Thanks for that story, Cherishing.

I don't admire people who tolerate infdelity. I see it all around me, women who have been destroyed as persons, as mothers because of their husband's infidelity and somehow feel proud that they stayed by their husbands. I think it did harm to both of them, and all those around too.
My 89 yr old friends husband was very unfaithful and also an alcoholic. He died years ago. When he lived she was terrified for her daughters, (although she never said she was afraid he would abuse them,) but she sent one girl to boarding school just to get her away, the other was too small. Her two daughters have married but neither has children, nor will they because they are past that age.

She never mentions him, and if for some reason he comes up in the conversation all she can say about him is that he was unfaithful and an alcoholic. She hates him.

But on the other hand, when you marry for the right reasons, i believe in ommittment. I just can't imagine leaving my marriage. Divorce will give me the freedom I need to be myself, but I don't feel I can replace my husband with another unless he dies. That's what I feel. Since the beginning and even now after 3 and a half years.
But I wish it hadn't happened.

Mimi,

the monk hasn't ever spoken seriously about the particular subject of infidelity but since the main point is "never to do anything which harms another or harms yourself" he says that you should be faithful to your partner because inidelity hurts him/her, and then he adds, after all husbands are all the same and so are wives! You think you're going to get something better but the outside is different and the inside is the same.
He speaks of kindness and compassion and let karma take care of the rest. The point is that with infidelity everyone is affected by the unfaithful's karma!

Anyway, I don't hate WH, I feel sorry for him. And I am very conscious that I am the only person who can forgive him if he ever chooses to repent. In the meantime he will carry the guilt. The monk always says that he never met a criminal who didn't regret what he had done. It's karma!

I've seen with my own eyes, how people cannot repent because they do not find the appropriate moment or attitude from the offended to do so. And it's sad. It's a huge missed opportunity to find that narrow path.

I am living that situation now with my friend at work whose husband was unfaithful. He left the OW immediately, but she keeps reminding him, berating him, criticizing, insulting and blaming him. He has tried to make amends but nothing has been enough and I think it will not work out. They continue to make each other miserable. And I think the main problem is that she's not really willing to forgive him.

I want to give WH the chance to repent because the life he has chosen is obviously not a good one. I don't wish that for him. OW is a predator interested primarily in his money, as she herself has publicly said. I doubt she will be faithful to him. She's not a nice person.

But this doesn't mean that I like who WH is now either. I am very sure that I don't want to go back to the marriage we had, and at this point I will not tolerate any lies, or dishonesties ever again, so marriage to WH is probably impossible. That has become his confirmed way of life. Only a miracle would change him, and I have to give that miracle a chance to happen, although I don't expect it.

Finally I will tell him to meet at home. It's where I will be most comfortable and probably make him and OW most uncomfortable

I will try to just listen and not talk. And we'll see what he says, but most probably it's about divorce.

well then, the "monk" hasn't met enough criminals. The vast majority I ever met or locked up are sorry for one thing....they got caught.


She's no worse than your H....and IF she isn't married I suspect he is a far worse person than she.


I'm sorry to say...you don't have a marriage...you have a mirage.


I think this is way off base. People repenting is NOT contingent upon the attitude of the offended. Repenting is turning from your sin towards the light.

I get the distinct feeling here that you are a "martyr" for your marriage. IMHO, you are wasting the most precious of gifts that you have been given...and that is not the sad sack excuse for a man that you call husband...it is your life. You have created (since there is no factual basis for it) a prison and the walls are your marriage license. You are not commanded to remain single...yet you "feel" that you cannot replace your husband with another unless he dies. Trust me...he SHOULD be dead to you at this point.

There is a little boy in my daughter's third grade class. The parents divorced when he was in pre-school because the mother fell in love with someone else. The father accepted it and went on to date, marry, and father another child with a woman who already had a child. The mother told me last year that her finance wanted to live together before marrying but she didn't want that. Well, they're living together...

That little boy... my heart goes out to him. My guess is the mother would have gone back to the father, but now the father is not available because he has a new family.

I don't think you're a martyr at all. I think you have made a choice to honor your marriage commitment. There are lots of little boys like this little one who is shuttled every three days between a mother who lives with a boyfriend and a father who has a new wife, a new son, and a stepdaughter.

I see the sadness in his eyes, especially when it is unclear to the school which parent is supposed to be picking him up and he sits outside the office, waiting, because he's not sure who is supposed to be picking him up, either.

Cherishing

As you say..it is your guess. My guess is that the mother would have continued to be a cheat and a liar and the child would be better served to have a happy life with the new family...and have nothing more than a part time relationship with his mom.

The PROBLEM in your story is NOT the dad's new family..it is the fact that the kid goes to mom's shack up joint at all. The father in your story is honoring his true family...and his gift of life. The mother is the villain here and is the cause for any unhappiness that child feels.

Sounds like a GREAT PLAN!!

In coming to know you all of these years, EACH AND EVERYONE of your posts continue to resonate the MESSAGE of the WONDERFUL and INSPIRATIONAL person that you are.

Thanks for sharing about the MONK!!

Mkeverydaycnt:

The monk would go to teach meditation at the jail, so he was not there as an authority figure and he didn’t judge the prisoners so they felt comfortable with him. That’s where he got his experience. He tells the story of a prisoner who once told him that he was in jail for a robbery he had not committed, but before the monk was able to get him help for the “unjust” sentence he was serving, the prisoner told him that he had gotten away for so many other robberies that he felt it was fair for him to be in prison to pay for all the others.

