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......ssshhhhhhhh......

...Don't let Pep know that leaving is an option....... she already tried it once...


me - 47 tired
H - 39 cool
married 2001
DS 8a think
DS 8b :crosseyedcrazy:
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(Ack! Now he's not even a blockhead, just a word! That's no fun!)
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""""""Pop's has been here since 2001 - why didn't you ask him the same question? """""""""

didn't ask but i will be glad to answer.

1st i have moved way beyond my w's A.

2nd i actually left for awhile and was posting on another board which i still go to occasionally.

3rd i returned here because someone from the other board told me of a bh who was dealing with a ww. he seemed like he wanted to stay in his marriage like i did so i thought i could offer my experiences with the hope it may shed some light on what he may be experiencing.

4th also if i can offer any advice or encouragement to others such as yourself that helps them achieve a better place or get thru this nightmare no matter what path they choose.

5th there are still some here that helped me tremendously with my own sitch way back. and i still read and try and learn ways of improving my marriage further

6th i would love to meet many here and on the other site in person. share a thrity's ice cream or play a round of golf with jl for example. although it is a stretch to call my game "golf". unfortunately i have not had those opportunity's


me-59 ww-55
married 1979 - together since 1974
6 kids together 15,19,21,23,29,30
my oldest son 37
d-day (confession day) memorial day 2001
oc born 12/20/01
now 8 grandchildren
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First of all.............I NEVER said that anyone with NC was immoral oe evil. I said that I Was in a moral/ethical dilema.

There is not one post that I have written here that says anything like that. Also I never said anyones's successful marriage recovery was a lie! Where did you get that idea?

When I put "good for you" about Pep's marriage, I meant it as a complement, not sarcastically. So maybe your assuming I meant it in a bad way, That's the only thing I can figure why you would say that I said her marriage was a lie. I really only wanted to know was it really going to take years to recover from.

Also, How do you figure I was judgemental on anyone? I never said anything bad about anybody, just that I couldn't boss my H around. I never judged anyone for what they were able to work out with there H's

As for Pop, I don't even know who that is. If he posted a response to me, I must have read it without looking at who wrote it. There's over 40 responses on this thread, I can't remember everyone's name, being so new.

My H and I have decided to go to marriage counseling, and decide what were going to do next from there.

I thank ALL of you for your support and advice. I am extremely stessed out right now, and I don't need to be accused of being judgemental to anyone. I don't think this is the board/support group for me. I won't be back.

I'm sure there will be a few of you who will write a response, but I won't be coming back to this site to read any of them.

Again, thank you for all of your advice from everyone. It's given me a lot to think about. But I need to figure this out on my own with some prof. help.

Thanks and God Bless to all.


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I went back at looked at my post , I did apparently say it was wrong to deny a child based on waht the MM and OW have done.

What I meant was I felt it was morally wrong for me.



not that it was morally wrong for people who have NC. I'm sorry If I offended anyone. I could only wish that my H would decide to have NC and pay CS, but I highly doubt that will happen.

And no, I'm not contradicting myself because I said I was in a moral dilema about OC. I am just expressing my "wishful thinking" that he would have NC.


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Hurtmomof2 -

If you were upset and responding to the following comment - perhaps you were unaware this comment was a response to ANOTHER poster on your thread (Girly):


Quote
Girly,

Everyone has a different opinion about C and N/C. It sounded like you were trying not to be judgemental, but you did judge anyone who is NC as being amoral people who's recovered marriage is a lie.

Is that what you meant to say?


No one said YOU were being judgmental. It was Girly's opinion being discussed.

For some reason - a first time poster (Girly) has decided to choose YOUR thread to voice her first ever MB opinion - sometimes a first time poster responding to an OC issue is a disguised OW who has her own OC - I cannot say this is true in this case - but having been around a long time I am aware that the OW with OC read this board and sometimes try to direct the BETRAYED WIFE in certain directions favorable to the OC over the children of MARRIAGE ...

Back to your question about recovery - yes - it takes YEARS to fully recover

and the length of time has many variables

If you live in the continental USA you would be well advised to give the Harley's a call - with your husband. They are experts at guiding/coaching couples through this quagmire.

Pep


Last edited by Pepperband; 08/24/08 10:22 AM.
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Hurtmomof2,

Excuse me if I am jumping in on this a little late as I was quickly reviewing your thread and something stood out to me immediately.

Your issue with C or NC

Do what is best for you and do not let others sway you from what you feel in your heart and mind is right. Your H an the OW did not consider you or your chidldren when they did what they did and brought this OC to the world so it is okay to make them not matter as well...Remember they took away your choices in this matter and now they have to live with the consequences of their decisions and your decisions...

