Relax ILMH...I know that you take full responsibility...You and Try know it...Some things get lost in the written word...Do your best to let go of the defensiveness...You are amongst friends here that are only looking to help you and Try get through this...Breathe...

Giving consideration to the POV of people posting to you will ultimately help you-I find that I can learn from just about everyone...You will learn to take what you need from here and leave the rest...

Mrs. W

Thanks Mrs W,
Sometimes it just feels like I am trying so hard to implement the MB principles and put them to use in my marriage. Maybe that line of thinking(about the EN"s) doesn't work for everyone, but it really helps me see how i can protect myself from another affair in the future. I didn't mean to sound so defensive, but I do take full responsibility.

I'm just trying to give you the view from the other side.

My wife's lies continued for a year after d-day. All contact had ended. There were no logical reasons for the lies. That year was the worst of my life.

Sometimes I don't think WS's consider the depth of hurt the lying causes. Sometimes I just wonder if they think of the physical aspect of the affair being the only hurt.

What happened that made her stop lying, iam? Sorry for the TJ.

Say

You bet! You'd be wise to listen carefully to the BSs herein...Some of their thoughts are ones that perhaps Try doesn't yet have the vocabulary to express to you...

What I do is go to Mr. W and run those thoughts past him...It opens dialogue for us, and allows us to see what fits for us...We've found that to be a very useful part of this community...Sometimes it's easier to first discuss things in the third person...

Mrs. W

For me I know the reason why I haven't been honest in the past about all this was because i didn't want my husband to hurt. It was awful to have to come out and tell my husband that I had a PA. To me this was the worst kind of betrayal and I couldn't believe that I had done it, but I knew we would never be right if I didn't tell him. There are some details that keep coming, like times and dates, but everything big is out. I never thought myself capable. I've said before this was my biggest mistake to think it would never happen to me. I didn't protect from it. It is hard to come out and say everything. I believe that some parts of it has been blocked out because of the awfulness of it. It sucks. If I could take it all back I would. If I could just go back to where it all began, if I could just have one of those stupid flashers like in Men In Black and use it on myself and my husband. IF ONLY IF ONLY IF ONLY......

Okay, but we all know that it wasn't the telling of the TRUTH that hurt Try...It was your actions that hurt him and the lies to cover up those actions...Actions and lies that had already occured...You had already hurt him even though he didn't fully know it...

And ILMH, be REALLY honest with yourself...Part of why you didn't tell him was selfish self-preservation/protection...Your fear of what would happen if he found out the truth...That is a very ugly truth, but it is a very common WS truth nonetheless...

Mrs. W

I think I finally wore her out. I was relentless. I used phone records to know exactly who she was calling and when. Compared that to stroies of where she told me she was going.

I gave her the third degree constantly. I would ask her the same question in different ways and drill in on any inconsistency with with even more questions. I was merciless. I would have outdone any cop, soldier or investigator.

And I hated it. It tore me apart. The need to know, the lies, hating myself for doing it. But God, the lies hurt so bad.

I remember being in church by ourselves, holding her hand and praying a rosary. I asked her if I had all the information. Even there she looked me in the eye and lied.

She finally couldn't take it anymore. She blurted out the last few things I hadn't pulled out of her and she found peace. This was a year ago. Sometimes I still find myself doubting but her whole demeanor has changed. No more terror when we talked about things, no more hiding.

Neither party will find peace if one is hiding something. A marriage cannot bear dishonesty.

ILMH,

Any lie becomes a wall between you. That includes lies of both commission and omission.

Anything that remains hidden now that comes out later will start the whole cycle over once again. That means that for you to withhold truth, you must continue to guard that lie in the future. By doing that, there will always be something between you that cannot be shared, something that will forever remain a secret. And it will keep you from fully sharing with him.

He will sense this, of course, that there is a part of you that he cannot know and it will cause him to doubt no matter how far you progress in other ways. Nothing he will be able to do will ever get through to you because you will forever be keeping a distance between you so that your secret can be protected.

And if anything comes out that was once hidden, it makes him wonder what else is being hidden behind the wall that stands between you, the wall built by you to protect the truth from coming to light. The wall that seems like protection becomes a prison and keeps you within and him without and never fully connecting.

