Thanks, everyone. I'm feeling better today, but I thought long and hard about some of the things WH said to me and about my own behavior last night.
Here are some of what I took out of it:
I was LBing all over the place and what I do is guilt-trip, blame and get very emotional. Now, granted, it is the kind of situation where he should feel guilty, be blamed and I'm going to cry. The problem is its not productive right now.

I took to heart what he said about the kids knowing too much. I do believe kids should know the facts and its ok to share some of my feelings, but in my pain and frustration, I probably shared more with them (or let them overhear) than is helpful to them or me. I need to step back more and let them work out how they feel about their dad with him and only be a support to them on the issue.

I know that I cannot agree to a divorce or mediation at this time because I am not strong enough to handle the process. If he pushes the D, I'll do the best I can, but I think last night was an affirmation of what I can and cannot do right now. I am not ready to dissect 13 years of M in a productive way.

I do agree I need to go back to Plan B, but not to recover the M, but for me to really heal. I think I need to not only set some boundaries for myself, but also some guidelines for how I am going to behave. I do not want to be bitter, angry, hysterical or any of those things. I do not want his actions to have such a powerful control over me. So its back to B, but with, hopefully, a real focus on me and the kids.

I have to answer the question: what kind of person do I want to be even if I am betrayed by someone I love.

I'm going to send an "ammendment" to Plan B, so he is clear where I am, without me going into all the emotional stuff.
I'll post it here when I get it done for feedback. I know that is unusual, but knowing my WH, he needs to know that I got what he was trying to say last night and that there was even some truth there for me.
BF439

Hi bf,

I'm sorry to hear that you are in pain! (((((((bf)))))))

Plan B is so great for this! It really is astonishing how much it helps, but it's true!

A Plan B "amendment" sounds like a really good idea, IMHO.

Charlotte

Ok, here's my draft ammendment, y'all:

Dear WH,
Last night made me realize a couple of things that I need to share with you.

First of all, I realized that having no direct contact with you is best for me at this time. There are many things that I need to continue working on in myself that I was not proud to see surface last night. Those behaviors are not your fault, but my pain is just too raw for me to manage those well right now. So I will continue to send communication via the IM until I am ready to talk with you again in a more productive way. If during that time you decide to end all contact with OW I would be also willing to talk to you at that time as I had previously stated.

Secondly, I need time to heal from the betrayal of the affair before I can begin to "move on". That will simply take time and it is my timetable to set.

Also, you have some valid points about the children. I respect your request and I will do a better job protecting the children from the hurtful details of this situation.
I also want to apologize if I said anything hurtful about your parents. They have been wonderful to me and I do appreciate their support.

Finally, what I realized from last night is that I am not ready to sit down with mediators. I am just not emotionally ready and I want to get stronger, as you asked of me last night, before I sit down with anyone to decide what to do. I think it would just not be productive at this time.

Please let me know, via the IM, if you would like to request any changes re: the children or finances.

Love you always,
BF439

Feedback?

BF, I'll sleep on this and get back to you but my initial reaction is that you are being too hard on yourself. You have a right to be angry, to pass the guilt on to him and even to lean on your children a little bit. You aren't perfect but you never claimed to be. Yes, your M could be improved as could 99.9% of M's but you didn't choose to go outside your M to sort it out.

Personally I think I'd be more neutral in the note and say that you have been deeply hurt and you need time and space to recover. You'd appreciate it if he could give you that for a while. You have still not lost hope that he may realise that the best solution is for him to be in love with the mother of his children (I robbed this phrase from Steve Harley) and if he breaks all contact with the OW then you still have confidence this could be achieved.

I hate to hear how your confidence has been shaken. Believe in yourself. I think you are right about Plan B helping you to feel better about yourself.

Hugs,

Tully

It's a good letter, IMO.

You stated the facts in a very reasonable way. It isn't overly emotional, either. I don't think there's anything wrong with it but that's just me.

It conveys how everything is making YOU feel. That's important.

Charlotte

Thanks, Charlotte. I think I'll send it as is. Tully, I feel like I have to walk a fine line here, because his family is his biggest supporter and are very much of the mind that we must get along for the children, but they also want me to heal. I hope this letter balances that since he does listen to them.
BF439

bf,

I'm sorry you had to go through that pain, but it seems to have clarified your focus toward healing YOURSELF, becoming stronger YOURSELF, regardless of what your WH does.

You've come so far--don't let this rattle you. Clearly WH is NOT yet safe for you to be around. Of COURSE your anger and pain are right below the surface, and while love busting is never a good idea, at least WH has no misconceptions about how you're feeling. I think ALL BSs vent their spleen on their WSs for the incredible injustice done to them and their children. Be gentle with yourself here.

And if it's any comfort to you, I'll say that in the months after D-Day, I let my WH have it but good, on more than one occasion. I doubt it penetrated at the time, but I just couldn't hold it in. And nothing I said came close to the cruelty of the things he said and did.

