i was here in August 2004 when i found out about the first two guys my wife had physical affairs with... i was here trying to get advice on how to save my marriage then

now i guess im just here to hear other people tell me that they have made it through times like these

guess i was not strong enough to overlook all of what she had done and love her more like most of the people on here suggest ya do... (that's plan A if i remember correctly). We ended up getting separated back in June. she and my step daughter got an apartment together and me and my son remained in the house

Around a year ago she started what was probably a physical affair with man number three but i didnt find that out until after we were separated

So from june till two weeks ago when i finally filed for divorce, she was sometimes lovey dovey let's get back together because my boyfriend is a bum or she's be Ms. Venomspitter whenever she realized that i wasn't taking her back this time. a vicious cycle i tell ya... been a rough few months for me

what prompted this post? i was looking at old pictures on my hard drive yesterday, thinking back on the seven years of marriage we had and i came across some that i had never seen... of her in a skimpy bikini at some strange house... the pics were from March 2007 long before we were separated and i eventually found out that must have been around the time she met man number three

kinda punched me in the gut. even though i've filed for divorce it still hurts not unlike picking at an old scab

my brother thinks i need to start dating... that the best medicine is to move on but i'm not ready yet and neither is my seven year old son

i'm an introvert... another reason why she kept flocking to other men

aside from excercise for self-esteem... what else can this depressed intovert do to pick himself up? aside from spill my life story to strangers lol

LOL.......I did EXACTLY what your brother suggested......started dating....and it sure worked for me. From being called a loser by my EX to actually having women say I was a great catch helped me out tremendously. Anyhow, if that isnt your thing, I would suggest a hobby, working out, or maybe doing activities with your son. I actually met a few of my dates while taking my kids to play places, like Chuck E Cheese pizza. You can also maybe coach your son and a/his team in a sport. I do this now and its a wonderful way of spending time with your child and having fun time doing it. Good luck....and god bless.

Shiny new sports car with a bimbette.

i had one of those before i got married (well... the sports car anyway lol)

i posted while in a bad mood earlier. it happens im sure you all understand that

dating is definitely in my future but i'm gonna wait until after the divorce is final and i'll still keep my son in the dark because he is too young to understand all this i think

im at work and periodically ive been reading other posts... my problem seems small to what some of the other people in here have had to deal with

kinda puts my problem in perspective

i need reassurance from time to time because my confidence is down but deep down i know i'd be a good catch for somebody out there who is more like me

time to go trade in my sedan and get started

Go see "Dan in Real Life." You don't need a fancy car to meet someone of quality... even in real life!

i wouldnt use the car to attract women... the car would just be another change... a purge so to speak

ill keep the movie in mind however

and let me add one more thing... divorce sucks.

i'm a christian man and i honestly stuck it out as long as i could. i tried. and i know alot of you are thinking well you need to keep trying because God doesn't like divorce. but i'm human and to be honest it's hard to get the full picture out there in a few little forum posts

what led to where we are now is complicated

but in a nutshell i think i have finally come to a spot in my life where i really don't think i can try any more. she still flirts with me but it's like she is just scared to be alone and she panicks sometimes because this boyfriend of hers really is a bum and i'm fairly stable

it's like she just wants to keep me around for the stability so she doesn't have to worry about bills while she gets her groove on

maybe if i thought the flirting was because she really loved me and wanted to start over... ah heck with that! that sounds like me continuing to be a pansy!

the little guy on my shoulder is telling me to man up

three men she had sex with while we were married... the first time it was her fault but the other two fall on me

i learned there are real consequences to ignoring a woman's needs. i'm not totally innocent. but hey that's for another post because it's almost 5pm and its time to clock out

bottom line is i really can't wait to move on

/rantoff

There are a lot of good women out there and there does come a time to move on. Well, Plan B if you can manage it, then move on.

I think that some men and women come to the end of their character or something like that. It's like they just followed the good feelings of their life for a while. Then, when life really begins to test their fortitude, they (and we all) find out they were either on a different course all along, or they've come to the end of themselves and don't know how to soothe the ruffled feathers of their own lives - like they lack life skills or something. So, they reject the people around them thinking they are the cause of their discontent, then mistaking a change (always somewhat refreshing) for 'better'. It isn't for a long time and usually after experiencing regret that they realize they are the consistent party in their discontent. Before then it seems like they are afraid to look inside themselves or they were never very deep to begin with. There is this thing called projection, we fill in the blanks for other people without realizing it. I tend to think that having the ability to look deep within ourselves is a real "must have" skill in a successful enduring relationship that has any depth.

