You aren't stupid Spike.

I asked because if you read it smart folk here like Melody Lane and Pepperband can help apply it to your situation, but no volunteer here would give you a prescriptive plan as you seem to want.

You should call Steve or Jennifer Harley for a phone consultation for a plan you can take to the bank.

I'm a bit short of cash at the moment.
Melody gave some advice before on the Tokyo situation so was up on what happened before.
I have been cocking up Plan A, as us Brits say. I need to re-focus it on being me, which I have been bad at as justkeeptrying said. I have been interpreting it as being about winning her back when it should be about me and her seeing the positive side of me.
From tomorrow - New game face, just hope I get the chance to try it out.
Thanks guys....I will re-focus on Plan A and re-post as Tokyo approaches and we see what she tells me she wants to do. I think I will need some advice then depending on the situation.

Just a quick PS Bob, Basically before Melody said that a move to Tokyo with her was good and what Dr Harley had recommended in a previous situation, however, I really recognise the need for it to be on the right terms and on the basis of NC with the OM.

Anyway will come back to Tokyo later, I think I need to focus on my Plan A right now otherwise her going anywhere with me will be a moot point anyway!

I really appreciate all the help, honestly you guys & gals keep me going, especially Bob, thanks for your patience. I know a lot of what you guys are telling me from my reading but I think I am in fog sometimes and so tired I cant remember it and end up messing it up. I need you guys to pull me back on track. Thanks again.

Spike...

all of this blame you are willing to shoulder...

the

I messed up plan A....
I LB'd all over the place
I pushed her away
I will be the reason she stays with OM...

is all how do you brits say?? eh Bob....
ummmm

poppycock....bullocks and poppycock

yep it's all babbled poppycock straight from her lips...
and your only mistake is BUYING in to it...

all of these encounters in which crap gets flung on to you..

the dramatic.....

you're driving me away
you're doing this or that emotionally to me
all the babble from her lips to your ears...
all these things she wastes your and her time on when you are together

plays right in to the hands of a infidel...

always always always keeping the focus off of the reality of her actions of the affair....and keeping focus on ridulous ramblings of this or that that you did didn't do..
are doing aren't doing.....

to a WS they love nothing more than the perfect scape goat...

you want to get your wifes attention...

next time she calls be pleasant...but end the call say oh it's you...I can't talk right now...I'm waiting for a call

and hang up...

next time she calls to chat or even with a request...

say..oh I was right in the middle of doing something...can I call you back..then don't call back...

quit playing in to her
quit asking her ANYTHING
quit ACTING like you are interested..

now be nice
be pleasant..
in fact be in a great mood...
but don't interact with her be distracted and end the interation...

if she comes over say hey I only got a half hour..then I am outta here...and leave...
or meet her at the door on the way out...and go go go..

you have spent your whole time exactly where she wants you..

pining for her
waiting for her

time to mix it up....
time to turn the heat up

part of your good plan A and you've done this so quit being so hard on yourself...is that you are man who finds it UNACCEPTABLE for you and your wife to be in a triangle..

spike until you are willing to lose your wife
until you can grasp that having her not in life...is not ever as bad as having someone who doesn't 'care' enough to be there,,...then YOU won't be able to get in to recovery...

people that read this are holding their breath and praying that you realize that this community....
acknowledges YOUR own value and sovereignity INSPITE of anything your spouse does or doesn't do...

if still only see your life with value with her in it no matter the circumstance.....
then you are at great risk for false recovery,..

that's pretty much all that we are saying here...
recover is hard
false recovery is devastating....

you deserve more

plan A
throw some 180's in her face..be smiley hum a new tune...
and cut her short....

the whole time be uber nice,,.,,

your wife will be gobsmacked with the thought of you NOT pining for her...

