I have been giving WW sh#t all night about the affair but logic has no play here. She does not believe that her actions are hurting the kids - she thinks that the kids are hurting because I complain to her about the affair and drive her away. She also used my behaviors in the marriage as comparison. They will say anything, won't they.

I hope I am not sabotaging plan A by giving her grief; I am trying to invoke guilt but it is clearly not there. Whatever feelings she had for me seem gone. Her love affair with the OM is more important to her than my feelings and even those of the three kids.

Exposure - she is finishing up in school and I do have some email addresses of her classmates - do you think I should expose there too?

Dammit - GET TO OM'sW NOW and knock on her door. Sheesh.

Shocked,

Nowhere in plan A does it say give her grief to try and invoke guilt. It does not work that way. Guilt will only come when the A ends and she has time to get her head out of the fog. She will not appreciate the damage she is doing to you or the kids, so knock off the sympathy thing.

It will not work while she is in the affair. Soooooooo, the idea is to put pressure on the affair and that means exposure to OM's W, her parents, your parents and people that are influential in her life. Her classmate probably don't come under that category. This is not about revenge exposure is about seeking help in showing her the way home.

Please read the articles on plan A, and please expose to OM's W.

God Bless,

JL

You aren't doing the things that can help, and you're doing things that do harm.

I apologized to my WW for giving her crap about the A. I also told her that I have been treating her this way because the other relationship is hurtful. I told her I am aware of my faults during the marriage and desperately want to work on them with her, via any means necessary, including counseling. She, of course, is skeptical and does not want to come back. Why would she? She has the OM. That is why I will ring the OM's doorbell this afternoon after work.

Good! Remain calm and brace yourself for the fireworks from you WW. Anticipate her anger and commit yourself to maintaining your composure.

To be honest, I am a little worried about the fallout; she has already moved out of the house and seems to have very little compassion for me. I have been doing plenty of "Love Busters" (angry outbursts, demands, and disrespect) and have had a hard time maintaining my composure. She has already threatened to impliment her own "Plan B". This will not doubt push her there.

How very WS-ish of her. Actually IMO the less contact you have with her when she's in WS-mode, the better for you.



Yes, maintaining your composure in the face of a blatant and active WS can be difficult, but you have an advantage here - you now have a *plan* to follow, and you can identify when your behaviour does or does not contribute to that plan. Keep reviewing your behaviour, identify where you're going wrong, and eventually you'll get it right. Practice makes perfect <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />.



Don't let a WS' threats get in the way of the execution of your plan. They will say anything in order to ensure that they can continue to get their "fix".

Rang the doorbell, no one home. I think she may work nights or the OM and his W are out. Now I have the kids. I will try again tomorrow.

You folks have been great thus far, kicking me in the a## when I need it, explaining the situation with clarity. Thank you for your support.

I am curious, though. My WW says she "wants to want to come back." but has complained that I have been too controlling and my emotions have been too intense. This is true, as I mentioned before that I have made so many idle threats it has put us both through h#ll. Almost everyday in the last three weeks I have given her sh#t and tried to manipulate in one form or another. I only stumbled across this site a couple days ago and did not have a formulated plan.

Couldn't this exposure further add to my poor behavior and be considered as controlling or manipulative? My behavior towards her has been what she deserves, not according to plan. Before you tell me to grow a pair, I am still going through with it, just curious about the repercussions and want to ensure I shouldn't add more sugar before I take out the vinegar. In an ideal world she would come back because she wanted to, not because I wrecked the A.

Go easy on me guys, I am just trying to get all the facts.
Oh, BTW, I ordered the book. Tough finding some things online - a lot of the older links are broken.

Do we live in an ideal world? (That's a hypothetical question)

Yes, wouldn't it be great if your WS would suddenly change her mind and come back to you? Is it a realistic scenario? Not from what I've seen here. The A must end before your WW will have desire to come back.

Yes, your WW will probably see it as being 'controlling' and 'vengeful,' etc. Don't concern yourself with how WW sees it at the time. Because if you give WW what she says she wants, you will surrender the marriage.

Ho-hum - "she wants to want to come back" - that is what they all say. And MB says that as long as the affair continues, she won't want to come back. She won't have any feelings for you. That is why it is essential that you expose the affair - that is the fastest way to end it.

