You know what? WWs are sometimes so devious that they bribe/threaten their own children ...

"Let's not tell Daddy our secret. If Daddy knew OM was here and took us all out for dinner Daddy would cry. It will only hurt Daddy to tell him. Let's keep this our special secret. Now let's go to the mall and buy you that game you want."

She will eventually go against your wishes and introduce your child to OM. It is guaranteed. In the wayward fog mind - their adultery is so special that children won't be harmed by it.

Waywards suck at parenting. All of 'em! You wife is not different.

I am listening Mel, just thought WW actually seeing what she was missing and going back to her sad lonely life might have woken her up but I will take notice of what you said and make other arrangements

Thanks Pepperband,
I have been thinking about this a lot, trying to think of some alternative arrangements.
My DD is 13 and don't think she would lie.
I have told WW that the first time DD comes in to contact with OM, I will stop her picking DD up from school and get my parents to do it when I am not able to

thanks braeworth, you give me hope. Believe me, your wife KNOWS what she will be missing because she has been in your home on Christmas many times. Let her sit home alone and think about it without giving her this OUT to assuage her guilt over abandoning her family. I want her to think; "MY GOD, THIS IS THE FIRST CHRISTMAS I HAVE EVER SPENT WITHOUT MY CHILD.. FOR WHAT? FOR WHAT? MY GOD, WHAT HAVE I DONE?"

That is how you want her thinking. If you allow her to come over she won't be able to say that to herself. She will say: "well it wasn't so bad after all! I got to spend Christmas morning with my DD anyway."

The former version is lethal to the affair because now she will start taking a second look at the eenormous sacrifice she made for her filthy affair. She gave up her own daughter on Christmas for THIS! This is how conflict is caused in an affair because she will raise the bar on the OM and feel ENTITLED to more because of the enormous sacrifice she made for him. But he won't be able to ever meet that standard because he is a thoughtless, shallow, selfish man.

Oh stop with that. Of course she would lie if your wife influenced her.

Do you know we have cases on this forum where a sexual predator began an affair with a married woman so he could get to her teenage DD? And the WW unwittingly was conned into bringing the young DD into her affair so she could get used to her "new father."

You have to remember that your wife does not see the OM as a danger at all. She is not concerned at all about them getting to know each other. She is in love with him and it is in her best interest to persuade your DD to ACCEPT the affair. Waywards do this all the time; they use their children to "normalize" their affairs. Your W and the OM can do whatever they want. There is no one there to stop them.

You are crazy if you don't understand that your DD could be persuaded to lie in order to protect her mother. She has been abandoned by her mother so she is likely to do what it takes to keep her mothers love.

Even so, there is nothing stopping the OM from coming home when he chooses. Who is going to stop him? You?

Mel,
I have been trying to come up with alternatives but without any real success, WW could bring DD to our home but that gives her her "FIX" as you describe it. WW needs to pick up DD from school 2 or 3 days a week depending on my work schedule

oh, I didn't realize your wife was a child who could not figure things out on her own..... Thank goodness she has Big Poppa Daddy to do her thinking for her!

brwaeworth, why can't your wife drop her off at her home?

Mel,
She could drop her off at home but somedays that would mean DD being on her own for up to 3 hours until I get home from work

Let me seee.... being alone or being exposed to her mothers filthy affair and her scumbag boyfriend... hard to decide, hard to decide......... hmmmmmmm

good grief, braeworth!! Are you kidding me? Make a list of chores for her in addition to doing her homework! She is a teenager, for crying out loud! She is old enough to do babysitting jobs, she is old enough to stay by herself for 3 hours!

If she is too immature to be alone, then hire a senior in high school to come stay with her and help her do her homework. Anything is preferable to her being dragged into your wife's sleazy affair.

Brae

Plan B is hard. Its hard practically and it is counter-intuitive for most.

if you can't nail down a BLACK, no -excuses plan B then go for an aggressive plan D right now.

it will save you the most heartache AND it will give your M the best chance of recovery.

Plan B needs executing in all its facets. Imagine building a car Brae : if you only attach three wheels is it 75% as effective as one with all four wheels fitted? No its ZERO percent effective.

Plan B with some holes because its too hard to arrange some practical parts is a gesture : zero percent effective.

Nail down this plan B with Mels expertise Brae, or drive a hard divorce asap, D4MN the torpedoes. I would save you and your kids more heartache.

I love that analogy about Plan B, Bob! That is exactly my own observation about Plan B. A half assed Plan B is worse than no plan B at all.

Bob, Mel,
Thanks again, you are right Bob, it is difficult practically but I will get on top of things, just may take me a little while to get a complete handle on some of this stuff.

Mel, you are good at this, still thinking things through. It is dark in the UK at 4 pm in the winter and I am still not too happy with DD coming in to a dark house on her own for 3 hours some nights, but there are ways round it and I will work something out

See Brae - you are incapable of Plan B - your every post screams that.

You SHOULD treat plan B as if you are already divorced. Maintain pitch dark utter NC.

I totall agree with what Bob and Mel have posted to you. STOP bleating and making excuses and just DO IT.

Brae,

The majority of this thread is everyone convincing and re-convincing you to do a dark plan B.to help you save your M. We are CERTAIN that a DARK PLAN B is the ONLY tool you have left.

You need to stop second guessing everyone's advice! We have been there and know what we're talking about. We know its not easy, but now is the time to either sh*t or get off the can! You didn't do this SHE DID!

Please Brae I really don't want to see another post unless you're going to do this properly.

BigK, BP, MFIL, Mel.
Thanks for all your input. I understand that Plan B is to protect my love for WW and stop meeting her EN's that I am meeting. I am having no direct contact with WW and am being dark.
I also see the benefits of making life as uncomfortable as possible for WW, but maybe this is the bit I hadn't fully thought through before going to Plan B. I can and am doing a dark Plan B, it is the other stuff I need to sort out.
I do appreciate everybodies help

All quiet on the Brae front today.
Feeling down today, I am trying to lift myself but not having a good day really.
Wondering where and how this will all end. I wish I had a crystal ball

Hi Brae,

It's day 2 of Plan B for me. I did speak with him yesterday morning and emailed the PBL at 10:30am, so technically, maybe today is day 1. Confused?

It's just my feeble attempt at weak humour to let you know it sucks and you're not alone!

Nothing about this is fair on the BS but we have to stay strong and keep within your PBL boundaries. If the WS returns they have to know that we mean business and will not accept the scraps that we have been given in the past.

Stick it out Brae. You've got some great support.

Plan something fun to do with your daughter. You create the crystal ball for your life. Don't rely on the WS for anything. They are not with us now so plan around it and focus on you.

I am making Christmas decorations with the kids, sending the cards, going to carols by candlelight, organising my birthday dinner for next week, cleaning and dying for an opportunity for a good soak in the spa bath.

brae, consequences are usually uncomfortable; that is what motivates us to CHANGE. You feel obliged to protect her from the consequences of her choices, which will only serve her AFFAIR. Protecting her will harm you and DD.

2M2L,
Thanks, I am keeping busy and I know what ever happens I will be OK. Some days I have quite enjoyed my own space and just chilling out but yesterday was a bad day, very down. Feel not too bad this morning.

Mel,
I don't want to protect WW from consequences of her actions, I probably just had not given enough thought to that part of Plan B. I have gone dark to stop her draining my LB and stopped meeting her EN's but had not thought about the other things, you have been a great help and given me some good ideas.