Did you call the police????

You need this abuse on file.

Has he ever hit/pushed/shoved/grabbed you before this?

But by saying, "I just don't love you anymore and am in another relationship" IS justifying his actions.

His excuse for his affair is that he just doesn't love you anymore. That's no excuse for an affair; there is no excuse for an affair. If he really feels that way, he could have sought a divorce, not an affair.

KLB, I didn't realize I had logged in with my old username, sexymamabear.

I just want to be sure you know that I am SunflowerSmile.

I have stopped using my old name, and didn't realize I logged in that way.

This statement alone shows just how wayward his mindset is.

You should not be responding to this fog babble.

He is justifying his affair right here, because he has a "laundry list of all the things you've done wrong."

Give me a break!

There isn't one thing on his list that can justify scr@wing someone else and abandoning his wife and children.

Don't feed the monster by even considering responding to this horse manure.

AMEN sexymamabear!!!!!


kl, listen to her - she has been there, done that.




I would email your husband and ask him to forward his laundry list of my faults. I actually asked my husband for his list of my faults. He wasn't really very forthcoming with it. He gave a verbal list of a few things, and they stung. Still do. But when I gave him my list back

He was indignant that I would even CONSIDER THAT HE MIGHT POSSIBLE HAVE A FAULT AT ALL.

You cannot reason with a wayward.

You see, they are perfect people, living in a perfect romance, with a perfect soulmate, in a perfect future to come, within a perfect fantasty....

IF ONLY THAT DARNED OLD REALITY WOULD STOP SLAPPING THEM UPSIDE THE HEAD!

You are the REALITY - so they don't like it much, when you show up. The kids, the job, the money trouble, the in-laws, the house, the bills, the old friends, the old hangouts, the old TV shows, the places you used to go or things you used to do....

That's what they think they will escape in this fantasy affair of theirs. See, they are all into this "new" and "fuzzy" world, where they are seen as perfect by their affair partner, where they can do no wrong.

Their "old" life, their families, their old friends - why, that's the healthy dose of reality they just cannot seem to shake off, no matter how hard they try. That's why he says things like "everybody thinks I'm a jerk". He KNOWS that the reality is that - everybody thinks he's a jerk. So he's sticking over there in affairland until it just runs out of gas, because until it does, it is the only place where someone doesn't think he's a jerk.


If you think about it - the affair partner is the ONLY person who really shares this world entirely. That is the one person who was in it from the start, who is equally as deep in the LIE. The partner in crime is the one they hang on to, and until one of them "breaks" or reaches the point where they realize that their only salvation is to return to the land of REALITY, the two will hold onto each other. After all, they have a kind of sick investment in making the other one believe the fantasy, don't they? As long as the other one stays in with them, they can keep going. If you break one, you break the other.

That is why exposing BOTH sides of the affair is important.


Go on your trip. Read the BE STILL thread, which THANKFULLY!!!! SOMEONE BUMPED UP!!!!!

And listen to SMB.



BTW, my husband once said these words to me:

"I don't love you. I have never loved you. I never will love you."

He said those words and walked out the door. 3 months later, he was moving his stuff back in. That was about 29 years or so ago.........


SB

ahhh Concord. One of my "offices" is in Concord and I generally go there about once a week, over near the hospital.




There are lots of books, but it might be more helpful to know what you might be trying to "fix" about yourself before recommending a lot of books.

If you just want a "general list" of books, etc., that I found helpful in my own recovery efforts I can give you a list that I posted on one of my threads about 5 years ago. Perhaps there might be something in that list that strikes your fancy and that you might find helpful in the "fixing" department.


The Bible
“Surviving An Affair”, by Dr. Willard F. Harley, Jr. and Dr. Jennifer Harley Chalmers
“Fall In Love, Stay In Love”, by Willard F. Harley, Jr.
“Torn Asunder”, by Dave Carder
“The Divorce Remedy”, by Michele Weiner Davis
“Magnificent Marriage”, by Gordon MacDonald
“Rebuilding Your Broken World”, by Gordon MacDonald
“After the Affair”, by Janis Abrahms Spring, Ph.D.
“Forgive & Forget, Healing The Hurts We Don’t Deserve”, by Lewis B. Smedes
“The God Who Hears”, by W. Bingham Hunter
“Intended for Pleasure”, by Ed Wheat, M.D. and Gaye Wheat
“Idols Of The Heart, Learning to Long for God Alone”, by Elyse Fitzpatrick
“Marriage, Whose Dream?”, by Paul David Tripp
“Thankfulness Even When It Hurts”, by Susan Lutz
“God’s Love, Better than Unconditional”, by David Powlison
“ ‘Just One More’ When Desires Don’t Take No for an Answer”, by Edward T. Welch
“What Do You Do When Your Marriage Goes Sour?”, by Jay E. Adams
“What Do You Do When You Know That You’re Hooked?”, by Jay E. Adams
“What Do You Do When Anger Gets The Upper Hand?”, by Jay E. Adams.


