WW basically told her mom to get the he** out because she tried and reason with her about the kids, the cell phones, son's game, and the party. She turned tail and ran...but did agree that WW needs help. I'm afraid there is no one left to help her!

M and WW's mom BOTH say they spoke with OM and that he IS out of the picture! That was yesterday...today, who knows?

I think M is becoming too close to WW's side, she was going to spend the night with her last night! She doesn't seem unbiased anymore...although she did agree WW is irrational and unstable!

Your WW's mother's H?


Do you mean that as soon as the kids got there she asked for their phones? Nothing had happened prior to this?

If there were THREE other adults present, why were you afraid they might need to call for help?

I thought the reason you allowed them to go see her this weekend was b/c her parents were going to be there, and would be safe.

If you thought they might be in real danger why would you let them go?

Wow, sounds like things are escalating in her craziness. Where did she go? Does anyone know? Have you or anyone else heard anything else from her? It's good that you were able to go get the kids. In her frame of mind, I would be scared to death if she took off with them on her own.

I'm confused. Who is "M"? I thought it was WW's mom.

I wasn't about adult supervision. She attempted to collect their phones at the door saying, "If you can't talk to me while your with your dad, you're NOT talking to him while your here either!"

And M is a mutual, female friend. Unfortunately, M doesn't have alot of other friends, so I fear she is starting to cling to WW a bit too much. M did call me earlier to say that WW wanted me to tell her kids she was sorry about last night.

I instructed M to suggest counseling, both spiritual and psychological...she said she would, but I think she is enjoying plaing "mommie" to WW right now. She's been with her all day she said.

TIME TO FIND ANOTHER M, I'M AFRAID!

His Mediator.

My take on the needing the cell phones, wasn't that they'd be in physical danger but that WW wasn't going to stick to the agreement to let DS go to the game and let them come to the party.

I can imagine that to a kid, being told they can't keep a commitment to their team to come to a game, would be pretty important. In fact I myself think it was unreasonable for WW to change the plans like that, on things that the kids had been promised and especially that involved their own commitments to teammates.

(Sorry if that sounds snappy - I don't mean to be snappy toward you, just snappy toward WW.)

Wow! Ok, so this was right out of the box?!

I thought she was getting them for the weekend.

You said the reason you didn't tell them to obey her was b/c "NOW, I fear they may need them when they are with her to call for help!"

If you truly fear that they might need those phones to call for help, even though there were other adults there, then there is no way she ought to have any kind of visitation w/ them.

I think it was a mistake for her to ask for those phones to begin w/. I'm not sure what her motivation was for doing that. But, I'll bet she'll never do it again.

She's beginning to learn that she can't "make" her kids obey her every request/demand anymore.

Anyway, it's good that she apologized to the kids for what happened. It shows that she IS capable of accepting some responsibility for her actions.

ab,

I gotta tell you that it still bothers me that when you see your son refuse to say goodbye to his mom, or reply to her text messages, you look the other way.

It bothers me that when she wanted to apologize to the kids she couldn't reach them herself to do it, but had to go through M and you to do it.

I believe you could greatly ease the tension between her and the kids when they visit her by simply encouraging them to reply to her texts/phone calls.

Since she knows she did wrong on their last visit, and apologized for it, I think it would be easy for them to reach out to her in a small way now.

You say that you don't want to MAKE them talk to her when they don't want to. And yet you MAKE them visit her when they don't want to. You say they shouldn't have to talk to her if they don't want to, but refuse to ease their burden by taking their phones away b/c it might not play well for you in court. You say you are fearful they might need to call for help, and yet you send them where you think they might need to call for help. You say you think she ought to be committed, and yet if she met your PBL tomorrow, you'd let her come home.

This all bothers me.

Abandoned, how ya doing? Did you let her come back? I sort of feel that you did....just a feeling.....

Ditto.

It appears that the kids are being used as little pawns in some vicious game between two parents.

There is no consistency and no care being given to these kids that results in anything but DYSFUNCTION.

Someone needs to get their head out of their *** and make these children a priority.

Screw the drama with this woman.

If your marriage is more important than doing what is best for these kids, God help them.

If I remember correctly you are attempting to adopt another one. Do her a favor and DON'T.

That child deserves a functioning household and you are BOUND by the adoption agreement to do that. As long as you are playing along with these antics you cannot do that.

If you want all that minutiae, have at it. Leave the kids out of it.

jmho
committed

Guys, it's easy to criticise, but these aren't mindless kids we're talking about.

They're hurt and they have a right to show they're hurt.

All AW3 can do is tell the kids that no matter what happens he loves them, that their mom will always be their mom no matter what, and that everything will be ok.

He needs to help them feel safe, but the kids have a right to be angry at their mom and I was very mad for a long time with my dad after the divorce of my parents. It took years to get better.

Perhaps he could say something like, "Son, I know you're mad at your mom. It's ok to be mad. But you should answer her if she says goodbye to you."

Then his job is done.

But the kids have a right to be mad.

Of course they have a right to their feelings.

Even their angry ones.


I could feel good about that.

How did the weekend go, ABW3?

