Hi, Jayne, I'm not sure where the honest boundaries are. I could see myself in your situation, I'd have a hard time not trying to prevent a spouse from feeling the very severe consequences of long-term underemployment - state-funded housing, inadequate access to medical care, inability to afford private transportation, the embarassment of bringing food stamps to the store when he's an able-bodied guy, etc. I'd probably enable him for years, too. Have you read Boundaries In Marriage by Cloud and Townsend? Like I said, I really don't know the answer, but I'd be glad to reason through it with you.



There are times that my H simply isn't listening to me. I asked him, and he was honest to me and said he wasn't listening to what I was saying. Then it's not honest to continue speaking to him as if he's listening. A drive-by I think is just thinking out loud. Then I drop the denial that we are having conversations when we simply aren't.

But is that the case with you guys? Or is he listening and just taking time to process? If he is processing, what about pausing to let him process? Is English, or whatever language you all communicate in, his first language? I know some Canadians from Quebec speak French mainly, right?

Here's a link I found about Stosny's HEALs method. Oh my goodness, I left a LOT out! I'm glad you asked, I'm going to review it and start doing it as intended instead of how I remembered it! The book is Love Without Hurt

http://symcinc.com/getinformed/howtoheals.html

Thanks for the HEALS link.


Yes we speak English and that's his first language. He's from the prairies, very predominately English there although all official signs and documents must be in both. I really don't know if he's not listening or just taking time to process. It *feels* like I'm being ignored, and so I keep talking. But that doesn't mean that's what he's doing, and me keeping talking may not be helping.

There are times when he apparently didn't hear something I said, or forgot. But that could be true for someone who is listening also.

By the way Happy Mother's Day! I hope you are doing something fun today. I really felt like a mom this morning. H and I eventually managed to complete SF after several interruptions from kids, and then breakfast was microwave popcorn prepared by my kids. I have homemade cards and flowers planted in plastic cups. Couldn't ask for anything better!

I'm glad that you're having a great Mother's Day! Happy Mother's Day to you, too!

The kids brought me mocha coffee (coffee and hot cocoa mix) in bed. It was funny, we're early risers, so when the kids woke up I snuck back to bed We went to brunch at Church this morning. My mom slept late, so she didn't come, but I'm glad that I invited her. I'll pop over to see her later. We're going to the local botanical garden today with friends, and then H and the kids are making dinner. A great day

I hope you had fun at the botanical gardens, and enjoyed dinner made by your kids!

Tonight I asked H if he would take the job if I didn't want him to. He said he wouldn't. I asked, "Even if you really want it?" He said something like (can't remember exactly) we'd talk about it, and at this point he doesn't have his heart set on it anyway.

I asked what he would do if they don't offer it to him, and he still thinks he can get a job at his previous place again. He didn't mention anything about actively looking and I didn't feel like bringing it up.

Yesterday he snapped at me in the car after the kids' soccer game. I was acting a little peeved but wasn't snapping. When we got home he made me some cappacino and apologized, and then I apologized too.

It's way past my bedtime and I started reading the negotiating article. It's amazing, there's so much more than I remember and it makes so much more sense now.

Either I have a poor memory (could be!) or I just wasn't in a place where I could absorb it before.

This place is so good for personal growth!

The gardens were great, thanks, but we didn't realize that it was going to get to the mid 90s! And it's only May, yikes We brought ice water with us, and we had no trouble drinking all our water yesterday


Do you mean one that involves going back to Canada? The one that's paying him now?



What was signalling you to feel peeved here?

jayne, am I a thread-killer or what?

Hi ears, I'm sorry!

Grades were due at noon today plus I'm program chair for a conference this weekend so I'm fielding all sorts of emails. Then when I do have a minute and want to not think about work for a bit, I come here - but I don't have the energy to delve into my own stuff in the midst of work. It's easier to comment on someone else's thread. I'm sorry I left you hanging, I really do appreciate your input and you holding me to task!

Honestly, I didn't think anyone replied since last week... and I didn't think to check up on my own thread.

Re. jobs, he interviewed for a nice job in early April, that's in the US but it's ... well what the h*, this probably won't reveal my identity too much, and you won't get the real flavor of the place without the name! Ready? The job is in Deadwood, South Dakota. Yep, the place where Wild Bill Hickok was killed, the place of that incredibly gory HBO series. So that would require us to move, and whether or not I would be able to get a job is still uncertain (but not impossible).

He didn't go looking for that job, in fact even after he found out about it he still didn't apply until they contacted him personally and invited him to apply.

When I ask what he'll do if they don't offer him the job, he says he will be able to go back to his old place of work in Canada. Again, whether I could get a job is uncertain. Plus, they told him in March or April they don't have funding to hire anyone, but they might come summer. *Might*. He's banking on the funding becoming available and them wanting to hire him. He won't even discuss any other positions. I send him ads for positions and he doesn't look at them. When I mention them verbally, he asks if *I* am going to apply. I don't want to apply unless he wants to apply the same place. Plus it makes more sense for him to apply since I have a job - you know, applying for a job when you already have one, you don't want your employer to find out.

