Hey Chai,

You've got some great posters giving you ways to cope with this new development. I'm sure you'll do well as you improve yourself and make that personal recovery. If he follows through with the D, so be it. You'll never waste your personal recovery effort regardless what he does......it just may be too late for him.

{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{chai}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

Ace

I am not sure that there was a big “aha moment”.

It happened over time.
In the end – I was the one who filed for the D. I could see that he was not capable of making rational decisions at that time. When he first left he said “You don’t need to worry. Everything will be just the same around here. I will still help pay the bills, and take care of the house. The only difference is that I won;t live here anymore” He honestly believed that! That was my first hint that he really did not have a clue what he was getting himself into. I said “so….this GF of yours will pay for everything for the two of you” and he said “Yes!! She loves me that much!!”

Of course it didn’t take long before he was telling me that he didn’t live at the house anymore, so he shouldn’t have to pay the bills, and after all, he needed to help out OW. She needed his help.

With each month, his contributions to the family finances got smaller, and I knew I had to do something. And by then – he was really doing weird things. He showed up at my door one day wearing a t-shirt and shorts, with his work badge (seciruty guard at a college) pinned to the waistband of his shorts, and he was wearing a holster with his pistol. Just walked up to the door like that. I started laughing, which clearly irritated him. I said “what are you, the sheriff” and then he got mad and took off. He was 42 years old, and trying to play cop. OW actually was a cop, so apparently he had started wearing a gun and badge when he wasn’t work (he wasn’t even allowed to carry a gun at work – although he has always hidden one in his pants” That was a small turning point with me. I realized that if we got back together, I would have to accept some of these life style changes from him – like openly packing a pistol.

When he did make his feeble attempt at reconciliation I told him that my boundaries included: no more porn, no more relationships with other women – other than as a couple, and he had to get counseling. Fairly simple. After a couple of weeks of dating he told me that he really didn’t think he needed counseling, because he was not longer upset about losing his OW. And I said: The counseling is not about your break up from a 9 month R with OW. It is to help you figure out why you were able to easily abandon your wife of 18 years. I could care less about your break up with OW. And he just said that he really felt like he didn’t need counseling. Meanwhile, his cell phone was constantly ringing with calls from women he met at match.com.

I finally told him that I had the sense that he did not value me as a person, and did not want to make the kind of commitment it would take for us to build a new R. He only saw me as one of many available, single woman, for him to date, and he should just take me off that list. He just said “Ok” and that was it. He really is clueless.

I never talk to him anymore. My boys are 17, and 20, so they just talk to their dad directly. I think I spoke to him twice in this past year. I am not mad at him – I just see no reason to talk to him anymore. His life has moved into an entirely different direction. He married OW#2, and I have no doubt that he has a lot of regrets.

The boys do not tell me much about their dad, or his W. But I remember when my Ex was a family man. We would have family over for holidays. We would stay up late on Christmas Eve wrapping gifts for the boys, and reminiscing. His current wife is on her 3 rd M. her two boys bounce back and forth between her house and their dads, depending on who they are fighting with.

I knew OW#2 for years –a nd she is just not a stable person. I sometimes pity WxH, but then I remember the many, many times I asked him to come home, and work with me to build a new M. But he always said “I don’t need a new M. I only need OW”

And at this point, I truly do not want him to suffer. I would love to see him find a truly good W, who would take care of him, and get him back into a life style that involved family gatherings, and a peaceful home. But I do not think he can get there with current wife. I suspect that he will end up divorced – and then perhaps he will finally quit looking for the high drama, and find a good life partner instead.

My posts are always too long. I am sorry about that.

Queenie

I love you lots! And I promise I wasn't holding back!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> Some of the stuff WH said after D-day was so, so stupid I don't think my mind could process it...LOL!!

Call me saturday, 'k? Can't wait to hear how Hansel responds to the goodies!

