GH,

URGENT MESSAGE: Right after you give those bankers in Nigeria your banking information so that they can transfer $20million into your account, you need to believe that this is all your fault.

You were a crappy husband, got that. You are not a crappy husband now, you understand that, I understand that, people her understand that, why can't your W understand that? It is simple as a previous poster said "she doesn't want to understand that, because then she must face her affair and what she has done."

If the job you have been offered is one you would like, enjoy and gain from, take the darned thing. There are planes that fly from country to country and she could take one if she ever really felt like being with you. There are phones and a new fangled thing I have heard about called the internet. All can help one maintain contact. She is doing now with OM, he is coming to see her. So is leaving really the last time you will see her?

NO! it is not IF she really does want to see you. If not, then adios go find a woman that loves you and you love, and then treat her as you have finally learned to treat a woman and a W.

This is a no brainer. You are NOT part of her plans so make your own plans. If she ever decides to face what she has done, and admit that you have changed, THEN she can contact YOU.

THe data is clear.

God Bless,

JL

Hi JL,

I think that the path is abundantly clear. I am going to speak to Steve Harley as soon as possible but I am sure that he will tell me to go back to England in Plan B mode and stay with my family.

W has asked me what my plans for the future are every now and then for the past few months. She has recently been saying "my love life is not a priority for me at the moment. I am just focussed on my work and on studies right now" and "love hurts".

Plan B is essential I think and since I have no job there are other decisions I need to make. We shall see. W's answer to virtually every question (on the rare occasions I ask) is "I don't know".

W's father lives with us and has confronted W also since he knows what's happening with OM visiting Australia. He is disgusted with her. W has apparently told him that "we are working things out" and that "we always manage to work things out" etc.

Will keep you all updated. I would sincerely love to hear from any successful Plan Bers out there.

GH - Is your WW lying about the continued contact with OM or is she telling you she is still in contact with him?

If its the later, I think you are setting a bad precedent by still being "friendly" with her.

GH,

"""we could have been so good together - even now. I wish you hadn't done all of those bad things before".""

She has got to keep you backing up, throwing these jabs and keeping you back on your heels.

I hope you don't mind me saying this, but your WW speaks GIBBERISH!! I'm not sure it's even FOGBABBLE.

"""I like you very much GH31 - you are my bestest friend".""

She is either very addled...OR she is a very calculating and manipulative, cold hearted ________. (you fill in the blank)

""I am grieving my W and our M as it used to be. I am overcome with grief and articulated this to W and she said she is very sad too.""

As long as you are in the same vicinity as your WW and she is spreading this sweet sugar on you and pouring it in your ears, while totally excited about the OM's arrival, you are going to grieve BIG TIME!

I pick Germany or England!!! Germany because the job is there and Oktoberfest will start or is going on already.

kirk

WW and I went out for dinner last night having spent the day at her sister's house. Had some wine and a long conversation about our history, other topics and fun things.

WW said she never regretted getting married to me and that we have shared many great times. She asked me if I told my BIL about OM's supposed visit and I said "yes". WW knows I am disgusted by all of this and said that she feels very guilty for "smashing OM's dream" and that he "knows she came back to Australia because of her husband". WW said she doesn't want contact with him and is concerned about when he comes to Australia and calls her for a coffee. Also said he is moving back to where he was from in Eastern Europe this weekend and that she is so guilty because he was "so good to her" that she is trying to save about a thousand dollars as a Christmas gift for him as "compensation". How depraved is this?

So I have exposed all of this to her father who lives with us and to my BIL. I asked WW about that message she sent to OM's friend on her Facebook account and she babbled "I was just daydreaming".

I think I am meeting most of her ENs otherwise she would not be spending all of this time with me. We spend literally hours every day together which will hopefully make a sudden Plan B all the more earth shattering. I have begun making arrangements for the Plan B to be absolutely pitch black. I am confident that the Plan A couldn't have been any better. We went from email contact only for months to living under the same roof again for 21 weeks and spending hours every day together.

What I am perplexed about is we are really adhering to Gottman's Seven Principles. When we argue there is not much shouting, criticism, contempt etc and if there is, we are able to repair the damage and to laugh/smile about it afterwards. We "turn toward" and accept influence from each other. We have all the foundations of a great M apart from this OM and her resolute refusal to end contact with him.

But there is nothing I can do about her behaviour.

I am eager to speak to the Harleys as soon as possible and in one way I am hopeful that they will ask me to do Plan B immediately. I am calling my parents and sister daily so that I can remember what normal life is like. This has been going on for so long that I am beginning to forget that.

OK,

I have done something that some of you advised me to do a while ago, but have omitted to until now.

OM put the pictures of W back on his Flickr account so I called him. I was polite, firm and succinct and we spoke for about 90 minutes. It turns out that my W has been completely deceiving both me and him for the last 9 months. He has also been absolutely shafted throughout this entire episode and from the very beginning and hurt many times. He said he would remove the pictures which he has done but W is still listed as one of his contacts.

