Hi all,

I'm new to this discussion board. I'm looking for some insight/help/I'm not sure what.

Two months ago, my wife asked me to leave. She said wasn't in love with me any more. We had recently di a short sale on our home to avoid forclusure, and then I lost my job. As you can guess I have been quite depressed. two weeks after my layoff, she hit me with this.

I have been seeing a councelor who has been quite helpful with the depression. We have seen a councelor of her choice twice now. My wife doesn'tr seem to be to interested in trying to save our marraige. She is still going though, so I have that to cling to. In our last session, she told the counselor that she didn't want me to tell her I loved her anymore. He told me not to have any expectations of her and asked me to do this and I have complied, although it is difficult. He (the Counselor) asked what my wife could do to make me feel better. He just told me not to have any expectations, so that wasn't a fair question to ask me. but to answer his question I asked that she put her wedding band back on. She has not done this. we still live in the same house and sleep in different rooms. I will not leave my daughter.

I'm realy worried. Is there hope for us. I lover her dearly, and don't want my daughter to suffer.

any thoughts?

Read HNHN
Stop LB
Start meeting her EN
Snoop around and see if she's having an affair - the ring thing disturbs me.

That being said... these things take time. It takes time for you to develop new non-LB habits and it takes time for her to stop being angry. I went through a period when I didn't want to be in the same room with my husband, much less for him to tell me he loved me. Be patient, she may turn around.

Busy yourself with other things... like attending job interviews any job interview will do. The more she sees you *doing* the better it is.

Well, there are ton of things to read here, and I'd recommend you do that. I know it's mostly dealing with affairs, but it still gives a lot of insight.

Do you know what her ENs (emotional needs) are? I would guess one is financial security. And if that's the case, you need to get a good job if you haven't already. What else does she need from you, and are you giving it to her?

Also, just taking a guess at why your wife doesn't want you to tell her that you love her. If you aren't doing the things that make her feel loved, then telling her you love her just comes off as a lie to her. So sure, stop telling her you love her and start/continue to show her you love her.

Are you still in depression? It may be that you need to get yourself fixed, and start feeling good about yourself before you can really show your love for her.

Thank you all for your insight. I show her love every chance I can.

I have been seeing a christian counselor for my depression for a while now. I have improved dramatically. I am a much better person now than I have ever been.

Last night at our marriage counselor, she said that she wants a divorce and has no intention of trying to make things work. She wants live our separate lives in the same house with our daughter, so she knows her parents are there for her. The counselor was willing to agree with her. I told him that, that is an obsurd idea and not the tpye of counsel I want, then walked out. I feel this would be an unhealthy situation to put a 9 year old in. I told her if she wants out of the family, than please go and let us move on. It truely hurt to say that but I felt it had to be said. She told me that she's not leaving the family just the marriage. When I asked her if she new what a family was, her response was, "well, we'll just redefine family". I'm now sure there is sin in her life some now. I've said all along that I would be willing to work as hard and as long as it takes to restore our marriage.

i have been working regularly at my old job doing contract work, even to the point where I have to bring work home to do as well.

Friends I am feeling almost every emotion there is to feel. Sad, angry, scared, embarressed, even joyfull because God gives me hope. I want to do the right thing, but I don't know what that is.

Beachwalker - a few questions first, to help give a better understanding of some of the dynamics in play here. Then a few brief comments.

1. Are both you and your wife Christians? I assume you are since you mentioned a "christian counselor" in your second post, but it's only an assumption.

2. Your wife "selected" the marriage counselor. How did she select one and why?

3. Is the marriage counselor a Christian Marriage Counselor?

4. Do you and your wife attend church regularly?

5. Your reference to her parents "being there for her" was unclear. What did you mean by that statement?

6. What was your wife's reaction to your statement and walking out of the counseling session?


Your response to the marriage counselor was "spot on" correct. Get a new marriage counselor as this current one doesn't have a clue about saving marriages, nor does the "advice" square with Scripture.

Your wife's reactions and your statements indicate a lot of financial stress has been "in play" for some time. With "financial" reasons being one of the top reasons for divorce, do you think that she has a very high Emotional Need for Financial Security and that it is driving her to "think" that she made a "mistake" in marrying you because she is worried about not having enough money?

Regardless of the preceding question, her statements about not being in love, her refusal to wear her wedding ring, her wanting to stay "separately" in the house, etc. lead me to suspect rather strongly that she is also having an affair with someone, perhaps just and Emotional Affair at this time, but given the statements about love, the wedding ring, divorce, unwillingness to try to make the marriage work I STRONGLY suspect Another Man that you don't know about yet.

It is time for you put on your detective cap and SNOOP to find out the truth or falsity of an affair. In the meantime, separate your finances from her immediately. If there is an affair, she WILL drain whatever resources are there so fast it is amazing. For your child's sake, even if you are "uncomfortable" with doing this, DO IT.

Looking forward to your responses.


God bless.