Smartie

WofF5

Thank you for posting--and don't worry about your posts being too long! I am a WORD person--writing, reading, even bad singing. LOL!! Conversation is definitely one of my top ENs! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Quote:"With each month, his contributions to the family finances got smaller, and I knew I had to do something. And by then – he was really doing weird things. He showed up at my door one day wearing a t-shirt and shorts, with his work badge (seciruty guard at a college) pinned to the waistband of his shorts, and he was wearing a holster with his pistol. Just walked up to the door like that. I started laughing, which clearly irritated him. I said “what are you, the sheriff” and then he got mad and took off. He was 42 years old, and trying to play cop. OW actually was a cop, so apparently he had started wearing a gun and badge when he wasn’t work (he wasn’t even allowed to carry a gun at work – although he has always hidden one in his pants” That was a small turning point with me. I realized that if we got back together, I would have to accept some of these life style changes from him – like openly packing a pistol."

Wow--it is so funny you say this. I was just thinking the other day that is another reason I am not inclined to reconcile with WH. I realized I'd have to deal with the little (or major) changes he'd picked up living with OW -- YUCK.

And it's interesting, even though I'm still less than a year out from d-day, I am at a point that I don't want my WH to suffer either. My hope is that he comes out of the fog at some point and ends the A with OW, gets serious about figuring himself out, and one day finds a woman of good morals and character who can uplift him and help him grow as a child of God. My concern is that he will have done so much damage to himself in so many ways in the A, he may not be able to get back to a place that is healthy and blessed.

But he is God's now...as am I.

Smartie

Sorry about the latest news. Stay in Plan B. Stall the divorce if you can. The affair will end.

To all of you who replied to my post regarding the D, thank you. As it turns out however, he did not file for D. In fact, he has not even responded to the LSA yet. Looks like my Atty’s assistant emailed me in error regarding all of this. So now I’m back where I started Monday.

WofF, you had a great post as always. And they are NOT too long. I love your posts because you are a very wise woman and always make very valid points, and I always love reading about your experience in this. It always helps to hear about the experience of someone else in coping with these A’s. And when you talk about how they come back and that it may not be with heart in hand, I had to think about that. Shouldn’t there be some remorse here? How do you know they really want to recover if there is no remorse? I think that I would need that to move forward.

Smartie, sounds like the two of us have a similar sitch. With no kids in the picture (mine is grown) there doesn’t seem to be a reason for them to return. Not sure where you are financially, but mine doesn’t even have to pay spousal support. He just has to take the debt that he ran up, although he has found a way to blame me for that too. Go figure. And you made a very good point that I hadn’t even thought of before – can I accept the changes that he has picked up living with OW? Wow, that really made me think. I remember he said one day that he wanted me to wear tight clothing. I wondered then if that was something that OW did. I’m sure that’s where it came from. YUK, that makes me sick to think of it – that he would want me to be like her.


Ace, Who, and Believer, thanks for looking in on me. Believer, you are still my role model for personal recovery. I liked you suggestion of planting a garden, so I bought a few books this week to start planning my garden. Actually, it’s a 6x10 deck, but I can get a few nice pots and hanging baskets out there. Unlike San Diego though, I won’t be able to do it here until Spring.

Anyway, thanks all. I'm going to put pressure on to get the LSA signed so that I protect myself. He's probably running up more debt as I write....

Interesting development (or un-development <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />)...... LC posted on the Vacation thread about signs.....wonder what might have made that asst. make such an error....hmmmmmmmm..... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />. This may have been a simple mistake, or was it????

What D thought processess resonated with you when you THOUGHT he had filed the D?

At any rate...keep focusing on your personal recovery like Believer has......you can do it, Chai....keep us posted.

Ace

Ace,

I just don't know what it means other than I may have a bum attorney. I still haven't been able to talk with him because he has been out. Maybe it was a sign regarding the LSA - a reminder that I need to get that finalized to protect myself from any additional debt that WH may be incurring due to the A.

DD talked with him had he was still very hostile. Said he didn't even have an atty and that he didn't want to see her or talk to me, and that he would never come back here. We guess that he now lives in OPs state which is about 10 hours away.

