This has altered my view of my ex... from the inside of me. And when I let myself be convinced of this... I experience positive things inside... the healing that "escaped me" though I tried and tried and tried to "overcome it".

But you shouldn't see ANY other person as your only source of happiness. That is placing waaaay too much for any of us to expect from another person. One's spouse should, of course, ADD TO our happiness, but we are responsible for our own happiness.

Do you know why your ex fell out of love with you?

"Plan B" has worked for me. And I think Dr. Harley is smart enough to know that it is also the WS he is mastering emotionally by psychological means... to desire reconciliation with the XS... by not getting any of their emotional needs met either.

If a person obeys the Lord (this is how I'm believing at this time)... and believes what the scripture says... and this truth (this is what I think I'm beginning to experience and see and know)... sinks in... there comes the healing.

My "pain pocket"... or "storehouse of resentment"... my woundedness.. my hurt and pain... is disappearing.

I'm healing.... on the inside of me.

Hi Lady,

Bless you. By this I mean he is my only life's partner as long as he is living. (Getting one's ENs met in an intimate relationship... I mean... marriage partner... in the Lord's will... where I can have full fellowship in the spiritual bond. SF is not SF to me... it's abhorrent... without the spiritual connection in intimacy. It's an attempt at physical and emotional intimacy that cannot bring SF due to lack of spiritual intimacy... to me. This is how I feel and why I have been so "locked down"... and now feel exhausted like I have no more "fight in me"... trying to think that isn't true. If that makes sense... just trying to share my personal experience for the benefit of others in case it helps anyone ever.)

I almost cannot believe it... it's been such a hard struggle for me... I had almost lost hope of ever being "free".

I am not having the internal emotional response of hurt, pain, and panic... so bad it was "electric fence" level... in relation to my ex.

On the inside, I am feeling the comfort of the Holy Spirit now where before I felt burned... just burned and how I felt... all that pain... "out of my control".

The ex, I thought, had control. He wouldn't stop being immoral... that's all I "could see"... and I responded to that "stimuli" almost exclusively. And could not break the cycle of pain and negative feedback loop between us... or so I thought... and have thought... for so long.

It's changing on the inside of me. If I am wrong, people, I will find out as I "walk it out".

I've studied the scripture to the best of my ability and become convinced of the Holy Spirit (I sincerely believe) of the truth of what I am saying relative the bond between us not changing on the deepest parts of inside... no matter how hurt we have been emotionally and how many wrong things we have said or done to one another in our humanity.

Being convinced of this truth, for me, and somehow "surrendering" by conviction of the truth... as I understand it... is what is setting me free.. imo.

This is my testimony thus far.

Back,

I see where you are coming from, in regard to being spiritually married. However, I think that it would be wise to be "still" in regard to working on your relationship with your ex.

I think that, if you begin having SF with him, he will likely stay with the OW much, much longer. Why? Because he will have BOTH of you meeting his emotional needs.

From what I've seen of WS, it nearly always just about kills 'em for the BS to go on with life.

I am not talking about sleeping with other men, as that would also be a sin.

I am talking about going back to a very dark Plan B, while living a good life...enjoying the company of others, going shopping, taking care of one's business, and finding things to do that you enjoy and which are constructive.

Tuck your love for your husband back into your heart and don't wear it on your sleeve.

Be STILL.

Wait for his affairage to end when he realizes that the OW cannot meet all his needs.

Be STILL, and pray that God "breaks" him, because you REALLY do NOT want him back in the WS frame of mind. That would only result in more heartache for you.

"Burned Beyond All Recognition"... is how I felt was an accurate depiction of me... in relation to the ex... that no one could see.

(Just manifestations of it emotionally... but not the wound... the wound they could not see.)

It's healing. I'm being renewed and restored on the inside of me.

Now, if perchance I am wrong... and until there would be reconciliation... to me... I still though I've prayed and studied the Word...and am feeling healing as I "move in this direction" on the inside of me...

(And I believe that is solely by grace by the work of the Holy Spirit inside of me... by God's grace... not really me at all doing it... to be sure... just God working in me and me having grace to surrender.)

but until there is reconciliation and I know for certain thereby that therefore this truly is the Lord and I have understood correctly... no, I'm not going to say that I know beyond any shadow of doubt.