Then she will let you know that is the final straw, it was none of your business, you are too controlling, she WAS going to work on the marriage, but now she's not, she is filing for divorce, you went too far, you went about it the wrong way, and my personal favorite, she will never trust you again.

After she spews anger for awhile, she will get over it.

Exactly! While she's accusing you of being manipulative, what's she trying to do is to manipulate YOU, to make you fearful of "rocking the boat". Of course if you don't rock the boat, her A can continue unabated.

Anyone know how to get an unlisted phone number? All I have to go on is the OM's cell phone number. I got the house info from the Assessor's office. It sure would be helpful to get the home number. Other than a 1st name, the OM's W is somewhat of a mystery, at least on the Internet. No traffic tickets, just a name on the deed.

I have primary custody of the kids, at least for now, since my WW is not staying at home. A phone call would be so much more convenient - at least to set up a meeting. I have told her that the A is hurtful to the kids. She tells me that it is my discussing the A with her when she is visiting the kids, not the A itself. Pretty self-serving.

I think there is some truth to the "want to want" but obviously I am a pile of dog poop compared to this catch of a catch married 10-year-older man. I would like to believe there is a shred of guilt. Besides, I have been very good to her and she would have a much better future with me. WTH could this other guy offer in the long run?

My therapist was intrigued by the possibility of telling the OM W and told me to really think it through before I act. His concerns were mine - manipulation and control. I told him about this site and that my mind was made up. He actually told me he did not know of anyone that did this. Strange for a 67-year-old that has been practicing for 30 years.

Guys, I am set on exposure. I have already told WW family and our friends. The WW's mother was actually on my side and gave a lecture to WW but it did no good. Exact words from WW mom - "she is out of control."

They usually meet in the evening at a trail head or park. The days of the week seem to vary (never on a weekend) so a phone number would be helpful since I have the kids at night.

Last question for now - what do you think the odds are she will actually go for the D? I am worried about getting hit for spousal maintenance since she is not working and living off my nickel; I would get crushed in alimony. If we do D, it needs to after Feb because that is when her job starts. I already calculated Child Support and it wont be much when she is working.

Thanks again all.

Have your therapist check out this site, because this stuff works.

I don't know how to track down people, but if you post on general questions, someone should be able to help. There is a private investigator that Melody Lane knows who can get information cheap.

Chances are EXCELLENT that your wife will be back to the marriage. Affairs almost always end. The trick is to get it ended before YOU are done with the marriage.

Also keep a journal/calendar for custody purposes just in case it comes to that.

And finally, when WW is pissed off and give me her threats, what is the best response? That I did it for the marriage, because it was the right thing to do? How do you recommend I handle it?

Oh, that's easy. You just tell her that you love her and will do whatever it takes to keep your family together.

Shocked,

And yes it is the right thing to do. The OM's W needs this information to protect herself. Oh, by the way have you had STD tests done? If not do so, and recommend that OM's W do so as well because frankly you don't who either of them have slept with before and an STD is a gift that keeps on giving, so get tested.

If you have OM's cell phone number then you must have his name. If not, then call the phone and ask for someone else, and then inquire to whom you are speaking. Then hang up with the name. Now with a name and an address information should be able to get you the number.

God Bless,

JL

PS: Now you know why Harlye is more successful than others. He recognized that while an affair is going on there is no recovery. He also recognized that often when the affair ends and they mostly do, the BS may be too worn out to care or rebuild. And finally, he knows that affairs thrive in secrecy. Given that, exposure is clearly the ONLY rational thing to do, unless there are some very unusual circumstances. Anger is not a good reason to avoid exposure. It sure wasn't a good reason to not have an affair was it???

I have his name - it showed up on the caller-id. Based on his name, I found out his address from the public assessor records.

I see you mentioning the convenience of getting the OMW's phone number for exposure. What are the chances you can get a friend to come over and watch the kids whenever your WW and the OM meet next? Then just go buy their house with your evidence and see if she is home. If not, try again next time. Exposure in person with evidence makes it much harder for someone to ignore the truth because its ugly to them.

In the meantime, you continue to try and get her name and phone number. By pursuing both avenues, you ensure you expose to her as soon as possible.

I think thad is what I will have to do. I just went by the OM's house and he was home - she wasn't. I think he works from home. Boy, what a loser. She certainly has downgraded.