So if he doesn't have an atty, I guess he isn't going to sign the LSA. Since he said that he didn't want to be M, not sure why he's dragging his feet. In any case, I need to push it because I don't want to be respnsible for anymore of his debt.

Will keep you posted.

Hey Chai!!

Thanks for posting your update. I have been thinking about you since you mentioned this yesterday.

Just what IS up with everyone seeing "signs" lately?

I've been having this connection lately with my DIL and DD where we are on the same wavelength. It's freaky weird good!

Okay, NOT freaky weird, just good!!

And the other day when I had to go see my Doberman, HE started talking about signs.

So, maybe something really big is going to happen for humankind soon.

I'm gonna go read up on the Recovery thread now.

I'm glad that this turned out to be an error in your favor. Like you, though, wofF's post made me think a lot, too.

Have a great day!!

Chai

Financially I'm actually pretty good. Since I made higher income of the two of us, I can't get support from him but I don't need it anyway.

What I am more grateful for is that in N.Carolina since he committed adultrey and now shacks up with OW he cannot get any alimony or spousal support from ME. His credit card and student loan and car note are his debts alone so no worries there. I want the LSA for only two reasons: to get the house and to get him to waive his rights to my 401k and pension from my job. If he wants OW, more power to him. But I am not going to just sit back and let him deplete all I've worked for over the years to be with some trollop.

I think in the end he'll sign, he's just stalling until he's forced to do something once I file for the D. But I can wait, in Plan B I can wait.

Oh and BTW my WH made the same comment about me wearing tight clothing. Know that was direct result of time with OW!! YUCK!!! Where is that puking icon when I need it! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Smartie

I heard the comment about the clothing too
In my case it was:
"You never dressed sexy enough for me!"

Hey Char,

Not sure what is going on with the signs. Reminds me of that song "signs, signs, everywhere are signs." Something about "long-haired freaky people need not apply." Can't remember who sang that one.

Smartie, I'm with you girl. I was the bread winner for many years, and a lot of them I paid more in taxes than he made. And yes, I have a much bigger 401K that I will fight for. I sure as h3ll ain't letting a loser looking for a sugar daddy live it up on my dime. I worked over 20 years for it and I'll go in the trenches over that one.

Are you filing for the D?? Do you have a thread somewhere that I can read??

WofF, I wonder if all BW's hear that one about the tight clothes. We should take a poll on that.

Chai

My preference would be that my WH file for the D actually since he chose to bust up the marriage, but alas, knowing him he won't do anything (in his silly wayward mind, I'm convinced he won't file for the D because once I'm officially out of the picture he knows won't have anyone to fall back on once the A busts up--gotta keep those options open!) So the final act to end the M will also be left for me to do.

I am looking forward that day--ending my M to him will be a MAJOR milestone in moving on and recovering for me. I cannot tell you how much I DO NOT wish to be connected with my WH/H, whatever anymore. I just want to be done so we can move on with our lives separate from each other. Even though I am working hard for my own recovery and doing better every day, each day I am married to him seems like a waste because I remain the wife of someone who isn't even worthy to have the title of husband. I don't wish him ill will, I just want him truly out of my life.

I don't mean to whine. Maybe becasue it's the holidays I'm more emotional, maybe I'm just tired of waiting to be free of him. And I know from reading the stories here and knowing other people whose lives have been touched by divorce (whether infidelity was a factor or not) that I am blessed. Thanks to Plan B, no kids and the ability to take care of myself without him I've not suffered half the drama and heartache other have.

I just want to be free of him. Completely. I think God is trying to teach me patience in this process--and in that area I am not the best student. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

My thread was posted late June of this year. Called "ready to throw in the towel." It's short because I offically started posting when my WH moved out and I was ready to go into Plan B. I lurked and read on MB and SAA and HNHN after D-day in the hopes of trying to recover the M, but WH emptied my ol'love bank pretty quickly because he flaunted his desire to cake-eat and openly disrepected me by continuing to lie, deceive and manipulate even after the A was revealed.