I know that I have that faith... but I am also aware I am human and fallible. And we all make mistakes.

But, nonetheless, this is somehow a path of healing for certain for me.

I will know more when I see the ex more.

I know that healing on the inside is only found in submission to God's will... because that's the only way that the Holy Spirit ministers... in agreement with the revealed Word of God and God's personal will for an individual's life.

Thanks, Mr. & Mrs. W and others for praying.

Sometimes prayer does more than all the greatest attempts to give one's advice.

Thank you Lady. I believe you now about the not having SF with him more on the basis of sheer principle with which I can now agree. I've decided that this should not occur without benefit of civil marriage.

Both civil marriage and the bonds of holy matrimony must both be in agreement.

Yet, I believe there is tactical wisdom in your council as well relative to the SF. I'll stay in Plan B relative that.
God bless.

One thing I'll add at this time.

The Bible is infallible. The Holy Spirit is infallible. These are perfect.

I'm a Christian. I'm forgiven... but I'm not infallible.

I'm human.

I still leave room that I may be wrong and the bond no longer exists... and this is no longer God's perfect will for me... though I can't really see that biblically, spiritually right now.

It could be that I just need to see the ex in a different light... and not in the light of what he did in sin.

I can be wrong. That's part of being human.

God, the Bible.. they are never wrong. Christians definitely can be in interpretation.

So... I'll leave that remark.

God bless

Back, youposted the following:

"I also have a high IQ.

What you may think is "problematic"... is, most likely, giftedness.

That's what this shrink said, at least.

I won't conform to a group... in pcland... or be moved to go along with the crowd.

I'm a leader here in 3D world.

If we were in an in-person social group... I'd be leading it right now.

And the most popular person present."

IMHO: WOW!!! That's probably the most pompous thing I've ever seen posted here! OK, maybe my guess that you were idolizing your WXH was wrong after all... Maybe you have made an idol of YOURSELF? Maybe your plan to sexually seduce your XH, who is married to an OW now, is motivated by ego-inflation? Maybe you just refuse to accept that he chose her over you? To me now it sounds as if it's more a matter of pride to you than a genuine belief that it's what God wants.

meremortal... context of the remarks... as I was being falsely "diagnosed". And, well, I can't think of any social group of my peers where I haven't been very well liked.

Of course, I don't typically share my own personal issues. In fact, I very much focus on others, listening, supporting them... and just being there for others.

In this case... here... I did share my own struggles. Quite a different dynamic has resulted.

MM, your ax appears to be grinding. You don't have one nice thing to say about me. You protest that I say anything nice about myself.

Ever had an abuser in your life? Because how you are behaving is just how abusers behave... can u think about that as you review your comments? Do you feel a need to destroy me.. and do you justify this by denegrating me in your own eyes? How much self-esteem am I allowed to have... in your estimation? None?

It's like a man who calls a woman a very bad name... tells her she's nothing... tears her down, tears her down, tears her down... and if she defends herself... then attacks that.

Then says, "She deserved it. I'm right."

Anyway, there's no other area of my life where I focus on feelings rather than action steps.

And when I am supporting others, I listen without judging... and then turn focus onto action steps.

The Lord is working in my life. I feel my hurt and pain disappearing... and I want to do what I advise others to do, "Focus on the action steps."

"What are you going to do about it?"

People who are emoting may need support... but those who are involved in action steps are in process of solution actively.

I feel me "coming to myself"... and want to focus on action steps.

I think sold here are in a place where they act and speak hold others to the level of emoting... by attacking... stirring up strife, attack... being used of Satan.

You seem to not want me to think anything good of myself. You'd want me to believe I deserve abuse.

I don't believe it.
God bless

I would much rather see someone who thinks too well of themselves, than too poorly. I imagine it's hard to hear so much criticism from strangers without getting defensive...but it doesn't help. Still, I think it's better to demonstrate "giftedness" and intelligence (consistently over time) rather than talking about it. The only way people get to know eachother here is through posting histories that show honesty and consistency.

back, my best suggestion to you for sharing your story, would be to start your own thread and resist the temptation to explain or defend yourself to others. Give the people who are interested in your story a new place to talk to you that hasn't already been compromised by so much misunderstanding. One of the other boards might be more receptive too. The other thing to remember is that because of the public nature of this board....it's impossible to control who posts to you or how they post. If the comments from others cause too much emotional pain or distress....then it's really not safe for you. You'll need to get a "thicker" skin or use your ignore feature more often.