Read my thread maybe it will provide some insight.

Plus you have a good person on here giving you good advice. Hi Pepperband..thanks for sharing your insight with me as well. I tried to thank you but could not send you a pm.

shocked1


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shocked1 kiss

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Originally Posted by hurtmomof2
First of all.............I NEVER said that anyone with NC was immoral oe evil. I said that I Was in a moral/ethical dilema.

There is not one post that I have written here that says anything like that. Also I never said anyones's successful marriage recovery was a lie! Where did you get that idea?

Hurt,
If you were talking about my post, it was in response to Girly's post. I have made no such judgements about you and having been around this long, I know that these decisions about contact are extremely personal and difficult to make. All of the circumstances are different and have to be taken into consideration for each couple.

I only wanted to let Girly know and you that there are many things to consider in this situation and it is not for the faint hearted.

You are so early in the process. Don't leave. Things will change, you will change and it is great to have a place where people understand what you are going through.

No one here will judge you or let others who don't know what they are talking about judge you. There is another protected board for this precise situation, if you are interested, send me a PM and I will tell you where it is. It is safe from potential OW's eyes.

Don't leave on this note. No harm was intented towards you. Only help and support.

Take care.


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hurt don't feel bad for not knowing who "this" small fish is in a very big ocean. ok if you measure around the waist i may not be "such" a small fish.

being a bh rebuilding our marriage and raising our oc i know exactly what you mean by the moral/ethical choices one needs to decide on.

since you are going to be looking for prof counseling i would suggest the harley's if you can afford them. they have had a lot of experience dealing with these specific situations.

hopefully you don't leave. but if you do i wish you the best in getting thru this ordeal no matter which path you choose to walk.

i respect your decision to look elsewhere for support. i will keep an eye out for you in the event you choose to stay

best of luck


me-59 ww-55
married 1979 - together since 1974
6 kids together 15,19,21,23,29,30
my oldest son 37
d-day (confession day) memorial day 2001
oc born 12/20/01
now 8 grandchildren
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 173
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Thank you everyone. Yes, I did think that thread was directed at me. I'm releved to find out that it wasn't. H and I are going to Marriage Counseling, for the past 8 months he has been working out of town, and driving home on the weekends.

I told him that he needed to move home right away, and we can see wher we'll go from there. He is coming back Sept.1st.

What will happen? I really don't know at this point.


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I'm glad you came back! I can see how the mistake happened, but I'm sure people understand the turmoil you are going through, and no one is going to judge you for doing what you need to do to protect your own family. That is where your responsibility and obligations lie.

I apologize for what I contributed to the confusion and the T/J. You have one of the best here on your team - Pep. You are in good hands. Stay here and keep posting.

*hugs*


me - 47 tired
H - 39 cool
married 2001
DS 8a think
DS 8b :crosseyedcrazy:
(Why is DS7b now a blockhead???)
(Ack! Now he's not even a blockhead, just a word! That's no fun!)
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"She should not be judged for not wanting the woman who wanted to break up her marriage and her child, to be in their lives daily"

Hi Lbelle,

Thank you for your reply. Believe me and you, she is not being judged.... Only God can judge each and every last one of us. Her feelings are completely justifiable. I am quite sure she and other women in her situation did everything right...some woman work, take care of the kids, clean, do it all...are the perfect wives and then their lives are shattered because the men in their lives chose not to step outside of their vows... It hurts like hell to know that you have done the right thing and in the end you get the short end of the stick and all you want to know is "what did I do?"

I am the child of an affair. For years, I did not know how to love and trust a man because I never had my father around to love me and show me how a man should treat a woman...It was not until I was 26 that I learned that the reason my biological father was not around is because he was married..even then, he asked my mom to have her babies and begged her to stay with him and talked about killing himself if she left (i am almost positive his wife did not this).... anywhoo... to get away from him... she married a man she knew for only 3 months...

I realize that every situation is different, however, just like the wives who did everything right...the kids did not have a choice because of the man (who took vows) and the woman, who may or may not have known the man was married.....this is not about my situation

It is not evil because the woman does not want to deal with the OW....who would? But as stated before, if the wife decides to forgive her husband then the act of forgiveness should be shown towards the child, otherwise, if you choose to try and sweep it under the rug, your marriage is a lie (that may hurt, but its the truth).... when you truly learn how to LOVE and forgive a person ...is when you begin to heal...and yes this make take time....



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Hurtmomof2,

I am so sorry if you thought my initial statement was directed towards you...it was not... someone had posted that it is not immoral to have any dealings with the child (sorry for not wanting to go back and retrieve the exact posting)...but my intentions were never to offend you as I know this is an overwhelming process for you....