No point being human if we don't act the part...

Hugs to you, and prayers for strength and hope in the New Year.

Right Here Waiting

"I respect your request and I will do a better job protecting the children from the hurtful details of this situation."

WH having an affair and wants you to lie to your COM, children of the marriage?

Your COM deserve the truth.

Hi BF! Christmas brings out the best and worst in situations like this. Usually children are overly spoilt to cushion them from reality and the BS and WS go into meltdown, unable to cope with reality.

Breaking plan B is always close to the surface when your children have such close contact (I know), but your actions now will be what really counts.

Get back on the wagon and rediscover yourself. Christmas is over now and pretty soon we will have a new year to celebrate with a clean slate for 2009.

Your WS is deeply in the fog and you cannot believe what he says and please don't try to understand it or make any sense of it. You are only making it more painful for you.

Go back into the darkenss of plan B and enjoy the holidays with your kids and pug and book in another massage!

Much love,
2M2L

"I respect your request and I will do a better job protecting the children from the hurtful details of this situation."

I would change this to:

I respect your request, and I will not say disrespectful things about you in front of the children. However, if they ask me a question about what you have done, I will not lie for you.

I agree with you, the Road, and ironically, I think WH would too, except he disagrees with me on two points:
What should children hear (yes, they know about the affair, but that's all they should know! They shouldn't know that WH has continued to lie and reconstruct, and to know my opinion of the kind of woman that sleeps with a married man for MONTHS, is just not appropriate)!
And why we are not currently together -- per my WH it is because he has not been in love with me for years and did not fully realize it until he had the affair, but the affair is not the reason he left me. Make sense?

So, I am willing to "soften" some of what I say, because truly I have said some things in anger and pain, that I would have worded differently.

Another random point: saw WH yesterday when he came to pick up the kids (through LR window) and was amazed at how BAD he looked! Bad hair, drawn face, huge bags under his eyes and I thought, (and yes, this is shallow) THIS is what I am fighting for? A 40-year old adulterer who looks like HELL, has a history of lying and being withdrawn? I am a vibrant woman with, yes, three kids, but I look 10 years younger, can cook ANYTHING, have my master's degree, can grow anything and am an absolute delight to be around (when I'm not crying uncontrollably)!
What happened?
I know I still love him, because even with that realization I can't give up; but I know I don't need him right now AS HE IS. I don't want the old marriage back, but I do hope for something better; and DAMMIT, I am worth it! I think I had this romantic picture in my head about my handsome husband who could win the heart of a younger woman, but that is not him right now, either!
If I'm wrong about that, maybe I'm wrong about me being the "loser" here!

That's all for now -- still hanging in there!!
BF439

Here's my WH's response to my Plan B addendum that Charlotte forwarded. I'm glad she did, although I know she struggled with it, because it does help to hear some of his remorse. What I get stuck on, though, is his insistence that he's got to plan for the next step (i.e. mediators and divorce). He says he's not seeing her, he just doesn't want me.
Anyway, let me know what your thoughts are. Thanks, all!!

BF439,

I'm so sorry for additional pain I know I either directly caused or surfaced for you from our conversation Friday night-very sorry. I wasn't proud of my behavior either.

I also appreciate your thoughts about the kids-I know I have caused the harm and am working to change things in my power to promote healing as well.

I respect your need for more time to heal from the terrible things I've done. I really do. But also need you to know I can't remain like this indefinitely and will need to talk about next steps sometime soon so we can start the process.

In the meantime, I'll keep communicating things regarding the kids and finances through the IM.

Love,
WH

Veterans -- any insights here? Should I get a lawyer and just give up?

BF439

bf,

Do you WANT to give up? Doesn't sound like it to me, but correct me if I'm wrong. FWIW, I don't think it's the end of the line with you. If he REALLY wants a guilt-free divorce, why isn't he filing himself? Huh?

IS he done with OW? If not, it's affair babble and I would continue as you were. If he is done with her, understand that he has talked himself OUT of love with you, partly because of whatever was draining your love banks before the affair, but ALSO to justify the affair. If he's done with OW, it doesn't follow that he will immediately fall BACK in love with YOU. You did an excellent Plan A, though, which will serve you well if the A is over.

You must know whether or not it IS over. I'm guessing it's not, and that's what's keeping him foggy. It's been nearly a year now, and you've been through so much. Plan B has given you some respite--don't let him talk you into divorce. Let him do it if he wants. He doesn't need YOU to file!

RHW

I see that he is a little bit remorseful...a little bit.

But he still wants his cake.

so, I haven't posted for a few days-- I had minor surgery, but still recovering. WH dropped off flowers and through DS11, and I hated to make DS have to walk back out with them, so I just kept them. He directly contacted me the other day about some money issue that I thought was an emergecy--of course it wasn't. I don't know what that's all about, but I guess it's more of his need to be seen as an OK guy.

