And why is that?



And how is this different than any WAYWARD wanting to maintain their fix?



You were wanting her to react the way YOU want for her to react. Who knows what's going on in that ALIEN BRAIN of hers?

Remember this is ALL ABOUT YOU.

I'm not sure how WWs are different but my H tried to use all kinds of GAMES on me...ALL PART OF THE FOG..which TWO FULL YEARS after withdrawal to FULLY LIFT...

I think it's just EXHAUSTING and AWFUL to have to continually deal with a WS...and you are naturally feeling that...

RES: Your point #4 is where my WW started and still resides basically. I love hearing your quote that "I did NOT believe these things b4 the OM and do NOT believe them now."

Now THAT is encouragement!!

Good stuff....keep fighting TMTS

TMTS,

I've been a little busy for a couple of days but wanted to drop by and see how you're doing tonight.

Those da**ed expectations...

I remember when I told my wife that I didn't know what to do with her. I said I figured I had three choices. I could 1)Kick her to the curb and divorce her. 2)Forgive her and try to fix our marriage or 3)Just kill her and do my time.

When she called me in the middle of the next day to tell me she had decided for me and we should get divorced, my world seemed to come to an end. Because that wasn't the choice I would have picked and had no idea that it was the choice she would make. My choice was #2. That was what I expected from her. It wasn't what I got and I went to pieces.

If I'd been with her that day, I might have opted for #3. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />

After some redirection by a dear friend and my pastor and after talking to her friend from Kentucky...I chose to attempt #2 and determined to make it work that way, or at least to give it my best shot before giving her a divorce.

Today, I'm glad I made that choice, but it was my expectation that she would choose the same and it nearly did me in at the start.

This was weeks before I found MB, BTW. But I did learn right then that what I thought she would do, was not likely to be what she did and if I hoped to keep my [censored] together, I needed to expect her to not do what I first expected of her. Once I got that part right, it became tedious and miserable work effort from there on out.

Hang in there man...and take your meds. You can tell they help, right?

Cowboy up!

Mark

Just a thought (and forgive me if I can't recall when and how the affair ended) but often the WW THINKS they can win back the OM by being single. That the complication of them being married and living with their husband WAS the determining factor why OM dumped them or ended it.

She's he11 bent on this decision but she just can't not try to win back OM's interest. Maybe even OM said, "call me when you divorce or actually separate from him" knowing full well that most spouses in affairs Don't so he wasn't willing to invest in more of a relationship with her (oh, the honor of OP's that can't handle their married affair partner cheating on them with their spouse).

OR

OM and her have a "secret plan" and once she actually leaves you they intend to get together and make it SEEM to everyone that they just started dating once you separated. This scenario almost always involves a secret cell phone as affair partners CAN NOT resist speaking to each other to at least get little dose of the affair drug and affirmation.

All I'm saying is it's not typical for the WW to follow through with much of anything in withdrawal so I seek out alternate explanations.

SNOOP....better. You should, at least, be aware of what she's saying to her girlfriends about the situation if you can't find any contact with OM.

Mr. Wondering

Ok, I'm back... Meds have kicked in and my mind is back on track.

Lala - It was a messed up little trip. Unfortunately I've been on them for a little over a year now so I guess I've just experienced what withdrawal will be like. Fun wow, I couldn’t go to curling tonight. Can you imagine being on ice in that state.

Mimi - How does a newbie know he said something stupid??? When Mimi chimes in, thanks for the reminder.

Mark - Well mark is probably driving around southern Ontario right now with a real big stick telling himself... Wait til I find him... I know that Option 2 is the path I've taken.

Mr. W. - I don't know who you talk to.... but you're good.
I was next door having a beer with the neighbor (not the same one that she talks to all the time). This one my WW tries to avoid because she gives her a hard time about what she is doing, but she is a straight shooter and I think your scenario #1 is starting to look like what is going on. I found out that one, he has no cell phone so she cannot call him there, also she was basically told off by the sister because she kept calling the home for him, three they are now screening her calls and not answering, and four the neighbors laugh at her because when she is successful in getting in touch with her he fluffs her off. So her take is that he has no interest in her what so ever, she is completely infatuated with him and is doing all the chasing. I just wish he would just tell her straight out where to go. More importantly I found out that the pressure of all this is getting to her. She told me that she has been over more than once in the last two months coming over and crying. And as far as she knows, she has no apartment as of yet. Her advice is to keep doing what I'm doing. And be patient. Sound allot like Plan A.

