There's recent events cat that have not been talked about and might leave the door open for assumptions.

I'll leave it at this:

I love her and I want to be with her no matter what.

Ezb...what you made above is a self-negating desire.

Means you don't exist, have no boundaries and it isn't healthy or real.

We have those in our yearnings, like when we were children...has some magical, deep wishfulness thoughts...they aren't real or in reality.

You are not with her right now and you're okay. You may not like your feelings when you think about being without her and living, anyway. Remains reality.

You know what shocks some folks when they go to Plan B? That they work on their personal recovery and find out they ARE valuable, whole, complete and worthy. Their healing begins.

Doesn't mean they don't choose to love when their partner chooses the steps to coming back. They are aware they are choosing to love and acting from their choice...not that they are being made to love by the other's choices and actions.

Respect others' choices...they make them...you make your own. There are few real no-matter-whats in this life. Distinguish the real ones from the wannabe's, 'k?

LA

I've been thinking about that since I wrote it LA and realized what your saying also. My life and me will no longer be held to what I feel is hostage to the past.

I've read back thru all my posts and I feel my commitment has been strong, not mistake free by any means but my resolve has been there.


Thank you so much LA. You also cat and bring and all others who took the time and effort. {{{hugz}}}

You're welcome.

It's mutual.

I'm glad you're reviewing...because you have to hold yourself hostage instead of being present...and that to me seems like an expected choice given how much in your life is used to distract you from your present.

Breaking habits is how we free ourselves from re-experiencing our trials again and again. Doesn't mean we change the long-term consequences from our past actions...they come, anyway. Be different in how you meet them.

Please take your hidden profile off that website. Protect your weaknesses for fantasy and distraction as coping skills which harm you the most. You're real, significant and your choices ripple.

People cannot share themselves lightly...not really. Each thought, action and word ripples beyond us...we are intimate beings, here to know and be known...which means we don't choose to believe the fantasy that there is any NSA sex...no trading off without consequences...just more ego in blame-shifting.

I believe what you have craved most is the freedom you didn't know you already had. You want to be free from your self-judgment, high critic...you want to be because you are a being.

When you take yourself significantly, you won't be able to act trivally with your body, soul and mind...be aware of your spirit, as it's as much a part of your being as everything else in you.

Do not treat any of your stuff casually, throwing away yourself...and you will not treat others that way, either. Breaks our control and manipulation desire (which comes from doing, not being) and frees us...know what you crave deeper than before.

Did you find a thrill of acceptance in swinging?

LA

I found being sexually open a thrill actually.

Well might or might not end up being the case LA. I was left with questions on the 30 days NC tonight and she now has shut me out with those questions still there. Was told our thursday talk last week was a good start, left her alone on NC days, didn't bug her on contact days and now get told she wants even more NC. How was our talk a good start? Every time there's a positive and no negatives she moves further away. There is more clarity about this 30 days NC that is needed.

You can't control her, make her want you, make her see your worth. All you can do is find your place on this earth, make sure you leave the world a better place 50, 60 years from now. That should be your focus, as hard as it is.to let go of her. If you keep working on yourself, even if you don't end up with her, you'll be in a better place.

To be totally honest I have never wanted to nor do I want to control her. It can all be defined and looked at as that but it was never and is never intended as such. I have simply wanted to enjoy life and have fun together and I'm only half of the decisions that were made together. I realize also the attention and affection I took away have effected things also but it was never intended to manifest as control.

Ezb,

I want to challenge you to a higher honesty. Humans do not do that which they do not want to do.

When we do the pursuer/distancer dance...which is what I saw you and Bunny doing in your marriage, then we pursue when we feel abandoned and distance when we feel engulf, smothered.

Both are attempts to get the other person to either come closer or push farther away. Those are attempts to control...we try; we can't really do it.

To continue you this dance takes two--whenever one person stops, the cycle/loop/dance stops. When you stand still in your own responsibility and know that you pursue when you feel abandoned, and you withdraw when you feel pursued, then you'll see what the other person does or doesn't do isn't the issue.

This dance takes both having their focus on the other.

Standing still means you turn your focus where it has power...onto yourself. You know you cannot be consumed by another nor truly abandoned (annihilated). You exist. You remain.

