Guess I am still a few steps behind you FB.

I have been doing better with R talks after noticing my faults, and am trying to make myself better..but I still have much fear of losing her, of what we had. There were wonderful times. Maybe ten wonderful to 1 bad even. And although the wonderful have gotten less, I still remember clearly. She is everything I've always wanted, everything I wish I could be. I fear being alone, without her and the stepdaughters. I keep trying to work on the fear, and it is consuming me, it's winning the battle. I hold it in around her, but when I go to work it takes over.

I beleive the relationship is only emotional with the om, and am trying to better myself so maybe she will want to be apart of my life again. She sees my changes as an attempt to win her back. I told her I know she will do what she wants, and just want to better myself. She doesn't buy it. She sees nothing sincere in me because she is involved with him (imo).

Being direct and honest has helped in my talks WantWifeBack. I let my wife know that I was going to make steps to meet her needs, while stating that I realize that I had wronged her in the past. Of course alot of this came out in the early phases of the conflict, so I was still very much eluding to my own fears, guilt and blame. She is still with you and those good times that you had in the past go a long way... she remembers them. Another thing that has helped is we started doing things together ASAP. Once I worked out alot of baggage internally I stopped withdrawal and actually enjoy being around my wife again...just to be around her. I'm finding it easier to talk with her and the more she sees that I truly enjoy her presence, she is opening up too. Instead of spitting venom at each other, we are starting to do the courtship dance all over again....and it feels wonderful.

My wife has started talking about OUR future again. We are heping each other out now rather than just doing for the sake of getting things done. You are right Loving....she is using me as a stepping stone to work out some of her own issues. I feel honored that she is still able to put that trust in me. She is starting to open up in ways that I never thought possible. I see now that she always wanted to put that trust in me, saw potential in me, but she was unsure. I'm seeing our conflict as an opportunity to raise to the occasion rather than playing the blame game. When I cry now, it's because I see hope.

And yes I've had some rough days at work. People said some things around me, not knowing fully what I was going through, that would hit too close to home. I broke down on several occasions. I also had some moments of clarity about where I needed to go from here in my career, which probably wouldn't have occured without this conflict. It becoms all too easy to dwell on the negative. It's when I started counting all my blessings that I pulled out of my funk. I bet you can do the same.

So during the weekend we spend time cleaning the garage together. When her friends called for her to go out my wife said "I'm spending time with my husband tonight". She would usually go out with her friends. In fact she would sometimes find ways to ditch our plans to go out with her friends. We went to a romantic diner together and had some decent conversation. The table was candlelit and once when my wife was asking me something I got distracted by her beauty. I wanted to make it clear that I was distracted rather than trying to ignore her. I told her this and she stated "I feel uncomfortable with you complimenting me so much...I wished you wouldn't compliment me so much.". I told her I would try and respect her request. My wife has a negative self image problem. She revealed to me that she always wanted to wear a dress, however was unsure about how she looked in a dress. I told her that we should go and look at dresses together and she how they look on her. My wife said that would be great as long as I would be honest about how she looked. I told her I would try once again, but that it might be difficult due to the fact that I think she looks wonderful in just about anything.

I don't know...sounds like progress to me.

Not denying the self image issue, but perhaps too many compliments comes off as overdoing it. By that I mean that maybe she doubts your sincerity since it's coming so frequently?

Yep she probably doesn't know what to believe. Me either concerning her. I know what I feel. If she doesn't want to hear it I can respect her wishes.

mel, quite right. Growing up, my mom kept telling me how beautiful I was. So much so, in fact, that I finally decided I must really be ugly for her to try to prop me up so much. I've hated my looks ever since and cannot be objective.

fb, what can you do to build up her self-esteem? Go to the book store and look for some books to read.

Her looks are not the only thing I compliment her on, so it's not like I'm focusing on one thing. I tell her how smart, kind and cosiderate she is. I massage her feet about every other day. I have been performing acts of service and spending quality time with her. I really don't know what else I can do in order to make my wife feel good about herself. She still seems depressed to frequently. She refuses to seek professional help regarding this and I won't push the issue anymore (I've already told her that I feel she needs medical intervention and the counselor told her the same thing). Honestly her life seems to be going better than mine. I get blue sometimes, mostly at night when I'm tired and sh*t starts wearing on me, but I'm happy and carefree most of the time. I would like my wife to be happy, but if I focus too much on it that would be trying to control her. Been down that road, don't like it.