God bless.

Glad to hear your update and that you are finally getting a well deserved rest. Relax and get strong.

Have you prepared your Plan B letter? Did you notify the police of his abuse?

Still praying for you and your family.

The police weren't notified, but I ended up needing x-rays and contacted the local District Justice, but since I was headed out of town on vacation there wasn't enough time to get a PFA, and no one really thought that it was necessary since he only really left a few bruises and didn't hit me in the face!

I am resting and I am dreading going home. It feels so nice to have some distance and be here with my sister and her children and my kids are doing SO Great. They are both asking why we need to go home and if we can just go and move here. I like that they are happy and healing, but unfortunately now just isn't our time.

I am still praying for God to have his way with my H, but I really don't think at this point I have anything left in me. I am afraid of him on top of the hurt and betrayal and lies and on and on, so I think I want to just move on. If God ever does change him, well then, but now, I just don't know if I have it in me to hold onto nothing. I have done a lot of praying and searching and thinking and a lot has come out about my marriage, that has made me really think that it isn't really what I thought, but it rarely ever is for the one that is faithful.

The biggest controversy here has been that my BinL wants to email my in laws with the pictures of my body and confront them with helping and sticking by him like they have been. I feel like that could be good, but at the same time seeing how they feel about me and that they are the ones helping him to fight me, I really don't think it will do anything but get the response of "she deserved it!" Any thoughts?

SS I am still pondering and sorting throught your posts. I really thought that I was ready. I had my intermediaries I had had them on the site and was trying to educate them and I had my letter and posted it and got no feedback on the revisions, so I thought that after Memorial Day's fiasco, that we were finished and moving to Plan B. I was fine with no contact, until the lawyer who doesn't care to know about or hear about MB said I must be the one to contact H and ask permission to go away with the children. I am trying very hard to do the right thing and the best thing, I am trying to learn and grow, but I don't know what that is often. I know that your posts contain a lot of good information, but I am not trying to vascillate between the two plans, I had NO contact with him for 1 month and was perfectly fine with continuing that way, I really didn't want it. I can't stand the sight or even thought of that evil disgusting monster that has taken over my husband.
My plan B letter revisions are following.....

My Dearest WH,

It is with a very heavy heart that I am writing you this letter. I want to apologize to you for my part in creating an environment that helped make your affair with Her possible. I was so consumed with the needs of our children, the demands of our home, and being pregnant and very sick, that I neglected my responsibility to meet your most important emotional needs. I was not there for you when you needed me the most to listen and encourage you in the stress and frustration and long hours that you were enduring to provide a good life for the children and I. We are now suffering from your choices.

WH, I am willing to do whatever it takes to correct the mistakes that I have made in the past, and believe the past teaches and guides us, but does not define who we are in the future. I want to make our marriage together stronger and closer than we ever thought possible. With all of my heart, I would like to build a new marriage with you. A marriage, in which we both feel loved, safe, cherished and free to pursue our goals and dreams. I want us to be able to meet each other's emotional needs and avoid doing anything to hurt each other. We need to build a new lifestyle in which everything we do makes us both happy. Then, there will never again be a reason for us to separate.
I want to be your best friend again, someone who is always there for you when you need me. I want you as my best friend like you had been for so many years. I want to be there to encourage and watch you achieve your dreams and goals, and have you experience joy in seeing our children and I achieve our goals and dreams too. There are so many beautiful and good things about our marriage and family.

Until you establish no contact with her, I will avoid seeing you or talking to you. Our friends, ?????, have agreed to be an intermediary for us, if you want to communicate about the children or any other matter, it will have to be through ??????. As soon as you are willing to permanently end your affair, severe all contact, and are willing to establish a plan for recover, then and only then we can discuss our future together.


Please respect my decision to separate from you in this way. You must know about the enormous suffering the children and I have endured because of your adultery. It is too painful to be around you while you are still continuing the affair. It is causing my remaining love for you to erode and I must protect that. This separation is a necessity to preserve my love for you and, and to give our marriage the best chance for recovery! It is in no means meant as a punishment.


I loved you when we married, and I continue to love you right up to this day.

With All My Love and Commitment, your wife,
KLB

I still have no intermediaries, after the latest incident NO ONE wants anything to do with him! Everyone thinks that it is time to totally move on. I am struggling with this too. This letter sounds so like the me before he hit me and now, now I just don't know! Please help me!

KB - JMHO

This is no longer JUST about his affair. He has a violence issue. Your plan b letter does nothing to address this. W Harley and I discussed domestic violence issues once - he and I disagreed strongly on which was more devastating to a marriage and it's the ONLY thing I have ever disagreed with him on.