Best of luck to you.

Back, why are you posting on this thread? You elected to abandon the discussion we were having in favor of this??

Arguing does NOT solve any problems.

Running away from the painful issues does not help solve them.

WHY does someone continue to post for years on MB? Everyone has their own reasons but you can find mine in the Scripture, "to comfort others with the same comfort that you received."

If it's fighting you want, that's easy to get.

If it's help you want, then you have to begin with choosing to accept that it MAY hurt for a while, but the GOAL is "worth the pain." Think of it like debridement of a wound. It takes time to close the wound and reach "healed," and there will times during the healing process when there is some pain to remove what isn't healthy tissue. But the wound heals from the inside out, over time, as it continues to be cleaned and dressed.

You have what could be called a "Stage 3 decubitus, with tunneling." It can be healed, but it's not a "put a bandaid on it and it will be healed in the morning." It's a long process that begins with cleaning the wound, dressing the wound, and continued cleaning and dressing until it is healed.

If you are so strong in your walk, WHAT is it that you fear and want to run away from that you even run from discussing God's Word and how it MIGHT apply to your life and your situation? Is there something so scary about God's Word that you let FEAR overcome turning to the Word, or is it just that you don't want to hear what God might want to say in sort of a "Jonah-like" run away because you MIGHT find yourself in disagreement with what God DOES have to say to you?

The thread and discussion remains open to you anytime you want to reengage.

God bless.

back, it might also be a good idea, since you are so thin skinned, to not criticize, judge, lash out, show hatred, contempt, make slurs, throw stones, etc., as you have been doing. If you want to be treated well, the first step is to stop abusing others with your name calling and contempt. I haven't seen anyone treat you as badly here as you have treated others, so it might be wise to focus on changing your own behavior first.

this whole thing made no sense...but I read and realized I forgot a section in my post...the can O worms I was referring to is MEDC....he's a tenacious pit bull who if you look at his reasoning is actually correct...he's blunt and harsh....but he represents the tough love aspect....which in many cases is needed to get people to open there eyes.....I am here as a veteran.....I offer lots of help to people....but see you jumped in here being extremely defensive and attacking people before thinking....then demanding apologies for your actions to other people....thats not how it works dear. You give no one here respect but yet you demand it.....so...I am here weather you like it or not <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />....I have been here far longer and don't plan on going anywhere.....yeah your thinking....thorn in your side....*shrug* love me or hate me...but until I see you showing the members here more respect...I will be here to give my opinion on your actions good/bad......BTW I know how good I am....you don't need to remind me <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Back,

I've been following this thread and share many struggles that you do about the permanence of the marriage bond in God's eyes.

This is especially difficult when a believer was left for an adulterous relationship. We still feel bonded to our husbands on a deep level even though they have chosen to be sexually immoral and live a life of disobedience.

I think you are wise to wait for a civil marriage before engaging in SF with with your XWH.

He will need to be broken before God and totally repentant before you will feel that spiritual connection that you once cherished with him. Don't settle for less than God's best.

Sara

Back: IMHO - SHEESH!

"MM, your ax appears to be grinding."

Not true. I have no personal beef with you whatsoever.

"You don't have one nice thing to say about me."

Also a false assumption on your part. It is a genuine possibility that people who have been betrayed and hurt may become fixated on the person who abused them in such a way that they believe NOTHING will make them feel OK again EXCEPT winning back that abuser's love/approval/validation. I initially communicated to you that I thought maybe you were idolizing your WXH, making the same mistake I admitted I had done. I didn't say that to be 'not nice'! I said that because I felt it was info that would benefit you in your struggle. Coming to that realization for myself was something that helped me in recovery.

"You protest that I say anything nice about myself."

That is also false. Lots of people posting here say nice things about themselves, myself included. I was commenting on how over the top your self-appraisal was!

"Ever had an abuser in your life?"

Yup

"Because how you are behaving is just how abusers behave..."