I've been thinking some about his reluctance to let OW go completely and I was struck by the comments on tully's post. I think that description fits my WH, too. There's a lot of pride there, both proffesionally and personally. That's part of why I question whether his fog will ever lift.

Karmarose, what do you mean about cake-eating? Wouldn't that mean I'm meeting some his needs? Does it seem like I am?

RHW, I'm not done, but I feel like I'm the only one who has hope. I feel like others know WH so well and they know my marriage is done, but for some reason I don't seem to get what every knows...

Hi bf

I just caught up on your thread and thought I'd add my "interpretation" of your WH's response-



I don't really think that I've hurt you so I'll just say "additional" pain because then I don't have to lump it with any of the other pain I've caused, and I'll add "or surfaced for you" because it really isn't my fault-it's yours.



I want to sound like I'm a good dad. Notice, I haven't said what the harm is I caused, or what I am doing to that is "working to change things" but I did put in "in my power" so that I can blame you for it not working because that would be out of "my power"...


I said I respect your need for time to heal... but I don't really mean it which you can tell from my next statement about what I need. "I can't remain like this" really means I want you to be the one who makes the next move or "next step". That way, I won't be the bad guy.



See, I'm not really a horrible guy. I'm doing what you wanted, even if I am trying to dump everything on you, not own up to what I did, and trying to make you divorce me so I can be off the hook. Just to show you that, I'm going to add

"Love" to the end of this email.

That's my take on it. Add to that the flowers, using DD11 as a courrier, and NOT using the IM's with an incidental money situation-he's still very wayward, still trying to be a "good guy" and not owning anything. Foggy, typical wayward.

Don't make this easy for him. If he really wants to end your M, make him DO IT-and he doesn't want to, he wants you to. You are fighting for your M. Stick with Plan B.

BF, I came here to tell you that I think we may have a dog but I see you've had your share of drama these days.

I say stick with Plan B staying as dark as you can. Be strong, he will feel that. If he wants a D let him file for one. For the moment your heart is not ready to give up so hang in there. don't let him get to you.

I'll give you an update on our dog later, I hope your own is settling in well. Is he a comfort to the children?

johnstwin, your post was hugely helpful to me! I think I have completely missed how much WH has apologized for the "hurt" but not for what he's actually done. He justfies so much, but he sounds rational until you really look at what he's saying. There is no real remorse there and he is currently getting just what he wanted-- to be part-time single dad.
Apparently he sent my mom a b-day card with the same kind of non-apology apology in it.
I don't know if he'll ever come out of that, but that is reason enough to keep my distance. Truly, just this week I feel more positive about my future. If he stays anywhere near where he is, I don't want him in my life!

Tully, thanks for checking in-- did you get your dog?
BF439

Hi BF, we are going to pick up our dog on Monday. She is lovely. She's not a puppy, she's 1 year old but she's already house-trained so that's a bit of a relief for me at the moment as life is fairly jam-packed. She is a cross breed, cocker spaniel and border collie and she is all black with a patch of white on her chest. DD11 is mad keen to take her now but we're going to my sister's for the weekend so we'll get her when we get back. It will do us good to have a bit of fun and affection in our lives.

Good luck to you. You sound as though you are becoming more sure and determined about what it is you want and don't want in your life and your M.

Except for feeling miserable from the surgery, I have been feeling wonderfully free from the cra*p I've had to deal with these past 6-7 months.
Two complaints, though, that send me backwards:
WH taking kids to a fun museum tomorrow (one I wanted to take the kids to last spring, but he couldn't be bothered -- he had to see his girlfriend) and the whole issue of him having all this fun time with them meanwhile I'm here rearing them and trying to take care of this house.
Secondly his last email to DD13 on the night of my last (hopefully) meltdown:

Dear DD13-

I'm sorry I got upset when you asked me if I had contact with or was still seeing OW. I am not seeing her or anyone else. I have had some contact with her as I have with other friends that i care about and, as I've said as well, having any contact with her has nothing to do with what's going on for me with regard to mom. It's all very complicated and goes way back for me (years). I'm sorry, so sorry that this has been so painful and hurtful-more than words can EVER express. I love you so much and DS11 and DD4 and, yes your mom, and never wanted to hurt anyone. And just because I don't want to be with your mom doesn't mean I don't miss you-every moment and want to be with you.

i just hope someday you'll forgive me and see that i still love and care for you so much."

This is the kind of stuff that just kills me. He'll say (and did say that night), that yes, maybe we should have gone to MC earlier, but then he'll say these kind of things about this going on for years, the affair having nothing to do with it,etc.
And then, to top it all off, he has the nerve to say he is contact with her like he would be with any other friend. Any other friend??? How many more does he have that he slept with?
I'm just disgusted on so many levels for what comes out of his mouth and how he gets exactly what he wants and I still feel like I'm holding the bag......
BF439