I don't know that the Plan B letter is appropriate right now. But I think a deep dark silence IS appropriate, along with a RO when and if you choose to move back home. I think you might want to consider growing where you are planted - right where you are. If he comes to you, asking you to come home, the violence must be addressed with some anger management and appropriate remorse behaviors before you consider moving home.

KaylaAndy,
I agree with you totally about the letter not being appropriate anymore, but don't know how to deal with that. I have tried to find examples, but am coming up empty. I really don't know what to do or what to say. I personally want to say nothing!

I will be seeing and dealing with H on July 18th for the support hearing and he told me to get custody papers ready. Of course let the one with no income and no job be the one to have to pay for it! I am just so empty and sad!

Any help on how to edit the letter would be appreciated...

KLB

You have every right to say NOTHING to him. Has he ever been violent before this incident?

I would keep thinking about Plan B, and refining the letter, and getting your ducks in a row. When you start getting child and spousal support, it will be easier for you to make plans. And you don't have that much longer until court.

By the way, I would file a restraining order against him before the court date.

Believer,
No he has never before been violent, he has always had a temper, but always left to walk or go vent and then come back calm to talk, I have been wondering about drug usage since he left home. He has been wearing sunglasses an awful lot and doesn't even like to take them off indoors. His behaviors have been eratic too, one minute kind and sorrowful and sad, the next angry and full of hatred. I don't really understand wayward behaviors much so is this typical???

As for the restraining order they said that there was no grounds for a restraining order or from a protection from abuse? I wish I understood more, but I am trying to learn and get more information. I will be returning late Sunday night from NC to PA and will be home from Sun to Thurs and then we are going to my parents boat again for the 4th. I am grateful for the time away from the home the kids and I have had a wonderful time and sleep is WONDERFUL! I have been getting anxiety attacks again thinking about going home, but at the same time they are less severe than they were before.

WH had a conscience attack, he finally put last weeks support in and it cleared on Thurs! Everyone(family and friends) thinks he is scared because he definitely crossed a line, I don't know I think that he is just doing and doesn't care at all. Again don't know what he could possibly be thinking anymore.

Any thoughts on the B-in-L situation with e-mailing the pics and a letter to my in laws, he asked again last night. I am still torn, but would like to hear any advice for or against doing this.

As for the plan b letter, I am not having any luck finding an intermediary, I have asked several people and none of them think that there needs to be any further intervention or anything between us and I have tried to explain what their purpose and role would be, but honestly all fam and friends are so angry with H that they don't want to have anything to do with this at all. They can't understand why I would even harbor any sentiment or thoughts toward a possible reconcilliation EVER. They said they want all ties to be severed and for me to move on toward plan d. That is all well and good, but Plan D requires money, money that I don't have!

Any thoughts on how to revise and address the abuse in my plan b letter?

KLB

KB, this is your life, not theirs. The decision of whether to stay in your marriage is yours alone.

As far as the violence goes, if it's an isolated incident, then I would chalk it up to his wayward stupidity. It does not excuse it and you still need to be wary and protect yourself and the children. If you have a custody hearing coming up, I would definitely document the abuse. Your kids don't need to be around their dad if there's any chance he'd go off on them.

I don't know what to tell you about the Plan B letter since you can't find an intermediary. It kind of defeats the purpose of no contact if there is no intermediary. Since your BIL is so gung-ho on exposing what your WH did to the inlaws, would HE consider being your intermediary? You could tell him that you're not necessarily trying to recover your marriage (that's the truth at this point right?) but BY LAW you must maintain contact as far as the children. His acting as intermediary would help protect you and the kids.

((((KB))))

Hi PM,
My B-in-L would be fine except for the fact that they are long distance. They are in N. Carolina and I am in PA, they really weren't too keen on all the long distance calls and such.

I have been praying about it, and will keep you all posted. Our first and only scheduled hearing is July 18th for support. Neither one of us have taken any action for custody hearing or divorce. The reason I haven't is that the lawyer wants a $1000 retainer and then $265/hour there after. I just don't have that kind of money right now. I have my money I got together for plan b, but that has dwindled a little.

I agree about this being my life, I am having a hard time dealing with my emotions since the "fight" with him. I want to believe and fight for my marriage, but I am having a very difficult time believing that it could really ever happen looking at where we are and what has been going on with my interactions with my H. He seems more determined than ever that even if he isn't with her that he hates me and that he will never consider the possibility of ever coming back home with the children and I. I see that as pretty firm that it is me that is/was the problem.

KLB

klb - These thoughts are quite normal. In fact, I'd be rather worried about you if you didn't have these thoughts. The "point" is that in his current state of mind, you wouldn't want this "him" as your husband, and you know it. But you also know the man that you married and you love THAT man, so there is a war in your mind over "what's best?"





klb, YOU are NOT the problem. You were not the problem and you still are not the problem. The problem is SIN and the entrapment in sin of your husband. "Five will get you Ten" that Satan is "playing with his mind" too. He is thinking he has been so bad that he "can't" be forgiven and "can't" return to the marriage. So he is reacting in anger over the "situation" of his own making.