I am a first time poster and I was on the site looking/researching other things and I did come across your thread, however, this is not about me nor did I mean to offend you...I just disagreed with the other poster advising you that it is okay to deny an innocent child (as I was born under the same situation) truthfully, I was trying to be objective...

I wish the best in a successful recovery in your marriage...God bless...Sincerely

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Hi Lbelle,

I am the child of an affair. For years, I did not know how to love and trust a man because I never had my father around to love me and show me how a man should treat a woman...It was not until I was 26 that I learned that the reason my biological father was not around is because he was married..even then, he asked my mom to have her babies and begged her to stay with him and talked about killing himself if she left (i am almost positive his wife did not this).... anywhoo... to get away from him... she married a man she knew for only 3 months...


I understand now why you made your response. I don't think all OW/MM situations are like this, but I hope your mom was able to make a life with the man she married....your step father.


I realize that every situation is different, however, just like the wives who did everything right...the kids did not have a choice because of the man (who took vows) and the woman, who may or may not have known the man was married.....this is not about my situation

I noticed you pointed out that the MM was the one who took the vows. This is classic OW thinking, you know. HE took vows, HE broke them (he did), I (OW) am doing nothing wrong, I don't owe BW anything because I wasn't married to her. Classic justification thinking for an OW so as not to take any responsibility for the devastation she was involved in bringing to another human being, to another family. I know you are not an OW and your mom was, but can you see how this looks from the other side? On OW websites, this is a common theme. "I didn't break any vows, BW is not my problem, I don't owe her anything." It takes two, especially to make a baby and it is wrong.

It is not evil because the woman does not want to deal with the OW....who would? But as stated before, if the wife decides to forgive her husband then the act of forgiveness should be shown towards the child, otherwise, if you choose to try and sweep it under the rug, your marriage is a lie (that may hurt, but its the truth).... when you truly learn how to LOVE and forgive a person ...is when you begin to heal...and yes this make take time....

I can see that we agree on many things. I am quite certain most BW know that the OC is not the problem and they are innocent. In a perfect world, families could heal and blend, but we don't live in that world and it is far more complicated in most cases. Saying that a marriage is a lie because OC is not incorporated into a marriage is completely false and unfair. People can forgive, heal, and care about the OC, without having them in their family. It is not always the best option for anyone involved. Including OC.

The big however, though, is that MOST BW don't really get the opportunity to choose what happens with OC. OW and MM choose this as the parents and affairees. The court system defends the "biological" parents rights and the BW's are left out of the loop. The parents (OW & MM) choose what they are doing with OC. The BW has to make her choice of what she is willing to live with, generally after the parents. This is the reality.

BW's have built their lives and families. They deserve to choose how they deal with the situation forced upon them. That may be with OC and it may be without. OW will be choosing for themselves and OC. It is not easy task.

Someday, I fully expect to know OC and she can know my children and her father. I worried about her and agonized about the choice (which ultimately wasn't even mine to make) about C or NC. But I was not considered in the the choices OW and my H made during the affair and their behaviors after the A, and neither was OC. We both will have to make the best of what was set before us.

Hopefully, her mother will find a father for her.......she has selected MM before, maybe she will pick an available man this time.
[/quote]

Girly, you sound reasonable and rational and I am sorry that your childhood didn't go the way you would have liked it. For what it's worth, my father was completely unavailable to me, as well. And my parents were married! I suffer from the same issues you described, plus adding a cheating H and an OC to that. It is unfair all around.

We will likely never agree on all issues with this topic, coming from different angles. But I respect your answers and feelings about it.

Take care.


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Hello All! Have been away from computer for a few days, don't seem to really have the motivation to do anything I enjoy right now. I LOVE Ebay and buy things every week, I haven't even gone to the site in 5 days.

I had a horrible day yesterday-My emotions were out of control!
I would be fine one minute, then crying the next. I really lost it with my H after the kids went to bed last night. I screamed and yelled and cried like a baby. I ended up pounding on his chest and asking Why? wHY? wHY?!!!!!!

We have a pretty large house (3800sq.ft.) so I knew there was no way the kids could hear me, I would never have had an outburst like that if I knew they could hear me.

Actually, he just ended up holding me tight and telling me everything was going to be allright. I really don't see how everything is going to be "allright" if this woman and their child are going to be in my life for (if I stay married)forever.

I know H is trying, he is calling me quite often to see how I am.
The job transfer went through, and this will be his last week working out of town.

We also have an appt, with a very good and reputable marriage counselor in a couple of weeks.