Re. what was signalling me feeing peeved... at the soccer game DS6b was goalie and H was taking pics way down at the other end of the field, where everyone else was including DS6a. But 6b was being so cute, he was cheering for his team and he was sort of singing it. I wanted H to get a picture of it. When I called him he told me to wait. He does that a lot, there is usually a delay when you ask him to do something, even if it's something that needs immediate attention, like someone about to fall or something. So by the time H decided I had waited long enough and came to ask "What?", 6b had stopped singing.

Yeah, not a big deal especially when I have to type it out in so many words! But little things had been happening like that all day. I can't remember now how it started. I was probably still grumpy from thinking about the job sitch too.

I do think posting on others' threads is part of our own work. Our own clarifying, good self-talk, all that good stuff

Jayne, wow you and I are worlds apart on the willingness to move thing. What makes you ready to move on from where you are living? Is what your H does so specialized that he can't find it locally, and would need to move somewhere? We visited Deadwood when we went to see the Grand Canyon a few years ago, and it looked pretty cool, but we only saw the touristy part.

These places you are sending him, I don't understand, why does he want you to apply? Is he unhappy with your current work situation? Are you unhappy with it? Most employers will understand and respect your request that not to check with your current employer until they're sure you're the candidate they want.

Do I have a lot of questions or what



Are you serious, or is this DJ speculation? Do you find this acceptable? How do you feel, jayne, when he does this? I feel angry on your behalf just reading about it. I feel really dismissed and disrespected and angry when my H deliberately waits in order to "get me back" for something I did. Why did your H deliberately do this to you? Was he ticked at you for something? Did you share your O&H?

What about bringing a second camera and finding other ways to "drop the tug-of-war rope" and minimize the consequences to you?

I get something similar from H and I'm positive he does it on purpose. When I make dinner, I say '10 minutes til it's ready' and when it's ready I say 'dinner's ready.' Then I put it out and say 'come on, let's eat.' He still doesn't get up off the couch. Then D17 and I sit down and I say 'we're eating, H.' He still won't move. A few minutes later, he will come sit down. Every time. It's like it makes him feel more important to be the one to keep us waiting, or else it's his attempt to not bow under 'nagging.' Does the same thing when we have to go somewhere; we even talked to IC about it and tried to come up with solutions, it's so prevalent. Her solution was to find ways to not be dependent on him participating, so an extra camera might have to do.

He won't answer when I ask him why he does it.

Then again, jayne's H may be completely unaware he's doing it.

Just got back from a conference. I was program chair, it went well. Now I majorly depressed. Might be lack of sleep, we drove al night cus I wanted to get back to my family rather than spend the night there and drive today. Slept about 4 hours, got up to return rental car, kids told me everything I missed (including soccer trophies I miss all the good stuff!) H made me a cappacino, I took a nap which always makes me feel yucky, and I'm still depressed.

H just made me a martini to try to make me feel better. I know, alcohol when you're depressed makes you feel worse, but I didn't have the heart to turn him down. I'ts mostly olives and olive juice - 9 olives.

I'm depressed.

I wish we had sf more. How do other women handle it when you're starting to have symptoms of perimenopause?

Someone please talk to me, I'm depressed.

{{{{HUGS}}}}
Jayne if you want to chat where we did the other night, i can talk to you.

jayne, have you ever read Stella recap her story? She asked her husband 100 times, in different ways, until he "got it" that this was important to her. They brainstorm lots of ways, doesn't habe to be just the same traditional way, you know?

I have a friend who would not be hostile or steaming to her then H, because she said, she didn't want to ruin the mood for that night. We used to have a poster here, pieta, who had a great attitude and was constantly teasing with her H, keeping that energy going.

What about asking your H for what you'd like this evening? Maybe tell the kids you have a surprise for them in the morning if they get to bed extra early.

That'd be a great antidote to the depression. Get some good chemicals going

thanks ears. I'm thinking, um... ok, sorry for being so graphic but... I'm thinking that it can be messy since things are no longer *periodic* if you KWIM. Is that a turn-off?

To be honest, that's 99% of the reason I've been less than enthusiastic about sf.

Oh an eeeeeeeeeeeezy.... easy solution. Pop in a diaphram that you get from the Dr (traditionally used for BC but great if you are spotting(

Also, the "cup" called INSTEAD. It is for your period but shaped and used like a tiny diaphram in there. No fuss no muss! All the pleasure too~!

Ah, wow! There's actually something for this? Thanks Stella!

Does the cup come in non-latex form?

http://www.softcup.com/product/what_is_softcup.php

They are not rubbery so maybe they are not latex.

Thanks!

I read thier ad again, and NO LATEX. Yay! I used to use them. You can buy them online or the drug stores used to stock them.

http://www.drugstore.com/products/p...0softcups&scinit1=instead%20softcups