But the most important thing to remember is "with man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible."

It BEGINS with his relationship with God, not with you or the children. He is acting, in many ways, like the "prodigal son" and has yet to reach the point where he KNOWS he needs forgiveness. He, like the prodigal son, may even reach that point but think he is "unworthy" of forgiveness and restoration. He is "too close to the trees (or the pig pen)" to see that ALL of us are unworthy of God's love and forgiveness. But NONE of us "worthy" on our own. We have ALL sinned, and yet through Jesus God grants us forgiveness because of what Jesus has already paid for us.

What does God want? He wants a broken and contrite heart. God is "interested" in your marriage for sure, but He is MOST interested in your husband's spirit. Your husband has professed a belief in Jesus, and if that was a sincere acceptance of Jesus, he cannot "escape" God. But God will let him go through some "tough times" of his own making if he wants to continue running from God. Jonah found that out the "hard way" too.

YOU are the "faithful brother" in the prodigal son story. YOU are being a parent and a wife, doing what you do because you LOVE, and also because it is the "Role" that God has assigned to you. You love God, you love your children, you love your husband even though he is acting like a heathen. It IS "unfair" that you are being hurt because of sin. But the "unfairness" is not the issue, obedience to God despite the trials and temptations IS the issue. Standing ready with forgiveness, in the same manner in which God has forgiven you of your own sins, is what you do. He MAY leave, but God will NEVER leave you. YOU, like your husband, CAN "kick God out" and live as if God doesn't exist, but you KNOW better. Even if your husband were to divorce you, you KNOW that God will always be with you and that Romans 8:28-29 is REAL, because God is faithful to His promises to His own.

Keep praying for your husband. Keep praying for God to make your husband miserable with his choices and with the OW. Keep praying for Godly people to STAND FOR God and humble submission and obedience to God, even if they must "confront" your husband with the truth.

Practice endurance, especially on the days when you just want to "give up," because you WILL have those days.

While I am not "excusing" his hitting you, from what you've said he's never done that sort of thing before. So it's a "good bet" that what was behind it was his own struggle with KNOWING what he is doing is very wrong and the anger that is resulting from his struggle within his mind. It's another reason why you need to "keep your distance from him" and let God "handle him." The "Plan B" you are in is SUPPOSED to make his choices FULLY real to him, to let him get ALL of his supposed "needs" met ONLY by the shrew who also has NO respect for marriage.

Hang in there, klb. In the midst of a hurricane it can be "hard to believe" that it WILL end and that CALM will return, a new course can be charted that will arrive at the destination you wanted even if you were blown off course and have to start from a new "starting point."

God bless.

Am I really in Plan B? SS seems to think that I am doing both A/B and that I wasn't ready. I thought that I was ready, but then the intermediaries quit, I had no contact for a full month and didn't want any contact, and still don't, but is that really plan b without the "letter" I have been confused by this. I posted my letter and only got one response to it saying that it doesn't really address the situation as it is now, but I am not sure how to really change it.

I agree with all that you have said, I am praying for God to have his way with my husband and for H to be broken and miserable and hit the bottom with no where to turn but to God. I do believe that his salvation was real, and that right now he is a double-spirited man, so I am trying to keep on keeping on. The anxiety and nervousness has been creeping back, we are heading home tomorrow, the children have been anxious and don't want to go, they have been so wonderful here and talking and relaxing and I hate to take them back to a place that they associate with all the sadness, but it is our home for right now better or worse it is our home and I am trying to get excited and foster that with them about the things we are going to do when we get home, but they just don't care, they want to be where they are safe and have peace. I get that, I want that too,and I have explained to them that it will come we must make it that way at home too. I still miss my H, but the pain and loss feelings are lessening, it is hard going there and seeing him with someone else and being lonely. I know that I am in the better circumstances and that I have God and my children, but I sometimes find myself longing for that physical companion and friend. I pray that he will find his way out of the mess and darkness that he has wrapped himself in.

We are heading to the Northlake? Mall today to get pictures done of the 5 kiddos. Have a good day.......

KLB

I'm so glad that he sent the support. Maybe his conscience is starting to kick in.

You only have a couple more weeks to get through until the court hearing, and that may wake hubby up. When he figures out he will be supporting his kids and wife and not having money to blow on his affair, he may defog a little.

Happy you are getting some much needed peace.

{{{{{{{{{KLB}}}}}}}}

I back that up. I'm so glad you are getting some peace and some support.

I know what a feeling that is.

G-d is right there with you, keep talking to him, he wants to know what you are thinking so he can help you next.

I sure am.