Good to see you POMDBD3!

Great advice!

Wife pulled a fast one this morning. She showed up with three police cars and yanked my son from her sister's house. My son was crying and didn't want to leave and the other two kids were in her car and witnessed the whole thing. WTH!!!!!

Well, now we know why she wasnt worried! She had a plan. Did she have some kind of court order, or did she just call the police?

Until there is a judge's order, you both have a right to him. So, she had every right to come get him, legally.

Get your attorney to file an immediate request for a custody order in your behalf. The judge should not look highly upon her methods. And if she takes him away from the family home and doesnt allow you to see him, then she will be in bigger trouble.

Get to the courthouse today! Also, find out what she has been up to legally concerning this.

It's time to use those papers that you had in hand, ready to go. The courts will not look favorably on this one. She is shooting herself in the foot.

Also, make sure your finances are separated. She will rob you blind if she has access to your finances.

My WW, unfortunately is highly intelligent in a lot of ways and a formidable foe. I just spoke to ex-H number one and he said that he forgot to warn me that she will be as sweet as honey and then stab you through the heart with a butter knife.

I'm waiting on my attorney to call me back... He's probably at lunch right now...

I'll try to get temp custody asap..

She is dirt poor so I don't know how she is going to fund her defense. I know her dirt-bag boyfriend offered to help out financially but he doesn't make very much money..

Take advantage of her being without money right now! Get the legal process concerning custody going today.

If there were three cops there the courts will probably be fine with it.

Remember, this happened at the relatives house not ericchs...Mom trumps Aunt.

ericch....if you are working and the mother is a SAHM, expect the courts to be on her side. As far as you having money and her not....expect that to change, and she knows that game.

As far as smearing her....that happens in every custody case on both sides. It is always alcoholic versus psychotic, drug addict versus abuser...the courts have heard it all before.

I think your lawyer is going to give you a reality check here.

If a lawyer knows there is money anywhere in the marriage, he will take her side and get his fees from the settlement.

She lawyers up, ericch gets the bill.

ericch, it is time for cooler heads to prevail, here. No third party is going to think a toddler belongs with the father in daycare rather than with a SAHM. And by your account, even, she is a good mother.

If I were you I would reach out for mediation. Get reasonable access to the kids and go to Plan B with her.

You can always reignite a custody fight later. It isn't a battle it is a war, and you can expect a mother to keep waging it for years as well.

Ask your attorney, but in most cases, the mom is going to win in court, and the dad is going to get the bill. You are probably better off threatening a custody battle while negotiating out a sttlement.

PS: if you ever apologize to the OM, I will hunt you down and kill you :-)

Mike,

None of that happened in my case, and my wife was a SAHM. I won custody, even though I was still in the military. And she had to pay me!

Fathers lose because they expect to lose!

Oh, and if he apolgizes to the OM, I will help you!

Mike,

I have to disagree with you. My ex was a stay at home mom as well and I was able to get a shared physical custody arrangement that likely would have been 50/50 if I had been more proactive and fought from the start rather than simply letting her get primary custody.

I though like you did and paid for it.

No, the courts don't automatically side with the mom.

No, they don't look kindly on stunts like the one she pulled today, especially when it is done with the children witnessing it.

I got slammed for having my ex get served while I was strapping the kids in my car in the parking lot. They didn't see anything and wouldn't have known what was going on anyways since she was simply being given an envelope with legal papers.

But the kid's attorney didn't like that and criticized me for it. She was correct, in hindsight.

So her stunt with 3 cops won't look good.

Just because 3 cops show up doesn't mean that the courts side with her.

The cops are really in the middle of all of this.

And no, they will expect that if mom moves out and wants to be on her own that she will support herself and will have to make childcare arrangements for herself as well. She can't leave, mooch of the ex, and expect everything to go her way.

I personally know one man who had his ex take his son out of state. He showed up to the courthouse and represented himself and demanded an emergency order to have his son stay in his state. They weren't willing to hear him out and he sat down in the courthouse in protest and refused to leave. The judge had him surrounded by cops and he still refused to leave without an emergency order that returned his son to the state.

He was threatened by the judge with contempt of court and arrest, but he stuck his ground and begged, in tears, for his son to be returned to the state he was in.

The judge granted the request. He now has full custody of his kids from 2 different women.

The courts are mom biased because men go in thinking they will lose. Those that stand their ground and fight are the ones who prevail.

But the fight must be for good reasons. It has to be focused on the kids and not on the fact that the WW is a slut/druggie/immoral.

erich, you must present yourself as the more appealing alternative to a woman who wants to live in section 8 housing in a slum and is now working on exH number 3.