WW has told him that we are separated but I told him the truth - i.e. that other than living in separate rooms (which my WW is doing I am sure to justify her behaviour) we have had a full sexual relationship ever since she got back, have been doing everything together like funerals, weddings etc, shopping, paying bills together - the lot. I even told him that she has been trying on her wedding ring again.

The little worm was apologizing to me profusely and begging for forgiveness - and really afraid that I would harm him because I know where he lives.

It turns out he is not moving to Eastern Europe at all but is staying in the UK - this is a massive deception that my W has spun me.

It's strange. I am beginning to forget what normal felt like but I want it back. W will either agree to my terms for reconciling or I will divorce her. I really don't care any more. OM was saying things that everyone else has been telling me about my W - that she is weird, has some real issues, potential personality disorder etc, is dishonest, selfish etc. He was telling me about when WW left him - just packed all of her things and left without saying goodbye when he was at work. She did that to him twice. OM said that WW had planned to book a hotel for three nights when he comes to Sydney etc but that that won't happen now etc.. What on Earth am I supposed to do about this?

Since I am being told these things by a lot of people I am beginning to believe that it is true about my WW and that I don't want to be married to someone like that.

Maybe it goes against MB/Plan Aing to do this but I am past caring. I will eventually prevail no matter what and will not be deceived, manipulated and lied to like this.

I have not told WW that I spoke to OM. I am very anxious to speak to Steve Harley so that I know what to do with this information. I imagine he will tell me to expose but am unsure.

Just an update for you all.

GH31,

""that she is weird, has some real issues, potential personality disorder etc, is dishonest, selfish etc.""

Walking like a duck, looking like a duck, quacking like a duck, etc.

Like you said, you are so close to her, being with her all the time and used to the wackyness, that you are accustomed to it, thinking it "normal".

These folks can stand back, looking at the big picture and seeing what really is there.

Did you ever see "Play Misty for Me"? (long time ago, with Clint Eastwood, when he was a youngster.) Watch your back.

Sounds like she is in her own little fantasy world. And maybe being a little manipulative, yes?

Good luck.

kirk

Dude,

""I have not told WW that I spoke to OM. I am very anxious to speak to Steve Harley so that I know what to do with this information.""

I would hold those cards very close to my vest. No need to tell her, but now you will see her in a different light and hear her gibberish for what it is.

And your pain should diminish, as you realize what you are dealing with.

kirk

Spoke with Steve Harley last night,

We have put a plan together for persuading WW to talk to him. I am to try around 3 times to do this, otherwise we will go to Plan B.

I explained to her today gently and without LBs that I had spoken to OM. I asked her not to meet him when he comes to Sydney at the end of November saying it would be deeply traumatizing for me (as directed by Steve). She said things like "I understand" and "I don't want to hurt you GH31" but that was about it. I informed her that the fact she had lied to me and deceived me again was deeply hurtful and added "I don't find you objectionable WW, it's what you're doing that I find objectionable".

She said things today like "I don't know if I can feel loving towards you GH31" and "why couldn't you have done all these wonderful things before?". Very sad but, I know I have to take a stand pretty soon.

It is very important because this deception and psychological abuse cannot continue.

Wayward wives are so sick and deprived. I hate reading stories like yours.

How women can become so evil to those they claimed to love is beyond me.

Sorry. Had to get that out, but your story is sad and I hurt for you and understand your pain having once been in your shoes and been lied to like you are being lied to.

I too had a talk with OM (multiple ones) and heard the double talk and lies they were fed as well.

Absolutely sick.

If you have no kids, then kick her to the curb and find a woman who is healthy and has her head screwed on straight.

I travelled to work yesterday with W and went through my conversation with OM. She wasn't happy that I called him when I said I would not; I replied that W had promised not to lie to me anymore and had broken that promise, so I had to get the truth.

I informed W that her actions are deeply hurtful and traumatizing and asked her not to book hotel with OM when he visits next month.

Anyway, last night W did not come home. She didn't tell me or her dad that she was staying out - and then I received this SMS this morning:

I won't be home tonight either. Please don't cook any dinner for me. I will be back late tomorrow

For me this is the last straw. I will move out next week and hand her what Dr. Harley would call a "Plan B letter" and have no contact with her whatsoever. I will change my number and deactivate my email accounts so she cannot reach me, and I will specify the conditions that I require for the marriage to be restored. I love what we had together, but this situation cannot continue.

I called W at work and she told me that she had just wanted "time to herself" to get a breather from "the situation". I joked about OM being in town already but of course, she denied it. I am meeting her for lunch today and will not bring up anything "heavy". She said she wanted to meet me for lunch as long as I was "pleasant". I want her last memories of me to be great - then she will either do whatever it takes to restore trust, love and friendship or we will never see or communicate with each other again.

I know this will be gut-wrenching but it must be done. I will not sit around at home having dogsh1t wiped on me any more. My father in England wants me to go over there and stay, and I am very tempted to do just this. I have also been offered a job in Munich which I would like to start soon. WW will have tremendous difficulty getting to me there but if she does then at least I know she is serious.