mix it up
get her attention

ARK

Ark thats so helpful, thanks...
I need that, it's not that I only see my life with value with her in it, it's just that I put her as being the centre of my life and I don't know how to fill it without her. It's just so hard and I still love her very much.
Saying that, I am going to try as suggested tomorrow, be upbeat, happy Plan A and also try a few 180s, say I've got something to do, cut her off in a nice way etc.
Will let you know how it goes. Thanks

I'm beginning to wonder whether it's worth it.....
Valentines day, pure ****** for many, she said she wanted to see me, turns up then steals my car saying she needs to see a friend and will be back. Says "kiss me" as if that makes everything alright....
Was so set up to be on my best Plan A today, but all I want to do now is kill her.
I really wanted to take her for lunch and do a good Plan A type effort so that stayed in her mind when she will obviously have dinner and whatever else with him tonight.
Beginning to realise she is just a selfish ******, half the time she is complaining to me about this friend now she is more important than me.
So close to exploding and telling her to F-off. Sick of her yo-yo ing, lies and [censored].

It is worth it, because you will be able to look back in five years and know that you did your best. You will have no regrets.

When you feel like exploding, come here and vent. We understand.

Well she came back when she said she would which surprised me so I calmed down put on my best Plan A hat and took the advice from yesterday to be basically a strong man with no whingeing or pressure.....
Very surprised, we actually had a good time and she opened up...
We laughed, drank, had the music loud in the car, generally messed around with each other, silly jokes that hasn't happened in a long time.
She even wanted to talk about the relationship!!!
She told me that the OM looks like he is faking sickness so that he doesn't have to go away for three weeks, probably because he knows she is still seeing me. So normally if I asked her what she is going to do she would go crazy at the pressure! This time she wanted to talk and actually said, we need to make a plan what to do, she said all it is is her stupid pride getting in the way, not love anymore, which I do believe.
I said I was going to get out of this place either to Tokyo or London to find a good job and would "prefer" she come with me. She said she liked my choice of words.
I was shocked how receptive she was to talking about him and finishing with him and what we would do.
I guess my change in attitude made a huge difference.
She also said one telling thing, that if she were still in love with him or she was happy with him she would not be with me having lunch. She said we have a connection that cannot be broken, which is true. We agreed that you sometimes only get that connection with someone once in your life.
She also said when I asked her how her relationship was with him, normally an off bounds subject but today she was really open to talking with my new attitude. She said that it's up and down, they don't argue everyday at the moment but she said that's only because when they don't argue they are not talking!!!!

So I know you have to take what WS say with a pinch of salt sometimes but I can tell when she is lying and when she is being genuine, lucky that I can, I can't always tell what she is lying about but I know when she is doing it. So I do think all of the above is true. She just needs to get over her false pride and dump him.

She also said that they still have not had sex since New Year and she wasn't planning to anymore with him either. I was a bit scpetical of this last time she said it and today as well but her best friend let slip that she now thinks sex with him is boring, so not only is it boring (true) but she seems to have lost "that loving feeling" with him.

So in the ****** that is Valentines day I feel lucky I got that chance today and left her with a very good feeling about me going into tonight with him. I asked if they were going anywhere and she said they had no plans. Even if they do, at least she will have happy memories of the time with me which is what I wanted to do.

So thanks to all the people who pulled me up on my whiney pressuring attitude, by changing myself today (got a haircut last night as well) she actually opened up to me and talked about the future which is normally off limits as the Harleys also say in the book.

I just have to keep the pressure up now I guess of being an excellent Plan A, and at some point in the not too distant future I need to decide whether me making good money somewhere else will either give them the space they need to completely collapse and she comes to me, or whether he relaxes more with her if I am not there.

Thanks for listening! Love any comments as always keeps me on the straight and narrow....only got you guys and gals to do that!

Forgot one important, very important thing, him being away was supposed to be her chance to get out, her words not mine, so it looks like that opportunity is going to disappear.
That I am upset about as how long before her pride goes and she does what needs to be done and finishes it.

