Simple: When people live together, all they are doing is full time dating. There is no extra commitment as in a marriage. Just to be dating exclusive, and you do not have to move in together to date exclusive.

Except by living together full time sex is on tap 24/7. Why buy the cow, the milks for free, and the cow is free to go and give her milk to a new farmer tomorrow.

They only thought enough of each other to get married after 7.5 years. It does not show much willingness on their part's to get married.

Married 1.5 years, no children so child will have their home broken up by a divorce.

Best time to cut cleanest is now.

7.5 years without a commitment, and another 1.5 year without further commitment which is evident by an affair during such a short marriage.

They have never showed the willingness to be committed for the last 8 years.

Living together is not committed. It's just shacking up.

I think your logic is skewed...let me explain why.

There is no commitment after marriage.....for ANY OF US in the "infidelity" forum. Therefore, we should ALL just divorce because of the lack of commitment that you mention. Let's just close the site down.

this is an absolutely ridiculous statement and an insult to all BS here that are full committed to their marriages.

By your logic, then why get married at all? We can just live together forever with no legal protections.

Living together is a good way to guarntee divorce later.

That's neither here nor there. It's done.

So there is a very valid question to ask. What is the motive to save a marriage when there are no kids? Love? That's gone and you can find it with someone else.

Hope to recapture what you had with the spouse? That's gone forever too regardless of what happens. The trust has been broken in a terrible way and recapturing what you had will simply lead to infidelity again since what you had led you there regardless.

The love of your life that you can't recapture that love with someone else? Every relationship is a snowflake. But the odds of having a great love with someone else are very high. This one requires massive rebuilding.

See, with children in the picture you can strive to recapture the family. You can be motivated to fix the problems in your marriage in order to focus on what is most important in life, which is the children. Because the kids do benefit from not having to live out of suitcases and because they don't have to go back and forth between homes.

Children give an external reason to save a marriage and not an internal, fuzzy one such as "love".

I was motivated to save my marriage because I didn't want to live exactly what I'm living now which is separation from my kids. Fear that they can be abused by a boyfriend or step father. I also feel a major loss of the this time in their lives, which is precious.

They are dealing with mixed emotions and confusion as well and it is tough as a father to witness that.

So that was my motive to try and save my marriage. If there were no kids in the picture I would have moved long ago and would probably be with someone who was worth my time, energy and love. But I stay where I am for them and hope to make the best of what I have here.

The perspective age gives is that love can be found with someone else, so the fear of ending a marriage without kids in the picture and with youth in the equation makes no sense to someone who has kids. Those with kids will keep saying, "count your blessings and run!"

So you're asking about your options with a woman who has no remorse, is fense sitting, and you have no kids with.

I will err on the side of saving your marriage.

Plan A first. You seem to have already done that, but you haven't exposed well since her parents seem surprised.

What you need to do is expose the affair. Let her parents know that you know she's cheating and that that is driving her actions, not depression.

Plan A for as long as you can and then go to Plan B. Plan B will prepare you for either divorce or to simply shield you from the abuse she's dishing out.

You want a plan to save your marriage. This website gives you that and SH gives you that roadmap.

But the first thing you need to do is expose.

I might be wrong but I don't think that comment was meant to be taken seriously let alone personally.

medc,

I went to lunch and stewed on this subject some, and I guess I'll give introvert a break. He's only 6 weeks out from his own personal worst nightmare and is most likely running on raw emotion and grasping at anything to try to stay afloat.

At this point, he is obviously clueless about what he's talking about, but that's part of the problem ... at this point in R ... he doesn't know what he doesn't know.

Once the Recovery Honeymoon wears off for him and the real heavy lifting starts, then he will realize just how humbling an experience it really is to acquire that taste for [censored] that every BH has to go through to attempt to recover their M. At that point, he very likely will "get it" and may even begin to question his own decision to R ... as we all have at one point or another.

Introvert, take this or leave it ... its your life, but I have learned to listen to the "voice of experience". Commit this exchange to memory and review it in 6 months and I'll bet you'll be arguing this point from the same perspective as medc and I.

Alone, I didn't see where you exposed the affair. Did you? You have to know by now that you will NEVER get your wife back if she has free access to another guy, even if it's just emotional.