Question... Is your wife really attractive? What's her background? Is there anything in her life she's ashamed of? People who carry shame tend to push people away when they get too close. There could be something there that you don't know about.

Assuming you're here for advice and support, I recommend learning all there is to know about meeting a woman's needs and having yours met too - it's just as important that you know how to ask for what you need.

Another thought... Could it be that you're not as introverted as you may think and maybe have settled there in a comfort zone, stalling your own growth in some ways? Introverts can be just as social as the rest of us, but the difference can be seen more in how you need to recharge after socializing. Extroverts are energized and recharged by being around other people, introverts are recharged by being alone. It's a healthier way of looking at the trait.
People think that I am an extreme extrovert, yet I can only handle it for so long, then I have to be 'off' for a while. A quiet night or an afternoon drive or a good cup of coffee at sunrise, usually for a couple of days in a row. My social skills are learned, not natural. I had some guilt about it until finally it was explained to me this way. I can be the life of the party, but only for so long. Anyway, just my thoughts. Throw out what doesn't apply.

I know you'll be blessed, new guy. You seem pretty 'straight up'.

Yeah, take it from a fellow introvert, it's a bit scary after the divorce, wondering if anyone would show an interest in you after your spouse treats you worse than dirt.

Well, the good news is that this introvert has had more dates than he ever could have imagined.. Not saying this to brag, just to point out that just like us men, there are plenty of divorced women out there, looking for love.

And many of them (at least the quality ones) will appreciate a man of integrity, good heart, and someone who knows to heal before starting to date <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />. I'd say you are on the right path.

I see you already posted on the After Divorce Dating board; go ahead and post your story there, and you'll get lots of good advice (not to mention that there are many more single ladies there than men, hehe).

AGG

warriorforlove,

its really fascinating, life is. when i can post just a few words and have a stranger see what was not written. i love intuition and others who seem to possess that quality... not to say that i love you but you get the drift i'm sure

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

my wife is extremely attractive. large, beautiful breasts and men turn there heads wherever she goes. but she doesn't like the attention in most cases. she could have easily had sex with 50 men during our marriage so there is some restraint on her part... or at least she throws that in my face alot

she was raped as a child by a man after her father left her alone at home. she had a really troubled childhood and ended up getting pregnant twice at a young age. the first time it ended in an abortion and the second time she adopted her daughter out. she thinks about the daughter that is out there all the time

when she was in her last year of high school she married a terrible man to get away from her unstable parents. he beat her regularly from what she has told me and used their daughter as a tool to set one parent against the other. the man she married ended up getting thrown in prison for 10 years for selling large quantites of marijuana and had only been divorced for a few months when we first met

as for myself, i had a stable childhood but my parent were never very affectionate and i never learned that skill. i was very lonely when we met... not good with women and very horny. also, i have always been a social worker... even before being paid for it. a part of me married her because i thought i could help this woman who had survived all this.

it was the wrong reason to get married but she was and still is physically very attractive and six months after meeting she was pregnant with our son who is now seven. so i asked her to marry me.

during the first four years of our marriage, she cheated on me twice because i was having alot of problems dealing with the stress, that was, her life. i had never experienced that level of stress before

i shut myself down emotionally. she of course needed the person who married her... the one who promised to wisk her off her feet and make all those problems go away

easier said than done. her ex husband was brutal over the phone... telling his daughter to hate me and reminding me that i was living in his home, sleeping in his bed, with his wife. alot of other problems existed

we got into financial debt and she ended up selling her home to correct that. it was during this time that she was seeing a gross man who was much like her ex husband

i learned about the first guy and this second gross one after we had moved into a nice rental on a lake. i came here and learned about plan a at that time but i was not strong enough if those are the right words to get beyond the betrayal

she always resented me for having to sell her home, adding to the problems we were having

two years later we bought a home... with my money. not sure why she agreed to that because she has repeatedly told me that her needs were still not being met. a third guy had entered the picture shortly before the purchase of the home as stated above

so yea, that's where i'm at. do i still love her? yes i do. it's just that i bit off more than i can chew in more ways than one. i've been patient with her but i was never able to love her enough to make up for all the damage that was done to her self esteem in the past.