If you’re in law enforcement I can understand why you would have a different opinion. It is unlikely that someone would come up to you and say: please take me to jail because I feel the need to atone for my crimes. We are mostly very much cowards.

You know John Douglas, the FBI agent who started the behavioural science unit, says that no one commits a crime if he knows he is being watch. That may be the solution to making us decent human beings: keep us all permanently in public view.


She isn’t married, in her own words, she was looking for an old man with money, and although it took her quite a bit of work, she finally found one!.
What can I wish her? That she find some other man with more money? Because there are many out there with much, much, more money, no children, or at least grown up children, who are probably more fun than my husband. I really wish her well, but not really on that path. I wish she could find somebody who would make her happy, with whom she could have children and a family of her own.

I don’t think my husband “wished” to have a “new” instant family. But he has acquired it and maybe that’s what makes him happy, but he doesn't boast about it. I also wish him the best and if that’s what he wants he should ask for a divorce and marry OW! Experts like Dr. Harley say that living together is a great risk for domestic violence and she might not get his pension when he dies, which after all was her main interest.


I don’t feel like a martyr, I feel free, or at least freer than I was. The life I lead now is what I determine, and WH has no place in it. I promised I would have one husband until death separates us, and I will keep my promise. No more husbands, but that doesn’t mean no friendships. At this age (I’m 50), why is a husband so important when friends can be much more convenient? It would be different if I were 30, but I’m not. My children are grown and now I want to enjoy the freedom of being me!


just like AT LEAST 50% of the people who are around you and me! If we excluded all those who have been unfaithful, we would have no one to talk to! And those who haven’t been unfaithful yet, well..., they are just waiting for a chance… You would have to be very careful. Have you considered this?


and even if he died I don’t know that I would want a husband. What are the chances that I could find someone who is honest, interesting, fun, decent and has never been unfaithful? And all this for only a few years because according to Dr. Harley, men begin to regress at 65 years of age. Women don’t because we have more connections between our neurons. Women flourish when their husbands die. Men don’t. Check Dr. Harley for the references to the papers on this subject of aging and gender.

Mkeverydayct, I’m sorry you are so bitter about marriage and I really hope you find forgiveness and hope like so many wonderful betrayed and wayward spouses that are on this forum, who have given us wonderful examples of repentance and forgiveness and happiness.

Mimi, the monk´s last chat (1st june) on GOSSIP is on the internet today. Have you enjoyed him? He’s good to listen to while you play Tumblebugs!

actually I am quite positive about marriage. You do not have a marriage. You have a mirage. It is not your fault...but it is the truth. Marriage I adore...continuously staying a marriage where the husband is living with another woman for 3.5 years is IMHO, dysfunctional and a waste of time. Just my opinion.

As far as the prisoners in jail...our church does an outreach to the jails...the vast majority of the people that participate talk about what con men these criminals are....no remorse. If you ever saw the movie Shawshank Redemption...there is a line in there that speaks to how there was only one guilty man in the whole place...con men...for the most part.

OT, but my mother was head nurse at a state prison for 10 years. She went in there bright eyed and bushy tailed and came out cussing worse than a sailor, bigoted, hard-hearted, and untrusting. She said she never knew it was possible for so very many people to be so very evil to the core. Most people are in prison because they are harmful to the rest of us, and need to stay there.

exactly! And if the people were remorseful for what they had done why do the vast majority commit crimes in the future as well???

As you well know, you and I share the SAME VIEWPOINT. This is the life I planned to have..if my H and I did not recover.. or will have if my husband dies before me. I would have "gentleman callers"...LOL..

Update: Wh says its better to meet in a public place!

I asked why. Now we wait for the answer.


By the way, mkeverydayct, you are right! I have no marriage, but I am married.

Either he's SCARED for his life or the OW is JEALOUS.

So if you don't want to meet in a public place, is the meeting OFF?

ccbis

I am also RC.

Thus I will point to you how is it Ted Kennedy was able to annull his M and M someone else.

Yeah, the RC's have their out too.

They can't deny Christ's own words, and they know it.

All blessings,
Jerry

The little boy in my daughter's class is passed between Dad with new wife and baby and stepdaughter and Mom with live-in boyfriend who started dating her when she was married to Dad. Live-in boyfriend is not turning out quite how she had expected. She does not have the option to return to Dad who is now married with baby and stepdaughter. Even though Mom was the villian to have an affair with boyfriend, she no longer has the option to return to Dad. And that is because of choices Dad has made.

If I were Jennifer Aniston, I'd still be waiting for Brad to dump Jolie.

Not many people would, but I think it is not an absurd choice. It is a choice based on a profound view of marriage as one in which each makes a commitment for life regardless of the actions of the other.

Cherishing

CC:

Pep raises a good point. Why meet with him?

He must think that he can TALK you into something.

You guys are right. I will insist on knowing what it's about before agreeing to any meeting other than here at home.

I greatly admire your stance on marriage. You took your vows and kept them - till death do us part.

If one believes that marriage is a covenent between husband, wife and God, then remarriage is probably not to be considered.

I have a gentleman caller, as Mimi says, but I can't imagine marrying again.

B:

That's how come I LOVE hearing about your life.

I imagine mine would be the same as yours.

There's still a itty bitty part of me that asks: "What if...?"