Dammit SHM,

I didn't revert completely, I drank a little but only once got the comment about it. I didn't ignore, AT ALL.

Please, indulge me, lemme have an unbiased opinion.

I KNOW what I have done, I THINK I know what she has done, see the difference?

Ty for staying with me

Copy of email sent to W that she will get tomorrow at work....

Well, you know me well enough to know that I am better expressing my feelings in the written word rather than talking,
you have seen that before with my poetry.

I get too emotional when talking, then lose my way and say things that are not really important.

So me type now....
I really don't want to make you mad, unhappy or anything like that, I seem to be rather good at it though <shrug>

The thing is, I have never been in a position like this in my life before. Yeah, I've been upset, jealous, untrusting
and I know that you and Karen , my therapist, both, between you, have made me realise that I am a person
and not an appendage.

When I said I didn't 'need' you anymore, I meant it. I know now that I can exist outside 'us'. I have never realised that
before, you have made me feel like that and I thank you for it. It's quite refreshing to be able to feel close to someone
without feeling the need for their support to live. You did that for me. The problem is though, that it is so new to me
that when you told me it was a good thing, I panicked. The old me rushed back in, looking for something to lean on.

I want to apologise to you for that, it shocked me to be honest, I wasn't expecting it. That is why the conversation went
the way it did. I didn't want it to, I HAVE forgiven you, as you FORGAVE me, neither of us FORGET though, and that is a
good thing, as we will therefore learn from our mistakes whether we make it together or take those lessons to a new
relationship.

Anyway, less about me, more about you.

I am really glad that you feel happier without pressure from me. I know and understand that you will feel lonely.
If you do, the pick up the phone and call me. You called me from work when you were bored, that was nice, it
was a 'friendly' thing to do. I was just glad I was here to talk to you, nothing more, nothing less.

Let's face it, we have spent over half our lives together, almost every memory I have contains you and I like that.

So, I shall look forward to seeing you and Coop on Saturday evening. Don't wear him out TOO much, (is it bad that
I look forward to hugging coop as much as I do hugging you?...lol)

In the meantime, don't wear yourself out either, I want a hug from you AND coop on Saturday.

Take care, look after yourself, and if you can't sleep, call me, because neither can I... :P

Good Plan A email!

Do you know what her top EN's are? And are you able to fulfill those?

I'm serious about the Plan B. I know some will disagree, but I Plan B'ed my H when there was no A. He had one foot in and one foot out of the M and I wasn't going to put up with his neglect and wishy-washiness any longer.

She has decided to move out and be alone, but whenever she feels the pangs of loneliness she can call you up. She is not truly feeling the consequences of leaving the M. She has this fantasy that D and single will be happiness...but it won't.
Right now she has the best of both worlds, a single life, and a doting H she can keep at arms length and make the rules of contact with.

How much longer to Plan A her? When will Plan B occur? Plan B needs to come suddenly, don't slide into it, don't make it easy on her...

Thanks SHM,

I am not sure about a plan B. At this moment, I need to rebuild my plan A more. I know her top needs are admiration, recreational companionship and conversation. I think working on these a while longer may reap some rewards for both of us.

I know you say that she has a fantasy that D and single will be happy. I disagree to a point. I don't think she is under any illusions what she is doing and how hard it may be, she just hasn't FELT it yet. I have planted a suggestion in her head to work on the marriage using the Harley methods (she doesn't know what they are yet) but I have asked her to consider using a completely different and proven method for rekindling a relationship and she didn't commit either way. I take that as a positive!

I am probably going to Plan A for at least another 2 months, then if I am getting nowhere, I will be in a more stable position with regards to my emotional state and move to Plan B.

Have no worries, it will be a shock to her when it happens.

I think that sounds like a great plan.

y'all wanna hear a reallt stupid thing?.... Im gonna tell you anyway.

W said tommorow that she is going out with our old dog, she repeated at least 3 times, "just me an him".

Last night, in my state of mind, I took that as she was proving that it WASN'T true, and that she was inviting OM.

I was going to hire a car and follow her, get the 'truth'.

Over the last few hours I have realised how bad that is, for 2 reasons.

1. If I find out I will feel worse.
2. I cannot do anything about it.

Lesson learned, deal with the future, THAT you can change.

Actually, I think you SHOULD check on her. Then you will find out the truth.

I am almost sure there is an affair, and you need to know so that you can make a battle plan.

The thing is believer, if there IS an affair, there is no way I can stop it. As far as W is concerned, it's over for us so there will be no way that a NC rule could or would be applied.

The only thing I could do is to go into Plan B sooner, I'm not ready for that yet though.

I really don't feel like expending any energy on snooping, checking or anything like that, I think it will be more productive for me to spend that energy on me.

I will continue to Plan A for another couple of months, and then if things aren't working and I feel ready, I will jump into Plan B.

W's birthday is in March, so it would be nice to hit plan B around then, I think it will be more of a shock.

Tomorrow I am going out with W for a walk with our old dog.

I did say that I would like to see him today as well, but I have found out about a band playing at my local pub, so I have decided to go there instead.

Time to go out and enjoy myself

The night was good, had a good time.

Best laid plans however...

W was supposed to call me to tell me she was home and that I could go over to hers. She never called, I therefore never got the chance to tell her I was doing something else.

Ah well.