10, 20, 30 years from now, that wall will still stand if you keep it in place. Destroy that wall, ILMH. Hold nothing at all back. Give no spin to anything. Make no excuses for any action you took or any decision you made. Go out of your way to be transparent with him. Offer more than he asked for rather than just enough to satisfy the question. Tell him what you know, whether by letter or in verbal form. Begin using Dr Harley's Policy of Radical Honesty in all things between you. If you know it, tell Try. Tell him everything, not just about the affair, but about every aspect of your life. Also share with him when you need a break from the action of telling all. Share your emotions both positive and negative with him. And expect the same from him...

And this weekend, go have some fun for cryin' out loud...

Mark

Thanks everyone again. SH suggested we go through a time line tonight and to run through it without the "what were you thinking?" type questions. If Try has any questions during the time line I will answer them if I know. These last few post have been really good. We had a really fun weekend without A talk and just enjoyed eachother. We really needed that. The weather was perfect and everything was nice.
Thanks all for the encouragement and help. My son is asking me to play, so I will type more later.

I'd edit out Try's first name ILMH...

Mrs. W

Sorry I've almost done that so many times!!!
Thanks!

ILMH, you asked me a question in TTH's thread, I figured it would be more appropriate to respond to you here.


My W did many things, but I think the most important thing she did was to actually change her attitude towards me. She recognized the real hurt she had inflicted, and did not try to justify, explain, or defend herself. She apologized several repeatedly, she made herself completely accountable for all time, gave me access to her phone, switched jobs to get away from OM, etc. This is all the general stuff that is recommended here to facilitate recovery.

She also took some lumps from me. There were a handful of instances where I did not react very well, where I engaged in some love busting and said some not very nice things. She did not respond in kind and escalate the situation, instead taking the high road and tried to empathize with me and what I was feeling.

As far as some of the actual concrete things she did: shortly after D-Day she booked us a long weekend away together. We started giving each other massages. We had SF, ALOT. She started playing golf with me and has continued to do so. Basically, BOTH of our focus is now about each other, we both changed and made the M our #1 priority. Pre-A, this was not the case for either of us.

I sympathize alot with TTH, his situation and his timeline are pretty similar to my own. Almost everything he is going through and feeling I felt at one point, and it was not so very long ago at all, so I hope that I can reach a hand out to both of you and help you through these times like so many did for me. If you read my recovery thread, you will see that what I was posting is very similar to what TTH is posting. It may help you get a feel for the timelines involved in this, and it may give you some ideas. I struggled greatly with the "why" question, for months. I don't struggle with it much anymore, if at all. I don't feel that I found the answer, I just don't care much about the question anymore. I got tired of thinking about it. I had to begin to let go of the pain and the hurt of the past in order to begin to truly enjoy the present.

Time and consistency is what he needs from you in order to begin to trust that what he is seeing in you NOW is real. Its very hard to juxtapose the WW with a truly repentent FWW. We see what we've wanted to see for so long in the FWW. We see what we've worked for for so long, and through so much pain and turmoil, but it is very very hard to trust it. Because we have been decieved. Our life has been a lie for a very long time. We've lived in a world where we can't trust our W, and we've lost some faith in ourselves as well. We see our FWW, and we know that that is what we WANT, but we also know that a very short time ago that person was lying thier [censored] off to us. That creates a reality conflict, because we did NOT trust ourselves as the A was going on, much to our detriment, so we are afraid to trust that the FWW is REAL, because we have seen the danger in believing what we WANT to believe. It takes some time to start to piece reality back together. Part of that process is trying to figure out how this could happen. He needs to be able to get through his pain and anger without driving you away. You have to be able to witness it, to take some of it. The worst thing for me is that I was afraid of my emotions. And I was afraid to express them to my W. I was afraid that they would drive her away. This would cause me to bottle them up until they erupted, sometimes in a less than ideal way. If/when this happens, you need to be ready to deal with it.

Thanks that really helps. I am really busy right now and will have more to say later.

I really love my husband and hope he will see me someday as the person he married. All I want is for him to take my face, look me in the eyes, and say to me that he still sees me as the same person he married. I believe that what I had become during the affair wasn't me. I don't feel that it was really who I am. I am a good mother and a good wife who fell and is trying to find my way back into my love's heart. I know it won't be easy and I am up for the challenge, but I really hope that someday we can get back to a great marriage. It makes me so sad that I broke Try's heart.

That's a lovely post ILMH. I hope your H can see your remorse.

I'm lookin'...

Thanks for checking in, IAM.

Hey love dumplings aren't you 41? If you are going to lie about your age go a little younger than that you could probably get away with 34 or something....

How's this?...

I can't wait to see you tonight....