Ok old TMTS is gone (I'm glad Mrs. W. didn't get in here, she would have kicked my whinny butt. Oh, BK is going to be on soon so if he sees this, I suspect I'll get one from down under too... deservedly).

No more missing my meds!!! On a good note, the conversation itself was stellar. It gat the point across that Mrs.W. alluded to...we will be acquaintances period.

I'm back on the horse now.

NO DA#$ED EXPECTATION, YOU HAVE A GAME PLAN, JUST RUN THE PLAYS!!!!

Thank you all for the encouragement.

Good to have you back.

Have you been reading lately? Got any questions or stuff you want to discuss? You have my email when you do.

Mark

TMTS,

Sorry you’re having a tough time. I’m gonna break the rules and post from work tonight because it looks like you could really use the support.

I’m glad the visual imagery helped you get through the mediation. From what you have described it sounds like everything went very well. You kept your composure and that was the important part. Did you see LaLa’s foggy posts? Fogapalooza is no joke. During that time I received so many laser vision dirty looks that I looked like swiss cheese. Still don’t believe in the fog? Go back and read LaLa’s first post in the Fogapalooza thread. You would swear from reading that first post that I was her worst enemy. I had spent our entire marriage making her life miserable. Now think about all the wonderful things she has posted to me and many other BS’s on MB since she had her “epiphany”. Do you see the difference in the frame of mind. For me, it’s like 2 different people posting in those threads. Almost like Jekyll and Hyde. I would say there is most definitely a WS fog. The biggest problem is that there is no magic formula to make it go away. You keep throwing rocks and hope that one day they will reach the surface(love this analogy mark).

As for your DW catching you crying, don’t worry about it. Why shouldn’t you be upset? You have stated all along that this isn’t what you want. You are the one that is thinking clearly not her. So don’t beat yourself up over this. I know containing your emotions is very hard to do. It was probably my biggest obstacle in our recovery. For the most part, I think my plan a was pretty good. I did everything I could to meet LaLa’s EN’s and showed her that we could rebuild a better marriage for the both of us. The one thing I struggled with everyday was controlling my emotions. Just ask LaLa. I was a blubbering idiot. I would lose control at the drop of a hat. All it took was one tiny little trigger and off I went. I would bet that I have cried more tears in the past 16 months than I had in my entire life. Yet in some of those moments, when LaLa reached out to me, I saw glimpses of the woman I fell in love with and it gave me the strength to continue fighting. I think that is what your DW gave you. It was a glimpse that this is beginning to affect her. Whether or not she is willing to admit it or not yet, it is having an affect.

So let’s look at the current state of things. Yes, they are very hard, but at least you can take solace in the fact that your DW isn’t being openly mean like so many other WS’s on these boards. You have an opportunity to set yourself up as best you can by avoiding losing your composure with your DW. Stick with the plan because it is what’s best for you and your DD’s. You really have no other choice for now because you’ve already realized that if she chose to your DW could pretty much ruin you financially. So why do you think that she is being so easy on you? IMHO, I would say it’s because she is feeling very GUILTY for the choices she is making. I had the same post M relationship conversions with LaLa just before our big fight and I got the same blank wayward stare that you described. It’s all part of that frame of mind.

So let’s see. You’ve already done the math and with what she’s asking for in the LSA it’s just a matter of time before she will run into financial trouble. Like you said, even with the parties there is no way she can afford to be on her own. Not to mention the fact that she would need to meet 30-40 new people every week to even put them together. If you ask me she is in complete and total denial. Then there is the other fact that your ODD has obviously voiced her opinion on what is happening and I would venture to say that it is only a matter of time before your YDD starts acting out like your ODD. Plus the fact of losing your domestic support is going to be a HUGE wake up call for her. So let’s see, your DW is going to work fulltime, parent 2 outwardly angry DD’s, throw parties to try and make ends meet, do laundry, grocery shop, cook and somehow she’s going to have this great new life. Tell me you don’t honestly see where you DW isn’t thinking clearly. She is definitely in a FOG. Either that or she has just gone completely looney!

My point is, stick with the plan TMTS. It’s what you have to do for now anyways. That way, should she choose to go through with this ridiculous plan, at the very least she won’t have ruined you financially and you’ll be in a better position to provide for your DD’s. Then, once the LSA is signed and the arrangements have been made you can decide if you’ve had enough and go to plan B. The great big slap of reality that she will get once she has moved out may be just the thing to break through to her. For now, you just need to hang in there and try to stay one step ahead of her.