I have had one rather nasty idea which may send him packing back to the states. I def need advice on this....

He is working as a contractor to US military bases overseas. I know the company he works for. I also know he hacks into email accounts as he did with mine. So if I were feeling very nasty I could write a letter to his company, CEO, and the Dept of Defense hotline suggesting that he is not being security conscious and is guilty of hacking systems.

The desired effect would be to have him pulled back to the states and out of a secure area, but I don't know whether it is worth doing and it would have that effect or I am being too downright nasty.

They probably, you never know, wouldnt find any evidence of security breaches but it may be enough to put him under suspicion working outside of the US in sensitive military areas so he has to return to the US to a less secure area.

Maybe I am having a stupid moment again, but it could be a smoking gun to nuke them once and for all.

Hey Spike!

Great job on the Plan-A when you had lunch with your W!

If OM was using ANY government equipment and hacked into another government site, or even a private system... he needs to be reported ASAP!

I'd call the base Hotline where he works and report him. If he's hacking government computers or using government computers for his hacking purposes, then he's a threat.

Semper Fi,

RIF

Ah I recognise a marine.....I have a lot of friends who are marines where I am you may guess where...:-)
He is an ex-m, and I know he has hacked into my email accounts and I believe he used base computers to do it. Who knows what else he has hacked into?
I could in theory really drop him in it, and apart from the email hacking concoct something else as well.
Report it to his company via anonymous email, as a co-worker who is not happy with what they see and if they dont deal with it, I will report it to the Dod hotline.
I know it's sneaky, underhand and will definitely drop him in some sort of ****** but whether he will get sent back to the US I dont know.
I am a pretty honourable guy, but the way he hacked into my life, destroyed my car and threatened to kill me is not exactly responsbile behaviour.
What do you think? Going too far?

Also Rif and others I know its tricky but do you think she is genuinely getting ready to end it with him following what she said to me this afternoon if it werent for her stupid pride?

Hey Spike,

I know that you have a 'personal' connection with this OM, but right is right, and this guy is breaking the law if he's hacking into government computers.

I'd watch your W's ACTIONS and see if they match her words... WS will say all sorts of things and from my experience, you can't really trust a word they say...

If she really does mean what she says, then her ACTIONS will say everything you need to hear...

Semper Fi,

RIF

Spike, Great work... What a difference a day makes.

Now... Be prepared for a completely different person next time you meet.

Continue to have no expectations! She will flip like a switch.

-JKT

Spike,

YOU DA MAN!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Very good for you!!

Now, concerning this scumball that is hacking into emails and abusing his position IT IS YOUR DUTY TO REPORT HIM! Even if it is anonymously. If he destroyed your car and threatened to kill you, what else is he capable of doing??

know it's sneaky, underhand and will definitely drop him in some sort of ******

This shows what an honorable man you are, but I do not see it as sneaky and underhanded. He is a threat to the security of where ever you are.

PLUS!! It is your MB duty to break up the A by any possible means. You are fighting for your marriage, my friend, and ALL IS FAIR IN LOVE AND WAR!!

Another aspect of manning up that seems to be working wonderfully for you.

Stay strong.

kirk

Thanks for all the comments guys.

I did feel it went good, the last two weeks she has hated me mentioning any kind of question about the relationship, no matter how small but yesterday she actually wanted to talk and had fun with me as well.
I guess a lot of that was my attitude but I also think it was down to what one of you guys yesterday said about making her think she could lose me.
I said about going away and working, she said oh you can go and work away for our future, like she tricked me before. I said I'm not going to do that, go away and work with our future in mind.

I said I'll go and work for me and I would like you to come with me. I didnt say it but the inference was that if she chose to stay with him then that would be it, which scared her I think. Because then she was actually talking about what if we moved to a new country, and school for children and where to live etc.