He says he is coming home for me and the kids, but I can't help but wonder if he is also coming home for Ow and OC?

How will I ever be able to trust him again?????

On top of all this I was recently diagnosed with an autoimmune disease, and all this stress has made me very sick. I also need knee surgery due to a fall down a very steep set of stairs at a funeral home a few weeks back.

I actually am feeling better, emotionally and physically today.

The weather is nice and my daughter and I watched a few of our favorite shows today. I can only pray that God will help me through this crisis. I don't want to lose my family over this.

I think I am doing ok having just found out about this 10 days ago. I am just trying to get through each day the best I can. I have to take care of my children.

Hurt


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Sorry girly 7329,

I hope my comments and my decision does not bother you to much ..I understand that someone like you is innocent in this just like my COM and myself.

No child deserves to be dealt these type of negative circumstances before they even come into the world and that is another reason why I have a very low opinion of the OW and my H in my situation.

I guess I am writing you because I often wonder how it feels to be the OC in this situation. Just like how it feels to be the COM that will one day know of the OC and about their Father and the A. I think I wonder so that I can get an idea of what to expect when the next d-day comes ( OC looking for H).

My OW is someone that has always wanted my H and has always tried to make herself available to him and quietly waited playing the friend role until just the right time to offer assistance and be their for H during a bad time in our marriage. She was eager and willing to help him leave me , help with the transition in regards to my oldest son and was making plans to be with H. Furthermore she knew he was married and felt because she did not know me that she could pretend that my kids and I did not exist. She intentionally got pregnant (my H agrees with this and she told me that herself when I addressed her.) She was trying to seal her fate with my H. H did not want that part of the deal but she still chose to bring this child into the world under crazy circumstances. It would have been fine if she would have waited to see if my H and I divorced...then that way she could of had her kid and it would not have been all this craziness to deal with. So for that reason I choose NC with OC and OW because my OW purposely tried to undermine my marriage and will and has tried to use her child to cause further destruction. She has done this by keeping quiet and using my H 's guilt,his need to be responsible, and keeping the OC outcome from me against him by requesting to much money, encouraging visitations with OC- visitations without my knowledge etc... She knew and knows that the bigger the hole my H puts himself the harder it will be for me stay and she is right. I do not forgive her or forgive him and never will but have chosen to stay for other reasons that will serve me and my kids with the hopes that one day my H and I will back on the same page for our kids sake and I know that is a ways off.

Everyone has choices here and the OW made hers ( especially since she knew he was married) and she needs to deal with the consequences of those choices and I hope one day that the OC understands that because we are all (OC, COM and myself) innocent here and we are trying to survive this and I know that I cannot salvage my marriage or my two parent household and raise my kids in a loving peaceful environment by living with the painful reminder that the OC represents because bottom line and please do not take offense but her existence represents lies, betrayal, deceit, selfishness, poor choices blackmail and an affair. One day the OC will know this and if I am ever given the opportunity to talk to her she will know the truth from me about her mom and my H and all the circumstances and the pain it has caused. My H has even admitted that he will never share the kind of bond or love with the OC as much as our COM.

So I ask you... what child should be subjected to that kind of rejection growing up because she would pick up on it? I am human and I have my strengths and weaknesses and limitations and this is my weakness and limitation. She is better off not being around and being around the person that truly wanted her and could love her unconditionally and will accept her wholeheartedly.

So am I trying to sweep it under the rug? I do not think so. I am a woman that thinks about her actions and how they will affect others and does not make selfish decisions for my own personal gain at other peoples expense. I am he woman that would have not slept with a married man especially one with children and would not have brought a child into the world under these circumstances...and believe me if I would have known this was going on before my second arrived ( 2mth ygr than OC) ...do not get me wrong I love my boys but I would have made different decisions. Children should not be subjected to this kind of cruelty. They did not ask to be here and when they are brought into the world they deserve a loving environment and love from a mom and a dad that wanted them and would provide them with a safe environment to grow and develop even before they were born.

and oh yeah H is not far from being off the hook on this one he is paying the ultimate price believe me...

I apologize if my comments offend you but I am being honest with you and myself.

shocked1

Last edited by shocked1; 08/25/08 07:43 PM.

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Girly7329,

I appreciate your reply. Thank you.......no hard feelings, it was all just a big mix-up/misunderstanding. I've been on other boards (NOT related to infidelity!) and the way they were run was a bit different than this one. I got confused. On the other board I was on, a miscarriage support group (Lost twins at 5 months several years ago) People stuck to the subject and only directed their responses to the poster. Here it seems a bit different. I will continue to post. I just need to work out the "kinks"


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Hi LBelle,

I agree with your responses regarding OW /BW and OC...

