True. But that doesnt mean that a live in relationship is the same as a marriage. A marriage is a whole different ball of wax! With its own challenges.

But it also has assets that a single relationship can never have. The MB principles here harness those assets to create a great marriage.

So, yes. You can have a loving relationship. But, it will never be truly committed. As Melody stated.

Rude? Angry? Of course I'm angry. If you'd been paying any attention to what you've been reading, you'd know many of us have good reason to be very angry. Sad and depressed, too.

Your live in boyfriend (emphasis on the 'boy') is almost certainly cheating on you, or looking to.

You already know this, or you wouldn't spend any of your spare time reading this message board.

You can kill the messenger if you want to. Bury your head in the sand if you wish.

I'm trying to help you. If I had given all of my facts to these people during my wife's affair and listened to the feedback, I probably could have stopped it sooner, or prevented it altogether. At the very least, I'd be that much farther down the road to recovery, if I ever get there at all.

I let other, more patient folks talk about Plan A, Plan B, etc. I try to help others bust their cheating partners when I can.

I've been here for awhile now, and not ONE SINGLE TIME have I EVER seen a "Whew! He wasn't cheating, after all!" topic. Not one.

I'm sure your honey-bunny is the unique exception to the rule.

Just ignore the mean man on the internet.

We're not angry; we simply don't agree with your position that your live-in arrangement is as committed as our marriages, so you consider us rude? Are we not as entitled to our opinion as you are?

Those of us here, who have publicly committed, solemn vows and all, to "love, honor and cherish, as long as we both shall live" have dealt with the horror of infidelity. What we have, that you lack, is the legal, moral and social support systems that helped many of our wayward spouses see the error or their ways. Those things helped them find their way back and re-commit to those vows. Maybe it was initially no more than the shocking realization that they would be bound legally to support their betrayed wives (and children) that woke them up, or the ostracization from children, inlaws and friends, but those realities made walking away a lot harder than an "understanding" between two free agents. Made them see that what they had together was going to be financially, socially and morally very expensive to throw away.

If my FWH and I had not been married, I know for sure we would not be together after his painful infidelity. We had a legal as well as a moral commitment to each other, an otherwise strong family and strong social support. All that stuff matters. You don't seem to think so, but what will you rely on to bring your partner back to the relationship you used to share?

I think the "rude" comment was directed mostly at me.

People hate it when you give them a truth they're not ready to hear.

And I'm VERY angry.

Please remember this is a public forum and some posts you might find offensive. But there is help here that you can use, so allow your skin to thicken so you don't miss out on some gems that can help you in your situation.

My advice, which is the same as my opinion, is that you should start by snooping. His story smacks of independent thinking; ie, self entitlement. Very dangerous for any relationship.

Start with checking all his e-mails, his texting and search your credit card receipts for clues. Purchase and install a key-logger if you don't have his password to the computer. Check his car for receipts, cell phones, evidence of any kind. Fast food debris? For one or two? Hair not your color or length on the passenger seat or back seat? Time not accounted for? Working late? Buying or acquiring new music not normally his style? New cologne? Joining a gym, or going more often?

There are many clues we all saw in retrospect. Affairs have happened to many folks who showed up here who had "perfect relationships", married or otherwise...

rightherewaiting,
You stated, "If my FWH and I had not been married, I know for sure we would not be together after his painful infidelity. We had a legal as well as a moral commitment to each other, an otherwise strong family and strong social support. All that stuff matters. You don't seem to think so, but what will you rely on to bring your partner back to the relationship you used to share? "

If the reason my husband were to stay with me and work on the relationship was because of the money it would cost him to support the wife and child was too much, fine that is one thing that you needed. I don't have that situation so that is not an issue.

You ask me what will I rely on to bring my partner back to the relationship that we share? I would hope that "Me" is enough. or I would hope the love that we have shared over the years and friendship. If he had to stay because of a paper or court order tells him he has to pay my living expenses so he can't afford to leave... I really don't want him then.

