Bob, one thing you posted really stood out for me...


You have no idea how much I miss playing squash---especially with the mushy, flat, yellow-dot English ball. Not those freakin' golf balls that Americans use... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> I used to be a semi serious tennis player, but back injuries led me to give it up. But I still had a damn good squash game---for a Yank, anyway. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

So, back on topic---your recovery with regards to time sounds really quite good! Impressive with regards to the job---it's nice to be valued, and have supportive management. Don't feel ungrateful for the dissatisfaction---you've probably got an "8" for a marriage, but you want a 10. And I don't think you want that just for yourself---you'd like it for Squid too. That's just called 'setting the bar high', and it's positive. It's motivating. You have little chance of getting there if you decided to settle---and I imagine that you will get there eventually. And it'll probably just be a couple simple things that trip it for you...

Blessings to you and your family as well!

FogFree


Congratulations on your work and recovery as well. It's really great that you could cut through the fog quickly and join MR in recovery. Well done! (And I'm trying to avoid raising MR's BP too much... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> )

Hey Bob,

An MB weekend in London has just been announced!

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Bob,
I am 2 years past D-Day.
Tonight my husband and me got into it and I found myself at marriage builders and came across your post. Must have been meant to be.

Our biggest problem is his lack of involvement in our recovery. I feel like I was the one who had the affair and now I have to do all the work. He has never shown true remorse for his affair. I never really got a remorseful apology.

He did come to marriage builders posted 2 posts the last one not to long ago and that was his effort for marriage building principles.

It’s sad I am in my early 30’s and afraid of being alone.

A lot of it has to do with the fact that I have been with him since I was 16.

And the fact that I truly never had my parents in my life. My father was sent to prison for abusing me. My mother blamed me and to this day has nothing to do with me even after my dad died.

Knowing everything I’ve been through he still choose to do this to me.
He knows that he and the kids are all I have.

He is comfortable in the fact that I am going nowhere.

He’s right I am here for the long haul.

But there are days that I regret not walking away and making him realize the blessing he has been given.

Am I asking for too much? “ I don’t think so”. Just like I don’t think your asking for too much.

We deserve to know that we are worth fighting for. That our spouses are truly sorry for what they did. So why is it so hard for them to just put a little effort into it? Only they know.

We are left to try and figure out the hand we were dealt. I just pray that my husband realizes what God has blessed him with before it’s to late.


I know I didn’t answer anything for you but your post helped me. I needed to get this stuff out. And today I felt very alone in the way I was feeling until I came across your post.
Thank you

Bob I pray that squid will find it in herself to open up to you and give you what you desire.

Blessing on starting Marriage Builders in your church.

Am I settling a little bit. But I have faith that we will get through this. He's an awesome father no doubt about that. And I truly do love him I just need him to step up <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

( sorry to ask on your thread Bob.. but K when is the MB W/e in London. Tried to find some info, not sure where to look.)

Many thanks

You know K I never could play tennis. I never got the handle of spinning off the racket when hitting the ball fast so I used to knock it to freakin' MARS when I hit it hard.

Squash is another ballgame * ahem *.

I was a fine player in my twenties, and have returned to the game since d-day with Squid. My game now is based on positioning and accuracy, not speed and fitness 'cos I'm a crock, but I'm not a bad player.

Hate American balls. Way too fast and bouncy to make the game interesting. ANYONE can get to a ball, and drop shots are almost non-existent IME.

Its good playing a sport with squid that isn;t bloody Karate * ptooey !* <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Spin... it's the secret to life. It's somewhat easier with those monster racquets they have nowadays.


It is another game---but the thing it emphasizes like tennis is strategy, not necessarily just a dominant rocket shot. My game was based on being so tall and long I could stand in the middle of the court and just lunge with a step to cover most of the court... There's nothing I liked better than covering a short smash and flipping a lob that skimms along the wall and lands in the back corner. Ahhhh.


Yeah---you might as well be playing racquetball! I'll never forget the first time I played squash (against a English professor). We played tennis together (I'd hand him his shorts). He handed me the ball. I dropped it---and it sat on the floor! I looked at him and told him it was broken---the look he gave me was priceless.