i've told her that had she been patient with me; let me get to the point where i could deal with the stressful ex... that eventually i would have been able to try and meet her emotional needs more. but patience for me was not meeting her needs and hence the problem

at this point, too much damage has been done imo. but i still love her anyway. that's why i feel like a weenie sometimes... whereas most men would have ran away long ago... i stayed with her and she kept hurting me

anyway, that's alot of text to mull over for one post

i just want to spill my guts and see how others react... i want to know what others think about the decisions i have made and the consensus on what to do about the future

there is alot more that has not come out here

AGG,

i'm just like most other guys out there, it's been five months since the separation and ya start to get the itch if ya know what i mean

for a month or two after the separation (before i learned the extent to which she was seeing the third guy) we continued having periodic sex but that got cut off as i started learning more about this loser

why does she date losers? this dude is unemployed and i saw a picture of his house recently and it's just plain nasty... but i digress

i don't know if i'm really ready to date tbh. there is a wonderful Christian woman who i absolutely adore but i'm a bit gunshy of the ole rebound bug

i've taken her to the movies, shot pool with her and gone bowling... innocent outings... but even as horny as i get i just don't want to make that jump yet

dunno really... i'm not even divorced yet. got around a month to go

The last thing your son needs is any chaos in his young life. You are wise to be thinking ahead to keeping strange women away from him. It's too soon to date.

i wholeheartedly agree with that

saturday morning my wife came over saying she wanted to take our son to the zoo. the closest one is an hour away and knowing that my wife doesn't like driving on the interstate i asked her who was going to drive

she said OM was going to take him along with my son's stepsister and OM's daughter. as soon as i heard that some words came out of my mouth that i'd rather not repeat here but let's just say that he DID NOT go to the zoo

it baffles me the way she thinks. it's like i really never knew her after seven years of marriage

take it from me and wait awhile before you date seriously...
i was ready, having been alone for almost 3 years BUT i am still healing from the hurt of dating someone seriously who had only just left his wife a few months prior. you won't intentionally set out to hurt someone, don't believe gekko did either, but i am still healing from it trust it me.

mlhb

thx for stopping by to my little thread here mlhb

i've read alot about your situation and i respect your opinion

however, i am hoping your advice will not be applicable. i'm not going to jump into something serious right away. i know that primarily because i am super defensive about how my son is adjusting to all this

yes i do plan to start dating after the divorce is final. i further plan to keeping my son out of it and letting the women (hey hopefully it will be plural right guys?) letting the women know that i am not ready for a serious relationship having just left a pretty darn traumatic one

if i do meet the new mrs right along the way, it will be a person who will be patient with me; somebody who will understand that good things come to those who wait

this is kinda like an interactive diary... i like it

charlie, I also have come out of a pretty traumatic marriage myself.


Insomuch that I had to make complete and radical changes.

I quit my career of 14 years and just up and moved 200 miles north to Atlanta. I quickly found a new career literally making over DOUBLE what I had been in my government job.

My own wifey was one of those "upstanding christians" that sang in the choir and was a soloist on the praise team, but used it all for kinda like a "guilt relief" and barter with God for her fornication. Kinda like going to church to make up for what she did during the week and she was completely complacant with it.

I took some of my retirement and bought a brand new truck, an AR-15 rifle and a new computer. ALL for ME.

My wife had severely damaged my old truck and never had it repaired, so I had to drive it wrecked for years, but her car got repaired where she had crashed my truck into it and ripped my door off.

I can literally afford anything I wish now, whereas we were struggling before because of her scuba trip addiction (go off and fornicate).

I have a girlfriend that I shower with anything she so desires and make sure it gets back to my wife who can't even make the house payment much less go off diving now as OM has totally abandoned her financially as he chose his family over her once I exposed to his wife.


Your succes will do more damage to her fantasy than anything else. My own soon-to-be-ex is circling the drain and I am succedeing in ways I never imagined.

My EX had an affair with a minister in our church that I knew for 8yrs.....his wife also worked in the church. He finally dumped my EX 4yrs into the affair.....he played her like a violin. He also decided to stay with his wife, I remarried, and my EX is now dating another guy.

This just shows you that going to church and being a christian is a guarantee that you wont sin or have an affair. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

Im still a christian, and love god......but, I dont trust ANY man......christian, in the church or not.

charliethree,

Love's not too strong a word. Thanks for the compliment. There are different kinds of love. That's why we're all here.