Not at all true.

"can u think about that as you review your comments? Do you feel a need to destroy me.."

Not at all. I do however believe that if you are having a problem with idolizing either yourself or your WXH, then that would be wrong, that ONLY God, not any of us mere mortals, deserves that sort of worship.

"and do you justify this by denegrating me in your own eyes?"

I said nothing to denigrate you. Denigration and idolization are opposite extremes. Are YOU saying that any challenge to what may be percieved as extreme self-worship is denigration?

"How much self-esteem am I allowed to have... in your estimation? None?"

The normal, sane, healthy amount any of us mere mortals should have. Actually I initially thought maybe you were suffering from too little self-esteem, while excessively revering your WXH... But after reading that post about your self-appraisal I started to wonder if maybe you had some sort of ego-inflation problem? Therefore it would follow that 'losing' your WXH to the OW would be something that you simply could never accept.

"It's like a man who calls a woman a very bad name... tells her she's nothing... tears her down, tears her down, tears her down... and if she defends herself... then attacks that."

I never called you a single bad name or posted anything to you with the purpose of trying to tear you down. You have no valid reason to 'defend' yourself against anything I've posted. Your false accusations about my postings to you could very easily, justifiably, be interpreted as further evidence of your inflated self-worth: that debating your marital recovery plan in even a civil manner is considered such an affront by you BECAUSE you esteem yourself to be so ABOVE everyone else here that it's an insult that anyone dare to deem themselves good enough to offer YOU advice!

"Then says, "She deserved it. I'm right."

Um.. where did I do that? I only posted a few times to you, with a sincere desire to reach you and teach you something I learned along the way. I thought maybe we shared a similar problem in idolizing our WXH's. I could have pretended to have never had that problem myself. I also have struggled at times with hurt pride, with thinking that maybe the OW really was better than me in some ways. There is still a part of me that wishes my WXH would come back to me just to show OW that my WXH choose ME over her. I didn't have to humble myself, reveal my mere mortalness, and confess that I had sinned that way.

I think this is the first time you've responded to me. You've blasted me and have made many negative false assumptions and accusations about my motives. And forgive me for pointing out the obvious, but your posts are riddled with harsh words towards other posters and a they 'deserved it - I'm right' attitude.

"Anyway, there's no other area of my life where I focus on feelings rather than action steps."

IMHO this is just more evidence that in this area, regarding your WXH, you have allowed winning him back from the OW to be TOO IMPORTANT to you. It may very well be that is because you place too much value on him or your own pride.

"And when I am supporting others, I listen without judging... and then turn focus onto action steps."

Again, when it comes to dealing with your feelings and plans regarding your WXH, why can't you behave that way?
Your extreme anger and defensiveness, your obsessive need to WIN when it comes to you vs the OW, is causing you to react to people who are only trying to help you as if they were your enemies.

"The Lord is working in my life. I feel my hurt and pain disappearing... and I want to do what I advise others to do, "Focus on the action steps."
"What are you going to do about it?"
People who are emoting may need support... but those who are involved in action steps are in process of solution actively.
I feel me "coming to myself"... and want to focus on action steps."

All good stuff and I agree.

"I think sold here are in a place where they act and speak hold others to the level of emoting... by attacking... stirring up strife, attack... being used of Satan."

Wow! Do you even realize just how insulting you're being?
First of all the vast majority of the advice given here is not about emoting but about learning and following plans to recover from betrayal. Are you saying that you think I'm being played by Satan? Do you sincerely believe my motive for posting to you was to unwittingly do Satan's will? BTW, there was no dispute between you and I, no response from you even, until you posted false accusations calling me abusive and Satan-inspired!

"You seem to not want me to think anything good of myself."

I think it's absolutely wonderful when people think good of themselves... as long as they don't think they're God-like (and/or the ONLY ones who might possibly be getting their agenda direct from God...)

"You'd want me to believe I deserve abuse."

I don't want you to believe any such thing. If I did I'd encourage you to go have SF with your WXH so he could continue to cake-eat and thereby abuse you. BTW, you might ask yourself, when that little voice is whispering in your ear that the posters here are 'abusing' you, whether that voice is more likely the voice of God... or you know who...

Wierdness...