I bet!!!!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Hi Bob,

We have been in recovery for nearly a year and I would say that for the most part our recovery is going fairly well and quickly, all things considered. But I have been struggling with this same issue for ages. If I am honest, I think most of the BS's on here have settled. Judging by all the posts on these forums very few WS's jump on board with both feet and are prepared to really do 'whatever it takes' (even though many claim they will).

For me the difficulty lies in the fact that I have 2 very small children, and my FWH is the best father I could hope for. By staying with him though, I do feel that I have let myself down, I am worth so much more than this. I do often wish I’d had the guts to divorce him the moment I’d found out. For me as an individual, staying hasn't been the right decision. But I am a mother and doing that well and acting in the best interests of my children is far more important than any pride issues that this situation may present for me. I really resent my FWH for putting me in this position, where I have to choose between what's right for me as a human being and what is right for me as a parent, and I really resent that he probably hasn't even given it a seconds worth of thought that he has put me in this dilemna or the anguish it causes me.
At the end of the day I think it's just a bitter pill that I have to swallow - I have to put my pride aside in order to put my children first. In so many respects we have a very happy family, and I feel that in the grand scheme of things I need to be mature enough to appreciate this, and to keep investing and make the best of it. Focus on the good things and improve the things I can or cut my losses and get divorced (waaaaay easier said than done though!!!)

I also find that my tolerance level for any of FWH's lovebusting behaviours is very low. What pre-affair would have been construed as a big or small irritation that I could overlook, now has a major impact on my lovebank. I know from conversations that FWH just does not get that a 2 year affair has basically put my lovebank in overdaft and that it's going to take enormous effort to fill it again. I also find that when things go well, deposits are made, but one or two minor irritations now empty it out immediately. I expect him to be making a gargantuan effort to fill my lovebank and to make an even bigger effort to not make any withdrawals. I want to feel like he will fight to win me back. Reading these posts always leaves me with the impression that WS’s are rewarded for having an affair - suddenly they have a spouse who now tries even harder to meet their needs, whether or not they step up and put in the same effort.

We are in counselling with Steve Harley and it has helped a lot, especially in getting him to appreciate his accountability. But I still can't help but get the impression from my own FWH and the posts here that most WS's are just not as invested as the BS's who try against the odds to keep their families intact. My FWH does try, probably even very hard by his own standards, but it's not enough. For the damage he has done to me and for what an affair and a subsequent divorce would have done to our children, but for my decision to give him another chance to make this right, I really need to see some grand gestures. I think that's what most of us BS's need, but it seems to me that there is something in WS's that stops them from giving it. Is it pride, or is it that in doing so they will have to really face what they have done? Are they heartless and unable to empathise? Are they incredibly selfish by nature or just immature? I dunno. Maybe it's just power struggle issue.
I'm pretty sure that if I had an affair, I would beg, grovel and feel unworthy. I would do the grand gestures.

[THREAD JACK] Onethousandwords....I have been praying for you but could not remember your name. Do you remember me, Ace, from last spring? I kept bumping your thread but you were gone. So glad to see you checking back in. Now if the teacher BrokeninCali and gsh are reading, you're the other 2 of that MIA trio in my prayers from March and April. [end of threadjack]

Bob, my FWH says he will do anything to help me heal. Last night we were talking about attending an MB weekend and we noted that he has to work the end of January. He said, find out where the next one is and we'll go. I said OK and then discovered it was possibly London in June from your link.

His eyes got a little big, but he said, "I want to go with you." Not sure if that will happen but thanks for your link to this info.

Ace

Hey Bob. . .

What we cannot change is that our wives can cheat; they did, so the evidence is irrefutable. What we would most like is a situation wherein we feel safe. We don't because retribution hasn't been adequate and their personality changes insufficient. Betrayal changes our perception of life and we cannot restore the blind faith we had before affair. Yet we would want that above all else.

In other words, we want our FWW to become someone in whom we can place our absolute faith and trust; our vision of who they should be. Given free will, they in turn want to be themselves, not our vision of who they should be. Since we cannot really know what moves their spirit: mindreaders we ain't, we extrapolate.

Last night, we got rid of a reminder. The OM had constructed (badly) a doll house for daughter. I had looked at it numerous times and now worked up to suggesting that we replace it. Wife went along and I built it in the living room floor, complete with well applied glue in all the right places. Wife was emphatic that it needed replacing as she no longer wanted the reminder. Whilst working away, she observed my efforts and said, "You know what we are doing, don't you?"