You are a knight in shining armor... for the right woman. Not that your wife was not, but she's got some deep problems. I think that men love to rescue women, especially beautiful women and most women love to be rescued. It's very common, although I'm sure many of us don't like to think of ourselves as common. I think you did a good thing. I think you, like a lot of us just didn't realize how scrambled your stbx is. We all get real good putting on our 'good face' for the world. It fools us.

Sexual abuse early in life is a very difficult thing. It makes for a shame-based personality and those types do like to hold us by the throat, but at arm's length. It's usually the shame cycle that keeps people in addictions too, although substance addictions don't have to be present to still be stuck in the shame cycle. The things you will notice about their communication style... you can't get past the blame, the projection (their emotions and reason projected onto you), the distraction techniques and the denial. Often, if you attempt to get closer by working out a problem, you find that you become the subject of the problem.

I was always stumped at how my ex managed to find multitudes of ways to avoid responsibility and to pick fights with me and make me the problem. I was never clever enough. Finally I realized that I just couldn't work things out with him and I shut down emotionally as you did. He was constantly in manipulation mode. He was fine as long as I pretended he was the person he wanted me to believe him to be, no matter what symptoms or dysfunctions he exhibited. (By then I was trapped with babies and nowhere else to go.)

My ex had some early sexual experiences (single digit age) that I think produced a lot of shame, but that he couldn't experience that way. He told himself other stories about those experiences to make them seem less 'bad' (denial). But, that kept him locked in the shame and that distorted the rest of his reasoning and behaviors. He has become so detached from his core self that he actually lives through other people - in the form of narcissism. Sexual shame goes hand in hand with narcissism, which comes in many forms (your wife likes to throw it in your face how much in demand she is). My ex never laid a hand on me, but he got in my head and heart and tried to destroy me in the end by setting me up for public humiliation. It was how he attempted to control me (the by-the-throat part), but he would buy me flowers, rub my back, and couldn't tell me a thing about his hopes and dreams for the future or how his boss made him feel that day (the at-arm's-length part). All he knew was that he wanted to feel good. He didn't have a clue how to make it happen, but you can be sure he'll throw you away if you aren't making it happen for him.

I think I understood him because I also had a bad sexual experience which caused me many years of difficulty and shame, but my experience happened at 15 and I've spent much time facing and working out my problems, determined to have a good life. Shame is only a problem if you keep trying to bury it. Since I've learned to travel the path of healing, I was able to spot a lot of things in my ex and he hated that. No matter how gentle or patient (18 years!), I could not bring him to a place where he was willing to examine himself. That 'willing to go deep' "must have" trait I told you about... that's what I'm talking about. He couldn't do it. His father couldn't either. His mother didn't either - a proper Boston woman. I'm sure they all had feelings, but the unpleasant ones that told deeper truths weren't welcome.

I still love my ex too, but after a time I realized it wasn't him I loved, it was the man I thought I knew. I had a tendency to brush aside the bad parts of him and focus on the good - a very good trait under healthy circumstances. It took me some time with a counselor to take a good hard look at the bad and see the real man I'd been spending my time with. It takes time to come to that - it isn't easy to accept that your stbx's behavior really is a part of who she is and not just a 'mood'. I ended up mourning the loss of a man of whom "I filled in the blanks". The man there now isn't someone I really know or care to know. I think someone on this post said the same thing.

If it makes you feel better about yourself, I did the same thing as you... we aren't weenies - we have bigger hearts for others than ourselves. I like to remind people of the golden rule this way... Learn to love others as yourself, not INSTEAD of yourself. That's why I said you should learn to know what you need and to know how to ask for it. Dr. Harley addresses this in his "policy of joint agreement". It isn't healthy to sacrifice in marriage. We should work with each other to find ways to "enthusiastically" agree. That way, no one builds resentment and both have their needs met. It's the ol' "win-win" - a little cliche, but you get what I mean?

BTw, Me, 45. WS 50. Two daughters, 18 & 14, two step daughters by WS previous marriage, he abandoned year 6 of marriage. D-Day, end of 2002, confirmed by May 2003 and previous infidelity revealed that year. Year one of affair, figuring out what's going on. Year two, Plan A and modified Plan B. Year three, WS convinced me affair ended, but he was only testing me "to see if I could forgive and forget". Filed for divorce Feb. 2006 after finding proof of continued affair. Ceased communication (due to manipulation) except by email June, 2006. Sold house and moved out June 2007 (he|| year).