I hope girly7329 sees that BW's are not cruel... we are just trying to survive and protect our COM and deal with the circumstances forced upon us the best way we know how.

I like this comment the most...this is the OW that I am dealing with. It matches her to a tee. She claims she has taken full responsibility for her actions but shows no regret or remorse and acts as if she does not owe anyone an apology... not me or my kids, probably even the OC...and she thinks she can sweep it under the rug by telling the OC that she is a donor baby that came from a donor family...what reality is the OW living in?

quote:
I noticed you pointed out that the MM was the one who took the vows. This is classic OW thinking, you know. HE took vows, HE broke them (he did), I (OW) am doing nothing wrong, I don't owe BW anything because I wasn't married to her. Classic justification thinking for an OW so as not to take any responsibility for the devastation she was involved in bringing to another human being, to another family. I know you are not an OW and your mom was, but can you see how this looks from the other side? On OW websites, this is a common theme. "I didn't break any vows, BW is not my problem, I don't owe her anything." It takes two, especially to make a baby and it is wrong.

Shocked 1



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Hi Hurtmomof2

YOur quote:

I had a horrible day yesterday-My emotions were out of control!
I would be fine one minute, then crying the next. I really lost it with my H after the kids went to bed last night. I screamed and yelled and cried like a baby. I ended up pounding on his chest and asking Why? wHY? wHY?!!!!!!

We have a pretty large house (3800sq.ft.) so I knew there was no way the kids could hear me, I would never have had an outburst like that if I knew they could hear me.

Actually, he just ended up holding me tight and telling me everything was going to be allright. .

End quote..

I am so sorry that you broke down but it is bound to happen, I was a wreck for a whole a month after the news hit where I had 3 out of control altercations (sp?) with H. I am not a violent person and still can't explain what happened ..it was like I knew what I was doing but I was not doing it...( i think it is called temporary insanity) but after I busted his lip the last time I knew I had to get control of myself and have not touched him since and will not touch him in that manner ever again and discussed these anger outburst with my counselor ..but man thinking back on it... it felt good to let go of some of that anger. The wrong way yes but I cannot deny how good it made me feel. I just can't believe I took on a football player size man the way that I did and he just took it. He even admitted later that I kicked his *** and did not know that I was so strong.

Anyway...there will be very many dark moments while we try to get thru this but it does get better and what did help me was posting on sites like this one and discovering ways to take back my power and control. You may not know how to yet but you will figure it out and when you do you H will notice and will not know what he has gotten himself into. Mine does not ...once you figure it out and use it to your advantage things will change for you. I tell him all the time that you now have two women on either side of you that you can destroy and bring you to your knees if they pounce at the sametime and one of them with the power to save you ( that is me of course) and truth be told if OW ever files for CS she better hope I stay because H will not have a pot to piss in if I go. Everything about his life would change and he is very aware of it now.

I will pray for you to find your power.

shocked 1



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Hi you guys,

Thank you for your replies.. No I am not offended by any comments and again I never meant to offend anyone, however, I did want to give you another perspective...there is absolutely nothing anyone says on the site that is permanent TRUTH... their only opinions backed by the facts of life each one of us has experience.

I guess I am writing you because I often wonder how it feels to be the OC in this situation. Just like how it feels to be the COM that will one day know of the OC and about their Father and the A. I think I wonder so that I can get an idea of what to expect when the next d-day comes ( OC looking for H).

Kids are resilient. They are born with an instict to naturally love, but they are taught how to hate. The truth is my biologically father had 3 older kids before he decided to have an affair with my mom. However, he let his wife and kids know that he had twins on the way, therefore, we were able to spend some time with them as children. After my mom remarried, to break ties with the biological father- I guess he decided he didn't want want to deal with us if he wasn't going to deal with her.. Fast forward 20 something years later, I decided to see my biological father (mind you he only stayed 15 minutes away from the neighborhood I grew up in, I didn't know this), His other kids were ecstatic to see my twin brother and I- I believe this is possible because they were taught to love us in the beginning and they always knew about us. Now on the flip side, I honestly believe, that if they had learned about us in their teenage years, they would have a reason to be bitter with the biological father and us...

Again, I state that kids are some reflection of their parents...if they see mommy or daddy disliking someone or something- they will follow suite and dislike them or that thing too, but if they see mommy or daddy loving someone or something, they will love it too.

Just to add, When my biological father saw my twin brother and I, he wept...and kept apologizing for not being around..This pain ate up at this man... all these years... from what my mom said, he was a well-to-do man, but he looked bad..



Last edited by girly7329; 08/25/08 09:46 PM.
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