And don't trust her one single bit. Her modus operandi will be to stab you in the back and will be sweet as pie to get her way. It's a common trick for wayward women to pull on men hungry for kindness and hope about their crazy wayward wives.

I fell for it and so have many others. It's a deal with the devil, so don't make it.

MM came out ahead because he fought and stuck to his guns and the court saw him as a better alternative.

Was it easy? Absolutely not. Be prepared for the most harrowing and difficult and stressfult thing you've ever been through. It's that way because the stakes are so high.

Is there mom bias? Yes, but it isn't as simple as "the courts favor women".

It's much more complicated than that and a big part of it is that men simply assume that that's how it is.

It isn't for the men who are prepared, level headed, and willing to fight for their rights as fathers and their kid's rights to be with their fathers.

Oh erichh!

I was afraid she was up to something. You couldn't have known. Don't blame yourself.

And don't give up!!

Keep trying to get in touch with your attorney!

She's going to use your child as a weapon against you. God! I HATE it when people do that! That is the lowest of the low!

Charlotte

I don't know, I know a dozen friends where it went the other way, the courts were incredibly prejudiced towards moms in the case of young children. Maybe it is just New Jersey.

Anyway, I know when the specter was raised in my personal situation, my W said to me "the girls are better off with me" and I thought about it and she was right.

We haven't gone there but i would assume my 14 year olds would choose to stay with her because she does everything but chew their food...

Mike,

You may not know the full ins and outs of their cases.

And why would the girls be better off with her than with you? You a good dad?

Girls need fathers and the girls who don't have them grow up to have many problems and are more likely to dabble in drugs, get pregnant early, and generally have a problem relating to men or understanding what a good man is like that they should look for in a husband.

So don't just lie down. This message is for you too, erich. It's a delicate and very stressful battle in the courthouse but it is winnable by men if they play their cards right.

I have heard stories about Jersey, however. Ironic since it's a very blue state.

But dad's matter and dad's who standup for their rights as fathers matter.

Both of you should find and join a father's rights group in your area.

Do you think she's found this thread?

Find someone to provide daycare in your home...move your mom in pronto.

Since E allowed his WW to help tuck in their son last night when E had him, does anyone think it would be a good idea if he went over to WW's apt tonight and ask her to allow him to help tuck their son in tonight?

Also, E, you've got to get over the idea that she is a good mother. Do you have any idea how many hours she spent talking to OM when she was supposed to be caring for your son?

Thanks everyone for your advice and encouragement. I'll respond to some of your questions and comments tonight--I'm busy at work right now, so I want to be brief.

I spoke to WW on the phone. She was full of venom and re-wrote what happened this weekend. She said that I was holding our son against her will and trying to keep her from him!!!

Why would I let her tuck him in at night and tell her where I was keeping him during the day if I was trying to hold him hostage?!?!

I asked when I could see him again and she said that she will not allow me to see him!

She said that she has a meeting with her attorney this Friday.

I finally heard back from my attorney and told him everything. He said that he will have the papers ready to sign this Wednesday morning. He asked me several questions but didn't give any advice yet except to get those papers signed asap.

More later...

Yes, but I'm not as doting a parent as their mother. They just would get a higher level of care with her. I admit it.

My son wouldn't live with her in a thousand years, he would be with me. He is disgusted with the whole A.....she is lucky she isn't married to him...

I should say, she made the proposal it was more like a 60-40 split. And I think she thought the OM would be in her life, formally or clandestinely, and I'd be her babysitter while they took long walks on the beach and rolled in freshly raked leaves. That is not happening now.

Anyway, that is off the table and we are trying for now.


Yeah, maybe I have a narrow data set. But my friends have been told "Don't bother, you'll spend a ton of money, cause a lot of pain, and lose in the end.'

Naturally, you won't find a lawyer who won't blow sunshine up your rear, since they don't send away a file.

Reality is in my case, my kids are old enough to choose, i guess. If I was in the big house they are used to, and W was in a little condo, maybe they would want to stay here....I hope I don't have to play that out.

Unless she has facts to back up her accusation, she's got nothing.


She's got nothing.


I hope you are documenting everything.

I suggest that you call her every single day requesting to see your son.

If your state allows for recording phone conversations, pick up a recorder. Get her on tape refusing you.

Document. Document. Document.

File first, and definitely document her not allowing you to see your son. Then get the temporary order filed. She's shooting herself in the foot, but you need to do the proper things to take advantage of it.

Mike C2,

Just because your wife might be more doting of a parent, doesn't necessarily make her a better one. What about discipline? What about providing a strong moral compass and teaching them right from wrong? Who's to say that you wouldn't dote on the kids if you were the sole parent? You never had to because your wife took that role, but if she didn't, don't you think you might step into that role and excel?