Praying for you, your wife and children.

Okay...breathe deeply, IGNORE those who don't know what the heck they're talking about...and respond.

First...NO, WW is NOT back home! In fact, I haven't spoken with her since Friday night's debacle.

I did speak with WW's mom last night (she called me)who said she also has not spoken to her (she hasn't tried to after being "kicked out" Friday). She expressed that she would be more than willing to tell anyone necessary that the kids DID NOT need to be subjected to WW's emotions anymore at this point! She does wish that WW would see a physician about a possible chemical imbalance (you think?).

To those who feel I am using my kids as a pawn...you couldn't be more wrong! Remember, I am the one still here, supporting and protecting (as best I can) my children! YES, I sent my kids there this past weekend (they were there 1 hour!), but I also knew that there would be other responsible adults present. My children CHOOSE to refuse to give up their phones because they wanted to be able to speak to me if they wanted. I NEVER anticipated any problems this time!

From speaking to MIL last night, it seems that WW blew up after the 3 adults also present Friday stood up to her in defense of the kids. She (narcissist) is not used to being disagreed with! It became fight or flight...and she flew (the coupe!).

Do you think the kids are going to respond to her now? After what they witnessed? No, they weren't anyway, but they surely won't now.

In fact, initially WW told ONLY the 12 year old to pack his things and let her Step-FIL take him home. He (son) told her that, "If I'm leaving, my sisters are too. I'm not leaving here without them!" It was at that point that she lost it!

EVERYONE involved with this situiation (except WW) sees that I have done no wrong. They see that my kids are better off with me and without her at all right now! They see that WW needs help and that she is irrational and "not herself" right now. Yes, I am the only one that knows that she has displayed many of these traits before, but never to this extreme or without any consideration to their consequences.

MIL and M BOTH state that OM has been dismissed by WW. They both spoke with OM and confirmed that there should be NC. The withdrawals from the A, along with the rejection of her kids, have pushed WW deeper into her spiraling abyss!

Now, she is simply running from God and what she knows is right and the ONLY answer! During one call Friday night, while she was "running," WW told me, "F--- you and Your God!" She then allowed some hard rock song to play to its entirity, screamed a blood-curdling scream, and hung up. I fully expected to find her dead in her car somewhere along the side of the road.

This IS NOT a woman I want back in mine or my kids lives in her current state. Terms of ANY R have escalated to include psychiatric counseling (medication?) and spiritual counseling.

Neither God nor I have given up on her yet! In her current state, she is of no use to anyone, but there may still be hope if she admits her own problems and turns back to what is right.

I don't mind comments negatively directed towards me, but those without COMPLETE, intimate knowledge of this situation should refrain from judging me. I am at peace with almost everything I've done in the past 7 weeks, and so is 99.9% of those living here and aware of what's going on. You cannot base you opinions solely on what you interpret through your reading here of mine and others' posts.

This is a screwed-up, unique situation (adoption?)...there is no TEXT BOOK way to handle all of this. I am doing the best I can, and I AM protecting my kids as much as possible!!!

She is DEEP in her denial, of God and everything else that is good and pure. Thank GOD that she is showing her colors in front of everyone now, so others can see what you've been dealing with. She has truly gone off the deep end. I hurt for her, she is so lost.

AB, I think you are right in what you're doing. I don't see you playing the kids against their mother. I see you protecting them. She is poisoned in her soul right now. They don't need to see this. I don't think she even has it in her to fight for her children.

I do think it's time though that you get some kind of order of protection and I don't think anyone (including adoptions, DSS) would hold that against you. I think it would been viewed as you doing what any good parent would do, protecting their children from the instable, irrational person their mother has become. You could use that later if you needed to defend your actions if she DID try anything legally. (I highly doubt she's capable of that now though.)

Prayers of protection for you and the kiddos. Prayers of deliverance for your wife.

You do need some sort of legal separation and a protective order establishing supervised visitation for the kids, if there is to be any.

I'm in your corner, AW3. I know it's a tough balancing act you're playing.

Your WW's behavior appears to go beyond the standard WW behavior and she really does need medical help. It would be good for her to get it and protect your children.

Please seriously think about this.

That's what I've been trying to say!

WHEW!

Your poor, brave son! What a good little man he is to be protecting his sisters in such a way.

What a shame he HAS to.

Please go get LEGAL help to protect the children from her escallating crazy. As I said before, it WILL continue to escallate unless she's called to the carpet on it.

Dr. Stanley's sermon Saturday was very helpful to me and my fwh. Perhaps you could peek at it and utilize some of it's points in helping the children to pray for their mom, while not subjecting them to her insanity. I'm not certain if we are allowed to post links, but I'm sure you know where to look for it.

(made my fwh cry, it did...shh! don't tell)

All my best,
Kimmy

Obviously, at least right now...she IS NOT going to listen to me in regards to anything. ESPECIALLY not my suggesting she needs medical (or, psychological) help!

She wouldn't listen to her own mother either...so, I'm not sure who else is left. I'm afraid she is going to have to realize this for herself now. Who knows how long that will take!!!