Everything is much better now besides the thing that set up our conflict in the first place. I have only had sex with my wife once since she said "love you like a brother" bit. I have to admit everything feels better except that she is still very unavailable to me sexually. We had a great night tonight...talking and going to the movies. Tonight, when we got home, I was just honest and said "I would like to make love to you". She said she was too tired. Then she stays up for 30 minutes reading. I confronted her about it. "don't get offended, reading helps me relax". All I could say was "I am not offended". Which I'm not, but I am confused. I just said "maybe tomorrow night?". All she said was "maybe". But I won't let it slide. I am going to keep working on our marriage for now. I can't keep loving somebody indefinitely and not getting my needs met. I feel like she is getting all the benefits of a husband striving to do all the right things, while she sits back and disrepects my needs. Honestly, I can do better on my own.

Another odd thing today. I worked out for about 3 hours today. Not because I think it will improve my relationship, but I think it will improve me. I believe worst case scenario, I can at least be happy with myself. When my wife found out about it she seemed iniatially offended...like I was crazy for exercising that amount. I just told her I was tired of being out-of-shape. Then something odd... she kissed me with so much passion I almost feel over. So many mixed emotions.

FB,

I saw a post you made on another thread and wondered about it. I read where you said you were also dealing with a WW...and I was confused. I think I missed something. Did you find some evidence?

Or do you see the wayward mindset?

LA

No I just realize that my wife has a wayward mindset. Wether physical, emotional or fantasy it's there. It's the mindset that keeps from her totally giving herself to me. It would be easier to have something concrete that I could confront. Until then I just know my wife is wayward....matters little if it is fantasy or reality at this point in the game. I know that her mindset is real.

FB,

Thank you for your reply. I realized why I'm having a difficult time understanding your situation--I've been so committed to not assuming that your choice to assume and not know is boggling my mind.

That's not me bashing you, btw. That's me wrestling this around in my own head. Haven't seen this choice before on MB...it's new to me.

I think I get it, though. Let me know if I'm off--you're in Plan A without the exposure component.

Have you considered asking to do communication exercises with her? I wrote about them on EWSII's thread in GQII, if you're interested.

LA

Hehe leave it to me to turn it chaotic. No I have to admit that I am barrowing different techniques from different sources. In my initial fit I just read and read and read. I am using some marriage buiders techniques, along with some stuff from other sources. MB, friends and parents say hire PI.....counselor tells me not to. My gut feeling tells me not to hire a PI. I beleive that the wayward mindset was leading my wife towards an affair, I don't know wether she got there or not....either way it's going to be difficult to prove even with a PI just because of different factors. My wife knows I'm eagle eye lately and she is trying to work on the marriage now more....I think this is enough to discourage her from going through with anything affair wise. Plus I trust my wife's morality not to have a physical affair. I have told her my beliefs regarding emotional affairs. I have not accused lately. Although she was going down the wrong path initially, I think she is making the right decisions for us now. I realize that this is my bed to lie in, so forgive me if it goes against the common logic of this site. I will look at your section on communication, thank you. I have found much of what is taught here very useful. I believe that it is helping my marriage. I see a giddiness in my wife lately... like a teenager who is struck by love again. My perception, true or not....but enough to change my actions to a positive one. I see she is consciously spending more time with me and seems to enjoy being around me....laughing at my stupid jokes and communicating more. When given the option of going out with freinds, she makes the decision to stay with me more. That is her decision to make, I don't force or guilt her. I try to let her know that she can have her own life and independence, that I can manage on my own. I think the more I lead by example, she realizes that life is more about choices and less about fate. I think my wife fell victim to the "I don't feel anymore, so I can't" train of thought. I almost feel victim to that when she said she didn't love me the same anymore. The temptation to give up was great. But I instead I fought.

And you keep fighting...

That's what I see.

How's the 15 hours of UA time? I understand the giddiness, her taking delight in your company again. Sounds like you're very present, aware and attentive now.