After tonight's no contact from W after she promised to call, I feel like telling her to 'sack it'. She wants to stay friends, but only when she feels like it or has nothing better to do.

Well, I am worth more than that, from now on, it's my way or the highway.

I know y'all been telling me this for a long time. I have a thick skull, it needs beating for a long time before something sinks in.

It has now sunk in.

Help????

W hasn't called me today at all and we were supposed to be out with the dog. It's 1pm now and getting too late to go.

Do I call her or am is that back to pursuing?

OK, so I didn't call and W called me. Its too late for the walk but she invited me over for a brew and to spend some time with Cooper, our old dog.

If it wasn't for him, then I wouldn't go, but I can't miss a chance to see him. I miss that dog SO much.

Just got back. I didn't manage to avoid R talk . She initiated it by telling me why she hadn't been in contact. Apparently our telecon the other night made her angry, upset, sad and everything else. She thought that she would just tell me to 'go away' and not talk to her ever again unless it was through a solicitor. (a WAW initiating NC, would that have been a 1st?..lol) But she didn't want to do that so called me.

She thinks I have been changing my mind far too much (Yep) and been trying to get her to change her mind (nope) and been playing games (Nope). She says I need to let go and move on. I told her I had. She hopes that we can remain friends, but that's all it will EVER be. She doesn't want to give me any wrong signals by keeping in touch. She has adjusted to being on her own and likes it. She will never get married again, she just wants to do what she wants when she wants and not to have ANYONE to answer to. She told me that if we couldn't remain friends, she would be devastated because she 'loves me to bits and once was IN love with me'. I validated as much as possible but told her in no uncertain terms that I was standing for our marriage. That I believe in it.

I asked to her to NOT get involved with anyone else before we were divorced, she said she wasn't going to agree to that as no-one knows what will happen in the future. I asked her how soon she wanted to get the D filed in that case. She said, as soon as you want. I told her I DIDN'T want, she mumbled something about not knowing how to do it and then changed the subject.

Now, whilst it wasn't the best conversation to have, we cleared the air over my position. I do NOT need to repeat any of that again, she knows where I am and what I am doing.

I have agreed to love her unconditionally, she said, with no rules. I just repeated the unconditional part. I will be a friend, someone to lean on, the safe way home. That's all I can do now. In her mind, there is no 'us' nor will there ever be again and it's about time I realised that. She has moved on and wants me to do the same.

We had a 'friend' hug and I left.

I know she will be in touch in the future, but I will not instigate anything.
_________________________

Oh, one more thing. She responded to my suggestion about trying a different method to rekindle things. She says that she doesn't want to read a book, or work on anything. It's over and always will be.

That sounds pretty final to me, but I aint given up yet

Hey Silva,
have been away for a few days but have got back and caught up on your thread.
Firstly *SLAP!*
Don't ever talk about 'the relationship'

PLan A your hiney off. Be her buddy as much as she will let you but never ever talk about the R.

For the record I have.



DONT talk about the R

Hey Lild,

Thanks for the slap.

I DO find it hard not to talk about the R. I have graciuosly accepted your slap though.

From now on. NO more R talks, if she starts, I will stop.

Honest!

Yep, many a cowardly WS has expected the BS to start the D proceedings...MANY...from what I've read on here, I think it is over 50%. Which I don't get, if they were that unhappy, why don't they get on with it?

And she is feeding you a bunch of fog-talk...most of what she is saying is just not true. She CAN love you again. She fell in love with you once, it can happen again. Usually there is another person that stands in the way.

I think your gut is right, she probably WAS walking with the OM. She wants you BOTH in her life.

So, Plan A your butt off.

DO NOT DRINK ANYMORE! Why do you continue to drink when you know it was a problem for so long in your marriage?

Why would she want to come back to the marriage when you are still drinking, and there is still the possibility you will return to that person?

Thanks SHM,

I have the drinking under control, WELL under control. It is not a problem anymore and W agreed that a long time before we split the 2nd time. It's not anti social drinking, it's not an excuse, on the weekend I enjoy a nice glass of red. In fact W even defended me to MIL when asked about it and that was only last week! She siad that I was having a glass or 2 of wine and had completely kicked the beer/lager/cider and it wasn't a problem anymore.

With regards to the fog talk, there was another thing said yesterday that made me think 'MLC'. I know it's difficult to classify and maybe pointless, but she has changed her dress code to what it was when she was 20, had tattoos (always did want them) and had a boob job (that I paid for and never got the fun out of!! :() The thing she said was "Life's too short to sit around being unhappy". That's something she never said before.

Woth regards to OM, I asked her all about her day and she didn't drop any hints that she was with someone else, even admitted to getting lost on the way (she usually does when alone). I also thought where she went might tell me something. She went to one of the few places we used to go to before and the one she knows the way to. If she had been somewhere different, I would have been more suspicious. I'm not convinced either way, and tbh, don't care. Plan stays the same.

The only thing that DID make me take notice, was when I asked her NOT to get involved with anyone until we were divorced, she said she would NOT promise that as she didn't know what the future would bring. Previously and AFTER that she aid she wouldn't get into ANY R or M in the future as she didn't want to "wash someone elses socks anymore!"

My oh my. They don't half talk twaddle don't they!

Oh, and she has decided to start playing the guitar. (I have played all our married life) after not showing ANY interest before. Another MLC trait.

Ho Hum.