Reasonable as we swing between these two huge fears...fear of intimacy feels like we're being consumed, feels responsible for the entirety of another person (huge cause, control and cure); fear of abandonment feels like we're being erased, annihilated, left out of life. Either extreme still comes from inside you...both takes ignoring you are whole and complete, as is, made from marvelous hands.

I intended and strived to control (change) my DH's response. I wanted to stop his withdrawal and stop his blaming me for his fear, his pain and his anger. I spent a big part of our marriage trying to please him into making me feel safely loved and passionately loved--I tried to get him to make me feel--including reward and punishment. Swings just like the pendulum between pursuer/distancer.

When I went silent, I wanted him to miss my voice, my presence, my attention. When I agreed to something which would harm our marriage, I made sure he was the one suggesting it...I worshipped blame/shame, avoided it's wrath and shifted it's weight. All of that was in the farce of controlling others to control myself...acting based on outcome. Giving to get/tit for tat.

Your goal may be to enjoy life and have fun with others. That's part of intimacy. Will you think about your goal and see if it has the human mandate in there--to know and be known--for an intimate, connected marriage?

LA

Right now my goal is to stabalize my current life. If/and/or when an opportunity arises for a more intimate connection and/or possible marriage I will examine and cross that bridge at that time.

Hello again everyone. First off I would like to thank everyone for the help they have tried to provide. I found quite a few things that I will take with me in my future life and your time and effort was greatly appreciated by me. Thank you so much.

As far as an update for everyone I thought it would be respectful of the time and effort made to let you know what the situation has become.

I have been told that it is over and bunny is done with any relationship with me and is moving on. She said this was due to the fact that when she came over to get the rest of her things the door locks were changed. I have not yet determined if I will return to the lifestyle or not. I'am however a nudist and will be. She has moved back into the lifestyle.

I will continue to learn things and look forward to my future and full recovery with a lot of knowledge gained that I hope to put into practice in the future as I have been in the present. I owe thanks to a few of you for that knowledge. I have friends and family that will help me now.

Thank you and I wish you all the best.

Sorry to hear that. May I respectfully suggest that you don't introduce your children to nudism? I've read some studies on what that does to them, and it wasn't pretty.

fwiw, she's done because you changed the locks? What a crock!

I will only guide my children to live a clean life. I would never take them around nudism of any sort. If that is what they choose when they are older then I will always respect and welcome them.

Yeah it is a crock cat. She came to get the rest of her things so it was over at that point if not long ago. There have been nothing but her trying to find excuses not to give this whole thing an honest chance all along. Plan B should have been my plan right from the moment she moved out. It's a shame because things would have been so different. Funny how the lifestyle caused her so much hurt but I'm not convinced she was ever even out of it.

Ezb,

Thanks for the update.

Here's my first thought about nudism...are you sure it's not just a new bachelor hating to do laundry thing?



LA

lol that could have something to do with it.

I want everyone to know also I hadn't been a saint. My intentions and wants were to always build our marriage/relationship back up though and that would have come before anything. What I mean was I did make a profile about a week after I found out she was looking for sex (the emails to the guy). I made it to see if she allowed paid members to see her profile and what was in it because she was checking it all the time. It turned into a sexual longing and I did send out some emails. I never met anyone thru it though and never had sex.

Do you see that by your own words, you reveal that there's a part of you that realizes nudism is not a healthy lifestyle?

I'm disappointed (but not surprised) that you and Bunny both are still interested in the swinging. With these things in the picture, your marriage never really stood a chance.

You know, that makes me think. ezb, have you ever done any soul-searching to determine where this drive in you to experience 'more' comes from? In most cases I've seen, it's a lot of old FOO issues that result in a fear of some sort in you. A fear to look honestly at yourself, a fear that someone will see your unworth, a fear of not getting something that you missed out on as a kid (such as parental love)...

I really wish you would do some research on that, on why you feel drawn to alternative, 'free' lifestyles. What's your payoff?

I've done some soul searching cat. I was not loved like I should have been when I was a kid but those were different times and different methods and did teach me things to make me better. I watched as all my brothers and sisters went to their other parents on holidays and I had to stay home by myself. All that doesn't bug me now, I'm at peace with it.

I'm only drawn to be who I want to be. To be free from societies rules and regulations.

Uh, ok. Sure.

Which is the very definition of immaturity.