Maybe discuss establishing some boundaries for H in wanting to help a friend.

Like he'll be their for the friend, but not to help him destroy his marriage or continue the affair.

I recently had a friend express his desire to receive pleasure from someone other than his wife, down here it's referred to as wanting some "strange". He had nobody in mind, he's just one of those guys that has trouble dealing with the fact that he's gonna be with the same person for the rest of his life, in this case the mother of his child, which he adores, but still wants some "strange every now and then"

Well, if you know me at all you can imagine what I told him.

Can't exactly detail in this forum, but when I was done, with the help of a fellow BS, he apologized and went home to his wife.

He was looking for the boys to back him up, he got slaughtered.

He's never spoke of it again, yet he's still a close friend and it didn't affect our relationship in the least.

Your H CAN be their without enabling and MEN are a little different. We can say what's up to our boys without losing the friendship.

Hubby needs to MAN up

You could always direct her only to Dr Harley's stuff.

There is a valid concern about who one may encounter in the discussion boards.

Reading the Dr's material is a good resource. How would your husband feel about simply directing both of them to the Dr's materials and avoiding the boards?

If you aren't sure she knows, telling her is the right thing. IMO, you cannot POJA whether to do the right thing, only how to accomplish it.

For example, you could POJA whether to write her a note or tell her in person, and if your H was concerned that helping her could trigger you, thus affecting your M, you could POJA whether to keep in close contact with her, or just direct her to MB and leave it up to her.

Oh I'm sure she knows because she calls J's dad who lives in another country to come down here and straighten J out. J is so not looking forward to THAT conversation.

I will talk to H about referring them to the Harley material though, especially her. I was thinking I would just send her an email since I don't know her that well, expressing my sadness (she knows that I've been through it too) and giving her a link to MB.

{{{{{ pm }}}}}

I'm so sorry your H doesn't recognize what he's doing. I agree, that he is not being a good influence to his friend J (when he has such a great opportunity to do so!). He's enabling the affair, and it seems J is not a friend to your M either.

I would be very tempted to contact J's W. To at least direct her to MB. Or give her a copy of SAA.


*hug* You are doing the right thing... wanting to contact her, but not wanting to do anything your H disapproves of. But you disapprove of him offering non-judgmental friendship, tacit approval, to J. Your H should respect your wishes too...

I'm sorry I don't have answers, because tit-for-tat isn't a solution.

I didn't realize your H was so negative toward MB. Has he agreed to POJA? If not... how would you feel about stating a boundary about his support of his friend? Saying something like, you realize you can't dictate how he supports his friend, but it makes you uncomfortable that the wayward spouse is receiving support and not the betrayed... and you want to offer her support...

Well that comes out sounding like tit-for-tat. I'm sure you can find some way to express what you feel, and what you feel you must do.

... and there are real Christians out there. Just no perfect ones. As someone else said, the fault isn't in God but rather in some of the people pretending to be Christians.

I know Jayne, there are real Christians out there (hopefully I'm one!). I was just really frustrated and disappointed, what I get for taking my off the ONE who matters most and looking around me. I was raised a pastor's daughter and believe me when I tell you that I've seen some STUFF in the name of Christianity. But I KNOW in my KNOWER that God is real and that God is good.

I'm thinking seriously about how to approach my husband again and you guys have given me some serious food for thought.

Thanks for your support!

P.S. I always wondered when people say, "I was just...." if it's the beginning of a justification. I catch myself doing that all the time.

Oh! I'm so so so so glad you posted this! I'm very sorry for the circumstance, though, Princess.

I myself have been struggling with some triggers of a weird sort. We are truly moving on with our lives (new house, new jobs, possibly more children), and I find myself afraid.

We are no longer in the cacoon of recovery but out in the big bad mean world. And I can't help but feel a little fearful of "will it happen again?"

I've struggled with watching fellow Christians fall, but I feel that God is showing me more and more to look at Him only. Thanks for sharing this, Princess.

Oh, hugs, Princess.

As I read how J "Said they started disconnecting three years ago, sleeping in separate rooms, going their own way. " I began to think,

maybe Mr. PrincessMeggy should say to his friend, "Why didn't you let the wife know you were disconnecting and offer to get some help to change things between you. How did you just let the M go if you could see it disconnecting.?"

But heck, it sure hurts when our FWS seem to lose the (F) to the fog for a moment. Hope you're feeling better now, pm!

PM - I think your husbands attitude is the last bastion of waywardness in your husband. I think this rationalisation and justification for the acts of others IS truely the last thing that changes for a FWS in recovery.

Lead him into the light.

H and I actually had a really good discussion about all of this. He said, oh no honey, I never condoned what J was doing, in fact, I told him that he knows he's wrong and that he probably doesn't understand the magnitude of pain that he is causing his wife or how her heart is broken to pieces. He told J that his wife is hurting so bad that she probably hates him and loves him at the same time and that she will be up and down. He told him that unless he got this right that he's in for a lot of pain himself.

As far as hanging around J, H said the only reason he talked to J in the first place is because he had done a job for J and was there (at J's office) to pick up a paycheck from him. He said he understood about not being there to "support" J and that he doesn't plan to see him. He said himself that part of the consequences of J's actions should be the loss of friends, family and other things. There was NO WAY he would enable J to carry on. He said, PM, you know that if anyone knows about BS pain, I do. I wouldn't wish that on anyone.

H was also asking me more about MB. He asked me if any husbands ever came back "on there". I was happy and pleased to tell him, oh yes, I've seen several couples recover their marriages as a result of MB, but then again I've also seen many recover personally when WS didn't return home. It was a very good place for a hurting BS to heal either way. He still doesn't want me to get involved but I think he is leaning towards at least letting me send her the info on MB. He asked if I thought it would help to send J here. I told him I wasn't sure if we were going to send BS here too. Should H send J here too?

He did say I wish I had thought of telling him that not only has he broken his wife's heart but that he's broken Jesus' heart too. After all, J has been given a special gift in music to minister to others and he's throwing that away.

I'm so glad he seems to understand and agree about not condoning or supporting J's actions! This sounds much much more positive IMHO.

I'm really glad he expressed more interest in MB. I think it would be wonderful if he came here. But as far as sending J here, if J is still intent on leaving his W and continuing in the affair, maybe the best thing would be to print out some articles to give him? I'm just not sure what he'd come and post about, or what good it would do unless he wanted to work on R...

But there are some articles that could help him realize the pain he's causing... give him hope that love can be restored in the M if he's willing to do the work... and also show him that if he doesn't do the work, his next relationship will just have the same problems eventually anyway.

I think it would be really really really good if J's BW came here. In which case, we would tell her to not invite her WH here right away, anyway.

((((Princess))))

I am so happy for you.....

Obviously, your F-WS was doing alright and there may have been a miscommunication about all of this.

The way I see it, your H wanted to be there for his friend. Now, that didn't mean he agreed with what he was doing. He was letting him know that what he was doing was wrong, but in a loving friend way. Good for him. Sometimes, its the quiet rebukes that unsettle us the most....

And he agrees with you. Great!!!!!!!!!!!!! Not a friend to be around.....

And now he is possibly seeing your point about MB.....

Hmmm...maybe you could get her a copy of SAA, put a note in there telling her about MB online and do all of this anominiously (sp... I know...).

WOO HOO.....I am so incrediably glad this worked out for you two.......


not2fun