Want2Stay

GOOD NEWS!! This is almost exactly what happened to me. I wasn't calling constantly or anything, but he did not have a cell phone, so to call him meant calling his home. He never called me and so I was cut off. It will pass, TMTS. Just hang in there. Told you her poker face was good! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" /> She feels guilty and is very conflicted.

I cannot stress enough that THIS is the time you start romancing her again. Not in a forceful/pushy way or anything, but nice dinners out together, flirty stuff, a lot of attention. I think she is primed for you to sweep her off her feet. Not to mention you are ready for a break from all this stuff, too. Like I told Try, go out and have some fun together! See a movie and hold her hand during the show, etc. What does she enjoy? If she is in the mood to party, then hit the bar together! Get some babysitting and go on an overnight getaway to Niagra. You get the idea! This doesn't mean that there has to be SF, as she is probably not ready for that yet. But that doesn't mean you can't find other ways to romance her that will bring you two closer as a COUPLE.

But, for goodness sake, quit buying into her moving out ruse! She most likely cannot think of a way out of this mess, because she is stubborn (not that I know ANYTHING about that--be quiet W2S!) and wants to be that "once I've set my mind to something" blah blah blah. Give her another option--YOU! Make her feel comfortable with that choice, yanno. Let her see that being with you is the right decision and not just her giving up her newfound "dreams." Does that make sense?

I hope so, and I hope you can find new strength from that information. Use it to your advantage!

Holy cow, I just saw my DHs post. A long post from W2S...who'da thunk it! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />(Mrs. W/BK-that was for you!) He worked on that in Word all night at work, BTW. I really need to deactivate his Word document access!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Just teasin', babe, it was a GOOD ONE!!

My last post was in response to TMTS's from the bottom of the last page...

What a team... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Thanks Marky! We just think you are STELLAR!!

I love you guys!!! Can you imagine the mess I would be in if I hadn't found all of you. That thought is not even funny.

So here's the plan for tomorrow. Get up at &am and make her Breakfast (She works at 9), while at work I clean the place right up and get laundry started as well as supper. I'm thinking Shepard pie. Then I suggest we play some more guitar hero (We really seem to enjoy that together). I will try with some affection and a little flirting but not to aggressive. Remember that we are officially separated (Have not slept in the same bed since Dec. 9) so I need to tread lightly with that one. I also need to get my letter ready to send to Jennifer.

So we continue with the plan.

Oh yes, the Neighbor was witness to one call where she was in the driveway trying to call him from his cell, and could hear the sister telling her to stop calling all the time. From what she could figure they stopped taking messages for him as well and that when he did get messages he didn't call back.

This is why I think MR. W's scenario #1 where she is hoping to get him back into the relationship by moving out, but she is not taking into account what your DH describes as the reality of having to take care of a place on her own as well as having the children there. I just hope that this 35yo bar hopper has more interest in finding a single woman a little younger with no kids over a 38yo Married Mother of two with a H that would just love to hand him his Casanova A$$ on a platter.

So bottom line is that even if she does go through with it, reality will really bite hard when he still doesn’t call her. Then she will be truly alone, with all her lingerie.

Hehehehe...aaahhhhh...the fogginess can actually be a little humorous at times, huh!

But here's the thing...she knows. Somewhere in that foggy little world, she knows. She's just stubborn. She just needs to realize there is still hope and a MUCH better choice!

OMG, W2S is typing away...everybody put on your reading glasses! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

TMTS,

Breakfast sounds like a great plan! Here's a little something I did to LaLa one time. I assume you know her morning routine pretty well. Before she gets up go around the house and leave post-it notes everywhere she goes while she's getting ready for work. Just quick little love notes. Nothing too mushy. Put one in the shower, in her make-up, on the hair dryer, on her car seat. You get the idea. There is a reason why my plan a drove LaLa nuts. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

W2S

Not sure what it is that she knows...

I'm resizing a pic to send to your email. check it in a little...

She knows that she is going to have it really rough on her own. She knows that being single isn't all it's cracked up to be. She knows that it isn't going to be easy and that she really has it made with YOU!

Silly boy <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Cute pic! Your girls are purdy!

Papa needs a haircut. LOL

We're looking for the one we want on the MB site now. Our computer crashed a couple weeks ago (with all the pics on it!). We have found all the other pics except the most recent batch that has a really good one of all of us. It's on a CD somewhere...