My entire marriage was manipulation. He wrecked our credit, paid hundreds of dollars each month in phone bill and paid check charges due to drawing money against written checks - wasted money constantly due to his lack of discipline. My ex had at one point $35,000+ in child support arrears, which forced me to have to support us a lot of the time. I worked full time, mothered my children (as well as I could) and contributed the lions share of income while going to school full-time to generate more income for the future, while my ex wasted away his inheritance. He had three long bouts of unemployment. I think he believed his contribution was the inheritance - but that money was tied up in the house, refinancing periodically to cover bills, but he didn't pay off the bills with the money, just lived off of it.

He has recently threatened to "legally" (he's an ex-cop) ruin my 18 year old daughter's life, because she wouldn't loan him money to pay his rent. He had just purchased a new car outright with cash from the sale of the house and just returned from a trip across country to visit his family with OW. See the narcissism?

So, charliethree, if you're a weenie, I'm a bigger one. But, really I don't think of us that way at all. I was manipulated. We didn't choose this, we found ourselves in it and we did GOOD. WE ROCK!!! Now, we just have to remember to care for ourselves as well as we cared for our ex's.

Warrior

well tonight was kind of an emotional night for me. i was on the phone with my brother when my WW came over to take my son for the night. while she was here a friend of mine came over to deliver a washer/dryer set

yay no more laundrymats!

she was intentionally flirting with him and she saw how it was bothering me. my face is an open book sometimes. she came up to me a few minutes later and said, "don't hate me cuz you ain't like me." i ended up replying by saying, "i don't even like looking at you anymore." she left a bit angry after the exchange and after she left i told my friend to avoid taking the bait because of how it made me feel. i even told my friend to keep his eyes open because his wife and my WW went out alot together and his wife even introduced my WW to the third OM

so now i'm alone and i went to go check my email and to my suprise my stepdaughter emailed me saying that she missed me and loved me and it really raised my spirits

part of me really wants to go out there and show WW that i could easily find a woman. she really thinks i'm some kind of eunich (spelling?) but that's really not the kind of guy i am. i couldn't use a woman just to show my wife that i'm not the loser she thinks i am. the other part of me takes solace in the fact that i really think i am a better person

she'd refute that if given the chance of course because i am the root of the all problems whenever we get in that repeated arguement over whose fault it was

we got married and i stopped communicating with her because there were alot of things negatively affecting our marriage right from the get go. the marriage really was doomed from the start. sometimes i feel really bad about that bause i was partly to blame. but you know what? if i had to do it all over again i'm really not sure i could respond a different way

she and i are two very different people with different values, backgrounds and outlooks on life. getting married and seeing some of the skeletons come out of the closet was like jumping in an icy lake naked

warrior,

thanks for the heartfelt response. you obviously spent alot of time on the post and i really appreciate you spending that much time reminding me that i am not the only one out there experiencing all this

people like us end up putting other people's feelings in front of our own and that, I believe, leads to problems sometimes. but that's life and it's part of my core being. i couldn't live any other way

there is something else i have not stated that is relevant. and i don't want to make myself out to be mr perfect who makes no mistakes. i'm human just like the rest of us but...

i run a social service office for the salvation army. i've worked in social work for awhile but i never had my own operation where i ran things until last year when they trusted me to open an office in a new town.

for the most part, there is not much material wise that i give people when they come in to the office for help. a 30 pound bag of food goes to many and over the course of the year i gave $20,000 in various grant monies to people who needed emergency financial help. but that's not why i am so busy at work.

people line up just to talk to me; to get my advice on how to get their lives back on track. when i got to the office yesterday there were five families waiting at the door. some waited two plus hours to talk to me. a few of these said they came recently but couldn't wait long enough to see me so they came back when they had more time

i literally hear dysfunctional stories all day and over time see my work actually help people

today i got a call from the united way saying a business wanted to sponsor a military family for christmas ... a family whose father was being sent to war soon. the very next client was a homeless mother of two living with her son who was a special operations soldier about to be sent off... when he leaves they will have no place to go

stuff like this happens alot and it makes me tingle sometimes seeing God send me people in such a timely fashion. if it wasn't for the love of my job and my son, i'd be bonkers right now

God is good all the time. And all the time, God is good.

charlie, you sound like an awesome person. I wish I knew you in real life!