Immediately (if not sooner!) ditch that counselor. Make a call to the Harley's. Assume your wife is having an affair and snoop. Be prepared for the worst.

Your "marriage" counselor is a CANCER to your marriage. If you continue to get "help" from this person, you will wind up divorced.

This really should be on GQII as that gets a lot more traffic.

1. Are both you and your wife Christians? I assume you are since you mentioned a "christian counselor" in your second post, but it's only an assumption.

2. Your wife "selected" the marriage counselor. How did she select one and why?

3. Is the marriage counselor a Christian Marriage Counselor?

4. Do you and your wife attend church regularly?

5. Your reference to her parents "being there for her" was unclear. What did you mean by that statement?

6. What was your wife's reaction to your statement and walking out of the counseling session?

1. I thought we were. we went to church regularly. were very active. Sice this whole thing began my walk with Christ has deepend

2. She didn't like what my christian counselor told her so she selected a secular one based on a recomendation from one of her divorced friends

3. no

4. We do yes, although I don't know what she will be doing now

5. Mean our daughter parents (my wife and)

6. she laghed at me.

I just withdrew some $ from our joint account and opened my own account. I also went to the Dealership to discuss my options regarding her leased car which is in my name. I then called her and asked her one last timeif this is what she wanted. she said yes, so I told that she would not be recieving any more $ from. If she needs funds to pay bills, she can ask me and I will transfer my 1/2 into the joint account. I also told her that we'll most likely need to sell her car back to the dealer, and she qualified for the financing can buy it back from them.

Hey, Beach...

What are you here for? Do you want to stand for your marriage or are you ready to Plan D (divorce)?

There are plans to fight for your marriage...and if your W is in an affair (and there are way too many red flags to me saying she is), then you can choose the plan you want, follow the steps, and know you did everything you could to save your marriage...

whether it is or not.

Stands right now...you won't be really proud of yourself years down the line, will you? When you tell your married daughter (in the future) to fight for her marriage and she says, "Why? You didn't." When you tell her to stick to her commitment and not react from her feelings...same thing.

I don't think that's what you want...and I think you're hurting a heckuva lot right now...part of which is from you giving away a lot of power to your W...without you taking steps to ascertain the truth (independently of her).

Find out the truth. Then choose your plan. You're not alone.

LA

LA,

I have made it known that I will fight as long as hard as it takes for my marriage. my family means that much to me!

Beach,

Good to know.

Please check her cell bills, cell phone, emails (keylogger), every way she has of communicating to find out if she is in an A right now, 'k? That's really important...don't ask...verify.

Next, read about Love Busters (LBs) and figure out which ones you have done the most...might be all of them (was for me)...and eliminate your permissions inside to do any of them. They aren't really you, not part of you, and they aren't what you want to do, anyway.

Sit down and sort out the financial reality of divorce...as you did with the car lease, etc. I used a spreadsheet to list all the monthly bills, divided them in half, then took WH's monthly net pay and mine, subtracted off each half from each net, and showed him the result.

His remainder as his and mine as mine. Not enough to live separately on...and we talked about what we thought we'd save on (less utilities, food, etc.) and then the reality sank in that we do double our expenses when we split.

Plan A is about bringing reality...revoking our permissions to react to our feelings and begin acting from love and respect. Forsakes manipulation, attempts to control, persuade, change others' stuff. And choosing to stay present.

Choose to do listen and repeat...may seem annoying or degrading--truly isn't...it's an act of respect to confirm or clarify what you're hearing...and removes the assumption you are hearing correctly. Especially during times of crisis as you are in now, we don't hear...our filters get huge...there's distortion, reactivity from a lot of fear. Listen and repeat settles down your reactivity, soothes in your calm voice, and gives you the experience of feeling respected when you act respectfully.

She has her own stuff--her thoughts, beliefs, perceptions, feelings, perspective--it isn't the truth, it's her truth...her stuff. Make sure you aren't taking in her stuff as about you, 'k? When you listen and repeat, you hand back her stuff as hers, recognize she's sharing her truth...not telling you The Truth, though she may state her stuff as fact...listen and repeat helps you to rephrase to know her stuff cannot be fact, 'k?

These were the first things I did four years ago when my DH was a WH (and this is the anniversary month of his A)...and these changes I made weren't temporary...they have been a permanent help in recoverying our marriage.

LA

Beach,

Welcome, unfortunately, to the halls of MB.

There are many here to listen and assist you to retain your M.

I noticed you said the following;

"I'm now sure there is sin in her life some now."

If this means what I think it means, that you are now sure there is an affair going on, either EA (emotional) or PA (physical)then there, strangely, is hope because we know how to fight the adulterous indifference of the wayward spouse.

If there IS no affair, then you must go back to the MB basics and fill her love bank, no love busting, and meet her ENs.

Does she work? Is she depressed as well?

That she wants to stay in the house with you but not be married leads me to think there is not an affair. Usually the wayward wants "their own space" to be free to carry one the A.