I have been at this for nine months and endured some searing psychological abuse. I feel satisfied that I have done everything I can so far to save my marriage.

GH31,

""For me this is the last straw. I will move out next week and hand her what Dr. Harley would call a "Plan B letter" and have no contact with her whatsoever.""

Talk is cheap, my brother!!

Make sure you do it and follow through with it.

Stay strong and focused. Plan B is so much about taking care of yourself and getting healthy and back on that even keel, with no more of the toxic drama.

So make sure you do what you say....we will be watching

kirk

Well this is just marvellous,

Just as I get psyched up for Plan B, WW's father mentions something to her that I am thinking about moving out (I had mentioned it in passing when WW didn't come home one night without telling us).

Now she is being nice to me, taking me to the movies and we had passionate SF yesterday afternoon. She said it would be "very sad" if I were to go. She even said that it would be good if we could "fall in love" again and that she would look at the LB and EN questionnaires. She went to babysit for SIL's two young sons (2 and 3¾) at the weekend and my 2 year old nephew asked where I was. WW was "touched" by the fact that our little nephew asked after me. I was surfing.

I mentioned nothing to her about moving out but asked her about the impending visit of OM. She said she is trying her hardest not to think about it and didn't want me to bring it up (i.e. hoping that I just forget about it - or that the "problem" will go away by itself). WW said something utterly deranged about "not wanting to mess up his holiday".

WW cried during SF and when I helped her with some written work yesterday made her laugh a lot. Then today she has her monthly cycle for the first time in five months since she has been so knotted up in "stress", and she attributes this to the laughter and emotion being let out. She is incredibly private and quiet and doesn't open up to anyone hardly. She has a real tendency to avoid conflict at all costs and to bottle up emotions.

I am going to speak to Dr. Harley again ASAP and get advice on the implementation of Plan B. I will stall Plan B if WW agrees to talk to him.

Get her to agree to a trip just the two of you during the time he is in Aussy?

GH,

You said
Of course she has and is this way, it is who she keeps all of her lies from being discovered. You are being played my friend, and you want to know how I KNOW?

when she heard you might leave, she changed. She KNOWS you are weak in spirit and resolution. Your own behavior in the past has shown that, and she has used it. It would be a "shame" for you to leave because it would inconvenience her. It would be a "shame" for you to leave because then she couldn't "play" with OM behind your back, which is sOOOOO much fun.

She is in an affair, and like all adulterers, she is lying to you and every one else. If all it takes is good sex, then you should marry a PRO. My guess is that you expect a bit more from your W.

Please think about this.

God Bless,

JL

""WW cried during SF''

Gosh, so sorry to hear that...I guess.

Hey Flynny,


That's a very good idea and I have already suggested it to her. She is talking about us going to Queensland next month to do some volunteer work together.

JL, thanks for posting


She has always been very closed in but is even more so now. She does have a difficulty beguiling me however, as I always uncover dishonesty.

In the past I haven't been as strong as I should have been except when I flew back to Australia and went completely dark on her. This made her "crack" but I was not resolute enough in the things I expected from her.

Basically, I am so disgusted with her right now that I have my Plan B preparation in progress. She has agreed to go over the LB and EN questionnaires and I am getting another appointment with Dr. Harley.

If she does not speak to him then Plan B will be executed on 10/27/2008. I will move everything out of the apartment whilst she is at work and leave my PBL in her room. I will also mail letters to my in-laws explaining why I have made this decision. Then, all my phone numbers and email addresses will be deactivated and my dad in England will be my intermediary.

Thanks for your posts guys.

GH31

WW took a brief look at LB questionnaire the other night and said after a few minutes "I don't want to do this self help stuff" and that was that.

OK.

I am setting up an appointment with Steve Harley this week and if she won't talk to him, Plan B it is. I have priced up removals and storage costs and have been looking at rooms for rent. I now need to decide whether to stay here in Australia or take a job in Germany that I have been offered.

WW said yesterday she is still "processing her emotions", that she "doesn't know what she's doing at the moment" and is "still debating" whether to see OM in late November. If it's a matter of debate then that tells me what I need to know.

WW has agreed that the ideal scenario is if we fall in love with each other again.

In a rage yesterday I got WW to delete about 100 pictures of OM from our laptop computer which she did. Then she asked me to leave the computer alone - of course this meant she was hiding something so I found another 77 images on there and deleted them myself. WW got all sad and said "I don't want to talk about it" which lasted about ½ an hour. I will not be disrespected like this. I know it's not very "Plan A" but I am past caring.

I have been following your thread and I am amazed at how your wife gaslights and blameshifts. I have followed infidelity threads for years and have never seen such a manic case of denial and entitlement. She is cake eating to the max.
You will be plan B'ing on the 27th. I have no doubt about it. I would not give in to her manipulation when she realizes what is about to happen Monday.

I agree with you. This stops when you says it does. She has made a bed cushioned with thistles and thorns. It's time for her to lay in it.