One thing with this I dont get:

Before she tricked me to go back to England and work saying it was for our future then moved the OM in. I came back and the rest is history as they say.
What I dont get is her and her friends, so I know this is true tell me that if I had stayed there and got a good job as I know I can she WOULD HAVE COME TO ME!!!

So I dont understand why she wanted to hook up with this guy in the first place as even when the affair was at its peak she was thinking about being with me somewhere else!!

I dont understand that. Although she managed to get rid of me, she was actually thinking about ditching the OM and coming to me if I had another good job!

What does that mean? Does it mean I should be focussing on a good job even in another country not only for me but because I should be listening to what she says and although moving away will be painful it may be the surest way to get her back?

What do you think?

Also on the subject of him and dropping him in the ******. I am going to do it. If he doesnt go away for 3 weeks which I dont think he will as he is trying to get out of it and that was her opportunity to come back to me I am going to send the letter to first his boss in the USA,

Maybe I should have man-up and done that a long time ago and it would have been over by now. Military security is a big deal and he may have got pulled back to the states 2 months ago and that would have been it. I was stupid to listen to his threats of killing me and her threats of not saying anything or she would finish with me. I should have just done it anonymously anyway.

Just had another thought about me sending a letter to his boss that it would almost 100% result in his suspension which is going to push them together all day so she would not be able to see me, what do you guys think, good think to hasten the demise of it, or bad that they are together all day?

Spike,

What proof or suspicion do you have he did this from work?

If I wanted to play around in the IP world, I would do it from home.

Gov computers for the most part, are very limited on the type of connections allowed in the public WWW.

Private e-mail accounts, etc, are not allowed to be connected to from work, the sites are typically blocked.

It would take Administrave rights over the machines to allow this type of action. Also anyone with these rights would be aware, they are putting the job/clearance in jeopardy.

Be certian not to make false accusations.

-JKT

Thats the problem I guess I dont know. I know for sure he has hacked into my email account and I know he did this on base but whether it was a secure military computer or not I dont know. He has hacking tools on a USB key that I believe he uses at work but I dont know.
A lot of suspicion but not much proof. So it may not be a good idea.
So unless I cook up a load of ******, it's probably not going to be worth it is it I guess.

Actually I just had another thought as well I'll throw out there.
I wonder if the amazing behavious on V-day was as much to do with the fact that I have been in our relationship an atypical nice guy. I have been reading "No More Mr Nice Guy" recently. I wondered just now whether she has got bored with me putting her on a pedestal and looks down on me for it due to her behaviour.
By putting myself first and saying basically, I;m off to make money whether you come or not, it's actually attractive to her again.
Not an attitude like a bad boy, but not a doormat.....
Interested what you guys think.....it's something very difficult for me to stop treating her like a princess, but I think I may have found a loaded gun physcologically wise in the ongoing emotional war..:-)

got a good job as I know I can she WOULD HAVE COME TO ME!!!

ditching the OM and coming to me if I had another good job!

Is your WW any relation to the one legged chick divorcing Sir Paul?

Totally sounds like her number one EN is $$$$$$$$$. Now maybe this is the security for "her son" that is driving this.

MY only question would be why be with the poor, broke OM?

It is a mystery.

kirk

This is what I dont get as well.
I know for sure that her number 1 EN is money.
She had a bad time before and she sees having money in her account as security for her son and her. She is not highly educated so likes to save and have someone who looks after her.
Sometimes she likes nice things but is not a gold digger
It is huge EN for her because of security.

I think she went to him first because simply she thought he would give her money and provide for her.

Now she relises that is not going to happen her pride is the only thing stopping her from leaving.

I am beginning to see that if I was secure in my life again with a good job and "status" she would be out of there like a shot. Hence the comments her friends made before.

The only reason she is still there now is that I am not currently in a good job but am still providing some ENs.

If I got out went and made money and stopped meeting her ENs, i.e Plan B I am beginning to see she would run so fast out of not only me being a better choice but fear she will lose me.