Keep fighting for what is yours and what you've worked for...I'm right there with you!

Smartie

Well, good to hear that he hasn't filed for divorce. I still think he will be back.

Mine is running hot and heavy about getting back together. It is the CRAZIEST thing. All of the points that I used against the affair and ending the marriage, he is now using FOR us getting back together. "we had a good marriage, he was just depressed, we need to be together for the family, the relationship with OW wasn't exactly made in heaven, and blah, blah, blah.

The one that gets to me the most is that I was a wonderful mom to his kids, and grandma to our grandkids, and I deserve to have them in my life. And that is AFTER ALMOST FIVE YEARS without them!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Missing out on all the little things that happened in their lives, missing the holidays together, the barbecues, and all the outtings.

You see, when he left, he rode out on his Harley and darn near RAN ME OVER. He couldn't wait to escape. And he turned into the coldest man I've ever known. I was like an old used piece of furniture - just there and in his way.

He immediately took OW to all family functions, and she was welcomed in my place.

But OOPS, the affair ended. In his mind, now he can continue on with me without skipping a beat - OW and I are just kind of interchangable pieces in his life.

So he is calling, coming by announced, leaving messages, and sending flowers. When I stopped answering the phone and tossed his letters, he started bothering me at work.

He left a message yesterday. My secretary played it in the morning and I was mortified. It was all "I love you and know I F'd up, please take me back, blah, blah, blah........."

Okay, rant over. But WHEN THE AFFAIRS ENDS, he will be back. So look out.

Smartie,

Mine did the same thing - after the A was revealed continued to cake-eat. I thought that it was just a silly meaningless fling, but 5 months later I found that he never ended it. That's about the time I found MB and learned about these things and how they really work. How long were you M??? I would still try to recover at this point, although every day that passes I find that I think about it less and less. Most days now when I'm working, I hardly think about it. I think that Plan B is great because it really does give you some peace and relief from the hurt and pain.

Believer, I can't believe your xH!!! Why do they think that they can just waltz back in after they've cast you aside like trash? Still, you have to feel some type of relief, vindication, whatever, just to see him in this state of mind. After what he put you through, a little satisfaction is in order here. Sounds like he may not go away so easily this time. I'm still looking up to you as my role model. Waiting to see if you cave..... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Oh, I'm not going to cave. I found someone I like better. His loss. And it is disturbing to hear him babbling away, saying the same reasons that I used to give for us staying together.

Your hubby at least didn't completely abandon you. Mine was out of here.

So hang in there and make a nice life for yourself. I'm sure he'll be along soon enough. You just have to give the affair a little time to start rotting.

Once they think the marriage is done, they start realizing that they may have made a big error. Like they say, an affair needs a marriage to survive.

Hey Chai

WH and I began dating our junior year in college (1988) and married in 1998--so married 9 years this November! So we have a LONG history--sort of grew up together.

And like you, I find that when I'm at work or with other people or keeping super busy I really don't think about WH much at all. Sundays are the worst because I have the most down time on that day -- and that was a day that was special for me and WH during the M(we usually reserved that day for US time). But I'll get through--I've come this far after all. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Believer

Girl, you are my personal guru in terms of personal recovery! When I first came to MB and you began posting to me I sensed my situation would end up like yours (WH and I would divorce and the A would bust up soon after but he would still hang out there for awhile).

I laughed when you posted you XWH wanted to reconcile. I SO see my WH wanting to do the same after he's pouted for a respectable period of time once he and OW are kuput. LOL!! And I see him acting as crazy as your xWH.

So I am on the the lookout and ready to keep him out. Silly waywards...do they really think we'll just sit around pining and waiting forever?!?

You stay strong. You are on such a good path for yourself.