You are of course, correct. For all anyone knows the strength of your relationship may far surpass the majority of married ones. You have 50 years of experience and maturity under your belt and that counts for a great deal. The relationship commitment that you share with your partner gains its strength from the efforts that you each put in. No one here should challenge your love and compassion on the pure basis of whether you are married or not. On the other hand, marriage becomes the contract that reinforces the love and commitment you profess and extends it from a promise of today into a warranty that lasts a lifetime.

There is something else I noticed that you may wish to review.


That statement by him requires a much closer examination. I wonder if it means much more than is initially apparent.

Mr. G

Yeah, every betrayed spouse on this board hoped that "me" would be enough to keep their spouse faithful.

You should've already dumped the guy for trying to coerce you into group sex, even if he isn't cheating, which he is.

Shattered dreams,
Maybe I will snoop but that would kill our trust if he found out and as I stated, I really don't think he is cheating on me. I asked him out right and he has never lied to me before in all these years.

Mr. Goodstuff,
You are right about that, I do worry about the last two months as we had a very active sex life before. Maybe it is age or boredome with the same old thing but it just doesn't add up sometimes.

Maybe I will start looking around..
thank you all,
mbaby

Of course he has. No human has ever gone that long without lying. Ever.

Snooping wouldn't kill your trust if he's a reasonable person, and you told him that you were concerned about your relationship.


He is tired of the same old thing. You. No offense intended, but every cheater views their partner/spouse as the "same old thing".

It would be difficult to solve that equation when you refuse to acknowledge the most prominent variable.

Stick around and keep up posted. We are ALL here to help. Most people post here to keep newcomers from making the same mistakes that we did, or, to own up what others could see that we refused to...

Remember secrecy is the lack of complete Openness and Honesty.

Privacy is something you allow your mate in the bathroom.

His passwords, cell phone text records, receipts and all other "relationship" transactions should be readily available to you!

When I thought it was age it was actually infidelity. So please, do look and look carefully. My guess is that there is more than meets the eye, but that is just my 50 plus years of maturity speaking.

Men are creatures of sex, so perhaps he is merely indulging his fantasies without ever actually acting on them. One thing is for sure, if you proceed down this road it will mark the beginning of the end, you can be sure of that.

Mr. G

If he was that desperately horny, wouldn't he at least throw his girlfriend a bone (so to speak) once in two months?

I snooped on my wife. Turns out she was not cheating.

She was NOT angry when I told her I'd opened her secret email account and read her emails. It did NOT kill her trust in me.

Tell him to hit the road. You don't have a marriage to save. You have a relationship with a man who wants to diddle other people, even bringing men and women into your bed.

Lose him yesterday!

mbaby,

I'm afraid you missed my point, and it may be because I did not state it clearly enough.

Legal, family, financial or social support for marriage -- any of those can give an outbound partner cause for pause. Dr. Harley, the psychologist who founded this site, and the MB program, says that ANY reason to reconsider the marriage is a place to start, and I agree.

Our kids were grown and gone, too, and finances were not a consideration for us either, so those were not my motivations for rebuilding our marriage. But we had a long shared history (37 years), an extended family and many long-term mutual friends who were horrified to learn about the upheaval in our marriage. My H responded to that, and to his guilty conscience, to his moral/religious values. While he did not believe he loved me anymore, he came back for those reasons. Those vows he made, and the social pressure from our grown kids and friends. It took time for us to rebuild, but he will be the first to say that he loves me more now than he had in years.

Point is, it doesn't matter what causes the recommitment, because if there is something of great value at stake (and it's rarely the partner they've "grown bored" with), it's a starting point. Marriage builds in some of those starting points.

That's all I was trying to say.

RHW

Mbaby, please don't take offense, but is this a hetro relationship? I always wonder when someone refers to their SO as a "life partner". With you living in New York, it just crossed my mind.

It's a hetero unmarried relationship--mbaby's opening post refers repeatedly to "he" and "him."

Yes I know, but it's possible mbaby is a "he" and "him" too.

Oh, boy. Hadn't even thought of that. I don't see any indication that that's the case, but you may be on to something.

Still, an unmarried relationship of any variety contains the same interpersonal dynamics, and the same lack of social/legal influencing factors but maybe this poster could still get some useful information here.