Did you expose?

So, you feel that I am headed for plan D at some point (6 months)?

Took it out of context...as usual.

Probably, if you don't back down from your anger and bitterness. Repairing a marriage takes selflessness and humility. Even when you know you're right. How many times do you see someone here say 'why should I be the one doing the work? I'M not the one who cheated!' But that's how it works, psychologically speaking.

"VAST"? Really? I wonder if the VAST majority on MB would agree with you. And for someone who claims to be intelligent, this statement is lacking VASTLY in facts and proof.

Introvert,

I'm trying to cut you some slack and you're not making it easy.

Listen to me ... I don't care how good you think you've got it right now that your R is on track ... I'm telling you that you are going to be facing emotions in the next 6 months that you can't begin to understand at this point in R.

About 10 months ago, BigKahuna had a similar exchange with me, when I THOUGHT I knew everything, and my situation was so much different that anything anyone else had faced, and I was so much better prepared than anyone else.

He tried to prepare me for the EXTREME ANGER that would hit me at about the 6 month mark, which would cause me to question everything that had happened.

Well, he missed it by about 6 weeks, but IT HIT ME LIKE A BOLT OF LIGHTENING and it will you, too.

All I'm try to convery to you is that if I had known what I know now, and will likely learn more as I continue down this path, and I was 33 years old, no children, and a WW that had been in a full blown PA ... I would be giving Plan D and whole lot more consideration that what you apparently are.

Doesn't mean that I think you should go directly to Plan FU, but I CAN tell you that you're screwing up royally by not even considering the prospect, especially if you have ambitions of becoming a father some day.

Consider it or reject it ... its your call.

I suppose I should make one qualifier ... as with nearly all of my posts, I deal with BH/WW situations, and with that one distinction, I will stand by my observations.

Alone,

Welcome to MB.

I have a different take than those who have posted to you, for the most part. I would like you to think about what it was that first drew you to your wife and what it is you have admired most about her. Then think about what her core character has been at its best. What is the "good" version of your wife like at her best?

Then think about whether you believe those character qualities can be restored with time, patience, and healing (yes, and commitment on her part, but you don't get to control that.)

If you can't come up with anything about her that reflects character and integrity-- if your relationship was just based on physical attraction or some other fleeting thing-- then there might not be much to work for.

But if she was once an admirable person, it may be possible for her to become one again. If that is the case, and you still love her, then the MB plans are here for you. They may not work, because you can't control her, but they are your best shot-- and you will like yourself better in the end if you set a goal to encourage your W to become true and honorable and worthy of respect.

Because sometimes they do indeed change.

I have/and am considering plan FU....any BS in my/your position would be stupid, and/or very naive not to be (see my recovery thread).

My problem (originally started with medc) of people cramming plan D down a newly BS's throat is that he hasn't even done plan A or B yet, and already people are trying to say "plan D". It is not fair to him, or any other BS who just showed up to MB to do that. Why should someone come to a place called "Marriage Builders" for advice just to get "end your marriage" thrown at him, simply because his marriage wasn't "long" enough for yours (or medc's) liking, or doesn't have children? Give the guy some friggin' credit...I'm sure plan FU is already in the back of his mind...he (nor anyone else) needs help with Plan D...he needs help with A and B.

I think the question in the title of his thread had something to do w/ the replies he received.

"Divorce or Separate?"

Introvert,

I understand ... I had to learn things the hard way, too.

Good Luck to you in your R.

lol...point taken. Does someone not think that he could get some "marriage building" type of advice though? Or is his 1.5 years, no kids, no problem, plan D advice what he should just do?


I do have a question for the people who think that the 6 year relationship means nothing (Bs's anyway)...
If you were in a 6 year relationship, and your spouse comitted adultery, would you not be just as hurt as you were after you married and found out?


...and, one for Ws's...
If you were in a 6 year relationship and comitted adultery, would you not feel all of the emotions during the affair, and go through all of the symptoms of fogginess, withdrawal, etc...?

You as well.

Question for you...I see that you don't have kids with your WS. Why are you trying to recover?

Not sure if it would hurt the same or less without the vows.

But for me, the vows do make the game for keeps.

There is no spouse until the vows.