on my conversations with Jennifer and observations here: Plan B has multiple purposes, all designed to restore the marriage. In order of importance:

1) Preserve your willingness to reconcile by protecting you from Wayward Behavior and FogSpeak. Waywards are thoughtless, hurtful, insensitive creatures. The more you talk to them, the more it will drain whatever is left in your love bank.

2) Protect the wayward from you. If you are exposed to Wayward Behavior, it will Trigger you. You may get angry and want to lash out at them. If you do this, it will be a love-buster to them and confirm for them in their mind that they are better off without you and thus justify their waywardness.

3) Stop meeting their emotional needs. Waywards want to get their needs met in both places (cake-eating). Contact with you, chatting about something cute that the kids did, helping you with something around the house--this meets an EN for him. If you cut that off, he has to find it elsewhere. Eventually, most adulterous relationships fall apart because infidels can't meet all of each other's ENs.

The darker you can make your plan B, the more effective it will be. If you can get an intermediary, great. It's worth it. Intermediary is a tough gig, though, and not easy to get right. If you can't find one, does it mean you should give up on your marriage? I'm not so sure.

My plan B is far from perfect. Some will tell you it's not even a real plan B (maybe that's why Mel doesn't post to me), but it's going as designed by Jennifer.

All situations are different. If you haven't consulted directly with the Harleys to get a plan, I strongly recommend that you do so.

In the mean time, stay dark! Absolutely stop talking to him, and keep the emails few, short, and businesslike.