LA

I had some relationship talk with my wife yesterday. It had bene a couple of weeks since we did this, so I felt we should engage. My wife stated that she did not know why she feels the way she does (same scenario of every talk just about). I told her that I was very sorry that she was feeling this way, but that I didn't believe that she was being totally faithful to me (at least not in her heart). I told her that I was willing to forgive and forget....and to work on the present. I told her that I was sorry that I didn't trust her in this matter and that she could be mad at me for this if she wanted to. I told her: 1) I had no regrets about the time I spent with her, that I could at least look back and state that I had some amazing times together 2) That although I was going to try and work on the relationship and was mainly going to work on myself 3) bottom line that I was going to be happy....with or without her. I told her that although she meant everything to me, I couldn't force her to treat me as a husband. I told her that I derserve somebody that respects me and that I am a worthy person. I told her that I was done being depressed about our relationship. I basically hinted that it was time for action (from both parties). I believe that I could help make her happy...if she would allow it. I told her that at any time she could pull the plug on our marriage and I would leave. She acknowledged that: 1) I am a good person 2) I am willing to try and make her happy 3) that I was trying hard to met her needs. So I was like "What is the problem then?". She basically says that I'm everything that she wants or needs, won't tell me any other way in which she needs me to met her needs, but won't except me fully as a husband. Sounds crazy because it is. Today my wife informed me that she saw a doctor and is going to take an anti-depressant. I guess our conversation struck a nerve. This is the action I've been waiting for. It may not cure all our problems but it as least shows me that she is trying to make changes and she cares about our relationship.

Sad, but encouraging. Good for you for doing the hard work. Good luck!

LovinganywayOooooh…*ouch*
Wish my husband would read and ‘get’ this.


Fenderbender


When at this point…it’s as easy to leave as to stay.

Fenderbender, my H accuses me of NOT talking. Nothing. He is correct about that, but not the WHY.

There is NO point, when feelings are not respected. [ it hurts more than you know] Spitting venom is less painful then.

Reading this thread,…tears welled up.
Thank you Lovinganyway and Fenderbender.

Something else FB mentioned in a post about Reassurance from one’s spouse. I am guilty of that one.

Re: sex. My H blasted me for that once…he wanted a romantic afternoon…I suggested we go quadding…I don’t read minds. *sigh*

Men seem to feel Loved by their wives primarily through Sex…and many women, we shut down in that department when we are not appreciated for other more important qualities [ IMO] Perhaps that was what your wife meant by feeling like a ‘piece of meat.”

Your W's comment about wishing You had an affair. I can understand that...whether she has /is having one or not. [ me not] It would be the straw that broke the camel's back.

My H won’t come to this site, nor do any of the questionnaires with me. Nothing. SO….I thank you to hear some of the other side, whether it is 100% applicable or not… I learn something.

Have you asked your wife to join you on MB?
may or may NOT be a good idea....I get hounded as a troll because I am not in an affair nor been in one and adultery to my knowledge is not a problem in our marriage. AS such I get abused on this board with abandon. Says more about the posters than anything else.

I have been guilty of telling her how she should feel. I'm done doing that though. I realize that I can't control her and I will stop trying.

As far as the affair thing goes, either way it's a total lack of respect thing. She either wishes I would have an affair to lessen her guilt or wishes I would have an affair so that she can end the relationship. Either way, this does not view me as very important. But then again, I'm done getting my feelings hurt too.

I don't want to leave. I could have done that a long time ago, even before the conflict occurred. I love my wife. Eventually the time might come where I decide that I can't stand it anymore. I'm looking at it more that I'm giving her a chance rahther than trying to prove myself to her.

Give up 100% control.
You cannot KNOW what she feels. You cannot tell her what she SHOULD feel. That is disrespectful to the nth degree! It will build a concrete wall like nothing you have seen. IME
1. IF she was having an affair...but you don't seem to think so. Neither do I.
2. Where does that though come from? How do YOU know how she views you? That sounds more like a self esteem issue. You are mirroring yourself off her...that is you issue that you have created for yourself...not the other way around. What is the ROOT of that sensation? Dig for it within yourself.
3. REASSURANCE<---she needs to Let you KNOW ....Tell HER that!!!
You Love her and She loves YOU. Or she would not still be there with you. Rough patches come and go. Some are worse than others...

She sounds like a very busy and driven woman. She drowns herself in her work and studies...WHY? What is SHE running from? What is she missing from you?

When/IF she answers you...LISTEN...just listen. It may take her A LOT of time ....but I am pretty sure she will open up...on HER own schedule, not yours. After years of being TOLD what SHE should feel....it's harder than h*ll to OPEN up...

Something to consider: You can take a jack hammer to the concrete wall, to get to the other side...but then you will have only rubble. OR...you can be like water...and you flow through the concrete wall via capillary action. It's slow...but WATER can always get through the tiniest of cracks.