Smartie

Believer,

I chuckled when I read your post. In my eyes, my WH did abandon me. He travelled, called every evening and we talked like everything was fine, then he hung up and went home with OW. I think I'd rather have it like your WH who left on the bike and told you he was going to live with OP. At least you knew the truth. It's bad either way you look at it though. An A is an A is an A - BAD no matter how it is conducted. But girlfriend, I'm going to come out the other side just like you did. You got run over with a Harley, I got run over with a bus, but girlfriends survive.

Smartie, you will come out the other end too. We are fortunate that we can support ourselves. Although I feel like I let my WH off too easily by getting a job too soon. I should have stayed in my business full time and made him pay support. But, that's the feminist in me.

We grew up together and started dating in high school, so we also had a long history. M 35 years, so that is hard to forget. Yes, Sundays are a little harder but I'm actually starting to look forward to them so I can play at home doing my painting etc.

How 'bout we do a BW "reunion" for those of us in Plan B or Plan D??

If you do that B/D reunion exclusively, I'm crashing the party. LOL <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

I am so focused on my self-recovery that I am surprised when my FWH sticks along for the ride. I don't want to sound uppity or condescending, so forgive me in advance if my post may be mis-perceived.

Like I've told you before, Chai, I saw myself totally making it alone on D-Day #4. (I saw it partially after D-Days #1, 2, and 3, too, but it was complete after #4 and I did not back down like before.)

I think it was when he saw my mindset that he woke up (like Believers WH) and dissolved his fog. Yeah, it was about as quick as could be expected, but I am thoroughly convinced that it was because I stood my ground. For the 30 minutes of our confrontation, when I was making those plans in my head (instead of taking our 10 day vacation, I was mentally preparing to sell the house, take the proceeds and start over at 53), WH SAW that I was serious.

As soon as he said "I'll just leave..." (at 2-3 AM), I merely said "OK" so he started towards the door. Previously, I backed down and said I wanted to talk about it more. He had then relaxed, knowing he had another chance. Somehow, when I did not back down that early morning, he had to make the choice, not depend on me to 'cave in'. (Later he said that my resolve spoke LOUDLY and that in the next few seconds as he headed for the door, he saw in his mind what he would be missing.)

I know I am fortunate that he changed so quickly and it does make it easier for me. But the same potential is there for him to relapse as if I had PlanA/B/D'd him for years.

SO..... I see myself as on a self-recovery mission that is constantly inspired when I see stories from Post D 'godesses' like WoF and Believer and Jinga and Josie and CJ and so many others. I was in that mindset for 32 years and then after WH had his A, it gave me what I needed to develop my own self-recovery. It is a wonderful bonus that WH is now 'F'WH (as far as I know a year later) amazing me every day. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

So that's why I'm crashing the party....I'm just like you in my mind (focusing on B/D self-recovery), but my DH just happens to be along for the ride instead of running me over with a Harley or Greyhound. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />

Ace

Hey Ace,

You can crash our party anytime!!! Would love to have you!

I am focused on self-recovery now. The good thing is that I now *know* I can make it alone. I guess that I always knew that, but was a little scared.

I'm glad your FWH is along for the ride!! I think that the difference in my sitch is that he actually lived with OW. Harder to break that up I guess when the BS actually becomes more of the OW.

But I removed myself from that triangle and I am NOT the BS/"like the OW" anymore.

I made a lot of mistakes before I found MB and don't know if I can recover from them. I thought I did a pretty good Plan A, but there were a few crying spells, AO's, LB's and such, not counting a couple of failed Plan B's (was my own interpretation of Plan B at the time).

Anyway, I found MB, talked with Jennifer, started posting here and things turned around for me personally, not for the M, but for ME. WH kept lying and sneaking so I am now in the dark Plan B. Other than the fatal moving day for those few minutes that he blasted me, I have not seen or spoken to him since the first weekend in Sept. I figure if it was going to break him it would have done so by now.

So, Plan Chai it is and I'm doing well. The false D scare early this week shook me a little, but it was minor. You know, you go back on the infidelity diet for a few meals?

But I say party on. I think we should go to Believer's house in sunny CA. I haven't seen sun here in weeks.