I agree, get rid of the counselor.

So what did you mean be "there is sin in her life"

kirk

Thank you LA! I've just printed you post and plan to work on that.

What I mean is that I feel she either has/is or is planning to be with another.

BTW, she wanted me go back with her to see this counselor so he could facilitate our explaining the situation to our daughter. I told her that I would not.

She says she has been unhappy for years, and has tried to work on the marraige. Unfortunately she had not expressed any of the to me or family until now. I admit my depression has been very difficult for me and those around me. But honestly it wasn't until I has been in my own couseling that I understand how it's affected others. As soon as I was made aware of this, I have taken steps to correct this.

So where should I go from here? Will MB help if I cannot interact with my wife. She hasn'tr been home in two days.

Sorry to say, but imho this has all the earmarks of an affair, probably an romantic infatuation. These often arise during times of stress, such as mid-life crisis, death of parents or other close family members, or, as in your case, financial loss. If you're willing to fight to keep your family together, you should at least determine the actual battle you are fighting. If there is an A, that's a different battle. In such a case, everything W says about having been unhappy for years, has tried to make the M work, yada yada, is all just a lot of typical WS fog-babble. Keep an ear out for the classic, "I love you but am no longer in love with you." Sure sign of an A

I agree with Galoot, it has all the classic signs of an affair.

You need to snoop - key logger on the PC, cell phone bills, GPS on the car, voice activated recorder in the car, voice activated recorder hidden in the room where she does her private phone converstaions, hire a PI if you have to.

Once you know, EXPOSE the affair.

1. Do not tell her you are going to do this. If you tell her your plans it gives her a chance to tell all her friends and family "DH has gone crazy. He's so controlling and jealous. He even thinks I'm having an A. He's insane! I don't even feel safe around him any more." and so forth.

2. When you expose, do it all at once.

3. Expose to everyone that has a high degree of influence on her, the M, and her A: her parents, her siblings, her best friends, the OM's wife, the OM's parents.

4. The message of exposure is not revenge. It is "WW is having an A with OM. Though it breaks my heart I have decided to work on saving my M and improving myself as a person and a partner to WW. Your support of WW, our M, and myself would be greatly appreciated."

Of course to OMW the message would be a little different. OMW may not believe you at first, so if you have copies of cell phone records, logs from the PC, etc. to share that would help.


Expect WW to be furious. She may tell you she can never trust you again, that you blew all chances of reconciliation now, that she's hired a D lawyer, that she was about to end it with OM but you ruined that, that she hates you, etc. etc. etc. This is very normal and is actually a good sign because it shows the exposure had a great impact.

But for now: get to snooping. I smell an A.
I'm sorry.

Guess she is not that concerned for her daughter. Do you know where she is?


This really stinks of adultery.

Has she been coming home late from work?
Changed her appearance?
Protects her cell phone and purse?
Bought new clothes?
Trying to look or act younger?
New interests and/or new music?
Lots of attention to hair and nails?
Losing weight or working out?

Start snooping everywhere. Did she talk glowingly about a co-worker several months ago and then suddenly stop mentioning him?


I think you should consult an attorney today. You need to procect yourself and your daughter.

Everyone I know has had the same opinion. I've confronted her on this, her sisters have and my parents have (whom she was very close to). And yes, she gotten very upset at this topic. How does one combat this? I informed her that I will need to sell her car to get the lease out of my name. If she qualified for financing she could buy it back from the dealer. I told she may want to se if her boyfriend or her father would be willing to co-sign. Also I told this is not what I want to do but I have no choice, I must protect myself and daughter. (She didn't like A reference)

Daughter was at a sleep-over with a friend for that last two days. That's why she didn't need to come home. Wed. she wanted us to tell our daughter what was happening. However, her version of the truth wasn't quite the actual truth. I know she spoke to my Dad. He told her if she didn't tell the truth to our daughter, I will and if I don't he would.

Yesterday, she decided we shouldn't tell the daughter and that maybe we should "sit down and talk, with no expectations, just talk things out". So, I'm wondering what's going to happen next. Friends she has been a part of my life for almost 20 years. She and my daughter are my world. If my depression has caused me to neglect her emotional needs, I am truely sorry, but I know, given the chance I can learn how to meet those needs again. (My progress has been fantastic.)

I've snooped as you have recommended, and turned up nothing. Can't afford a PI. How do i fight for my family??

Thank you all so much for your insight.

I've snooped as you have recommended, and turned up nothing.

What exactly have you done to snoop? If we know what you've done, we can make suggestions of other stuff to try.

CHECKED HER CELL RECORDS, LOOKED THROUGH HER ROOM AND CLOSET. bELIEVE ME THIS IS NOT ME. I FELT TERRIBLE DOING THIS. WE ONLY HAVE ONE EMAIL ACCOUNT SO I KNOW WHAT'S HAPPENING WITH THIS. UNLESS SHE'S SET UP SONMTHING SOMEWHERE ELSE