Not sure as to what she meant, I said, "What do you mean?"

Her reply was, "Replacing bad memories with good ones."

What does all that mean in terms of who my wife is? Certainly she isn't the same person who spread her legs for the cretin who was intent on destroying all our lives, as was she at the time. Just as I have memories, so does she. And we cannot escape from our memories. Our memories make us who we are for better or for worse.

Larry

Hi lar !


Yep


I feel safe Larry. Safe because I won't be destroyed if Squid cheats again, NOT because I am certain she won't have another affair.

I feels plenty safe, what I want to feel is admired, valued, loved more.


I didn't have ANY retribution, and I don't want or expect a personality trait change. behaviour trait changes that invest in me YES. Personality, no.


AMEN manchile !


Not me, mate, see above. Nowadays I think people are saps who have blind faith in people.

Many changes in me I don't like, but I am happy to be more self reliant and realistic than before.

Then ace, you are truly blessed. I mean it.

SAME HERE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

For all of those who want more from their post A marriages; maybe if they divorced and married again, just maybe they would discover that all marriages eventually become old, and that people every where don't put in as much as they should. I suspect it's the sole domain of a BS to expect more from their marriage mate, after they have been so wronged by them. The thing is that most of the time the WS finds it impossible to understand the extent of the damage they have done. It's like thinking we know how it feels to have a terminally ill child. We have no idea really - we feel sorry for those affected but after 10, 20 or 40 minutes of dwelling on a sad story, we put it out of our minds and get on with our life as we know it - which is what the WS tries to do after infidelity. Their laps in behavior can be put to rights by returning to the M and giving up the OP (or so they think). Whereas the BS is forever changed. Craving more - unable to live the peaceful routine existence they once enjoyed as it reminds them of life when their S went wayward.

AN

Well said, Anyname!

Wow, that's a scarey thought! That a peaceful state of being could be a trigger? I hope not, but maybe!

Hi Anyname !

I certainly agree that few FWS truly see the devastation their affairs caused their BS.

Thing is, however briefly, FWS typically derived huge pleasure from their A - while the BS has not a single positive attribution to it. Many FWS come to regret , even HATE their affairs, but I don't see how something that was once worth risking their marriage / life as they knew it for can be seen as a BS sees it: i.e. "life rape".

We got home today ( after a 48 hour delay at JFK airport) from a LOVELY family holiday / vacation. Squid was lovable and funny. We got on great with the kids and each other. Genuinely happy.

Yet 90% of that happiness is a result of MY work. Regardless of the effect of it, I want to see some heavy lifting from Squid in this marriage.

Writing this I can see perhaps its the GESTURE of Squid valuing me and our M enough to invest uncomfortably in it that is important to me, not the marriage improvements that might result from that.

Hmm.

Thanks again all, very interesting responses !

AN, thanks for sharing this. Tyk's perception triggered a lightbulb for me because my sitch is so different. Now I see how it might seem like we have recovered quickly.

We had 32 years of detachment. I longed for a Biblically justifiable reason to get out.

H had 2 EA's, and I didn't find about the first til the second six years later. That was June of 2006.

I found and we began reading MB books together in the fall of 2006, but I did not register on these forums until Jan. of 2007.

After I began learning and changing, my WH chose to change nearly overnight. But what it appears he did was decide for the first time that he truly wanted to marry me and then I truly wanted to marry him.

So it's almost like we're newlyweds. I've always dreamed of this but almost felt guilty because it seems so unreal.

Your little nugget of truth has just explained a question I've had for nearly a year.

I can't tell you have much this helps me. And makes me glad I didn't tone down my story. As unbelieveable as it may seem, it's all true.


I intend no disrespect for posters who had truly loving peaceful marriages pre-A and can't get back to it due to the triggers that 'peaceful' might represent. But this makes it so much easier for those of us who did not.

Thanks for sharing Anyname and Tyk. And thanks for this thread, Bob. It's been very helpful for me! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Ace

PS I don't think I've ever posted to you Tyk, but I appreciate all your posts. You seem to have learned quite quickly and I'm glad you shared what you did.