BF,

"I remember that you had said your experience taught you patience -- that is something I am still learning."

Not sure what I posted about patience to you, but wanted to say (or reiterate) that I've learned that there are two elements to patience.

One is "feeling" patient (or more accurately, feeling impatient), and the other is "acting" patient. I confused this by thinking I had to feel patient. What I've learned is that when I BEHAVE patiently, I am BEING patient, regardless of how I FEEL about it.

Still feel the impatience, but that's less important, now that I know I can ACT patient anyway. Maybe that's what they mean when they say "manage" your feelings. Dunno, but it's working for me.

Hugs,

RHW

Such an important distinction! I don't feel patient, but I can behave patiently.

Hi,

Have you read the book yet called "The Script"?
Blessings,
Gineva

Hey, Geneva! I haven't read the book, "The Script" -- what is it about? Is it easy to find?
Thanks!
BF439

Hi BF439,

It is about how ALL men go by "The Script" when having affairs...it is uncanny...I found it hard to beleive til I read it!! It will open eyes, unreal.

It is a shortish book, but, you won't be able to put it down, and it is very to the point, succinct, left an impact on me. It is done in "Acts" like a play! Done so well...stories from other women too...It was pretty inexpensive...I think $6...best $6 I ever spent! I bought it used on www.amazon.com. Maybe you can do that, or get it in the library. Can buy it new too online. Forget who wrote it...its been on tv (I think Oprah) and in the news and in mags....It is so true that book...you HAVE to read it. I lent it to someone, so, can't look at it to get author's name...I do look at it all the time when it is in my possession, to reaffirm that I AM NOT the crazy one, and that I AM the better person in this marriage, or, whatever it is.

Only thing is...my husband never made it to the "finale"...

best,
gineva

It's amazing how most all WSs say the same script but think they are the only ones who have ever spoken these words.

And they think they are the exception to every A story.

The depth of waywardness is unbelieveable. And only us BSs know this. Unless you've experience it, you would never in a million years believe it is possible.

That's why this forum gives me comfort. I am not crazy. I am just another BS trying to save my M.

Thanks for the tip -- it should come by tomorrow!

Yes, it is very painful to see that our beloveds are behaving like robots run amok, especially when THEY won't acknowledge it!

The bad news is that few of them ever look back on that crazy time and SEE how stereotyped their behavior was. Heck, they don't even REMEMBER most of it! (At least, my FWH doesn't. Sure he WANTED to forget...). The good news is that, once they come out of the fog, they remember the basic fact that they had an affair, see that they hurt us badly, and can (if they want) rebuild a better marriage with us than they or the BS ever thought possible.

Still, I do wish he'd remember some of the outrageous things he said during that time. I will never be able to forget them, no matter how good things get.

Hey, it's the recovery that matters...

ITA! Every time I feel like hey, this is just another failed marriage, I remind myself how little any of this makes sense until you add the affair dynamics. Then I'm like, "Oh, now I get why he said this and then that and so on..."

BTW, I signed up for a mommy and me music class at the YMCA for DD4 and myself and a second weekly yoga class just for me. It's sunny here (and warmer) so it really gave me the boost to start with something that I could do for myself and for my kids as we live in this "new normal."
I also had lunch with DS11 since he stayed home from school for a mental health day and we had a great time.
I also have dinner "dates" with girlfriends the next two Saturdays!

Today, BF439 is living her life, even as I deal with the yucky stuff!

Also, I talked with a friend last night becasue I felt low, which perked me up and then I got to be there for another friend who needed someone to talk to about her relationship and it felt so good to pass on the support...

Its so nice to report something positive once in awhile!

ITA! Every time I feel like hey, this is just another failed marriage, I remind myself how little any of this makes sense until you add the affair dynamics. Then I'm like, "Oh, now I get why he said this and then that and so on..."

[/quote]

oh, yeah...

Now you're getting somewhere. Joy... it's right around the corner.

Atta girl, BF! Music and yoga and girls' nights out. Getting support via phone and, even better, being able to dole some out.

All good ingredients. Yer a goddess, fer sure.

This is fantastic news BF and I'm so happy for you. Soak up the happy feelings and bask in the glow of each new day.

The yoga class and the music class sounds awesome. Doing something for you is all about the doing. You may not have taken the classes yet, but committing to them already lightens your load and gives you something to look forward to.

Mwah!

Another small update:
I am "interviewing" a new IC next week (actually it will be my first appointment wit her, but I liked that she suggested that we meet for me to get a sense if I want to work with her or not.) I want to get started on looking at myself and not just the relationship or the A and I am excited to maybe find a counselor I can work with for a fresh start on me.
I had another IC last fall and honestly I don't want to go back to the office where I experienced so much trauma as I processed what was happening...

Glad you mentioned IC. I had attended for several months following D-day. However, counselor got tired of me telling stories about what was happening with WH. Usually, I'd fill her in on the storyline like how I had confronted WH at OW's house or how WH had tried to run over his mother. And I'd try to strategize how best to get him to come back to me.

After telling stories for 45 minutes, I'd take a breath and let counselor give me about 15 minutes of advice. Her advice was usually to PB him which I never followed! She would say "let him miss you."

The last time I went, counselor started with "What are you doing for you? How do you plan on spending the rest of your life if WH does not return?"

She had lost her husband during those same few months, and said she was now looking at her future without him in her life.

She said it wasn't planned for him to get cancer and die in a few weeks. She was blindsided. Not what she had expected for her future. She had always imagined them together growing old together and him always being there for her. Now she had to plan financially for her future, and make decisions for herself, and get along without him in her life.

She said it's the same for you (me). She said you didn't plan on your H having an A. You were blindsided. Now your future is uncertain. You had always imagined a life with WH growing old together and him always being there for you. Now you need to plan financially for your future and make decisions for yourself, and get along without WH in your life.

So she said not to come back until I stopped talking about the A and stories about WH and started facing reality and what MY future looked like.

Yike -- reality check. But it seems easier to me if WH would just die. I could go on loving him, I would grieve the man I lost, I would not have to worry about bumping into him around town with OW, and I would be better off financially.

But now that WH has served me with D papers, and the reality is that my future will not be with him, I should schedule another IC appointment and figure out how to go forward.

Thanks for the reminder.

Yeah, HH,

WS's XW said this just the other day. And I thought this same thing in the beginning after the devastation of his affair.

Instead, you end up learning things you never thought you'd ever know and in some cases, realize that this person you thought you knew was someone you never knew at all.

I told XW, well, it could be worse. He could have been one of those people who kill their spouses when they decide they don't want to be married anymore.

At least that didn't happen. I still question the gun in Dallas thing, though. But if there was a plan there, he wasn't able to go through with it, thank God!!

Charlotte

Hey, all, I've been reading a lot of threads lately that have me rethinking my plan.
Here goes: my rationale for Plan B was to protect myself and what love I have left for WH. I feel stronger, although am not where I hope to grow to in time, but since my husband is a major avoider (which got us into this situation in a lot of ways) I don't see complete no contact getting him to rethink his choices.

I took mail out to him today when he came to pick up DD13 -- I just was not afraid to talk to him. Sort of feeling that "indifference" that was discussed in another thread. I told him I think we need to meet to talk about finances. Part of that is that taxes are coming up; I don't know how he's paying for apartment (I don't see anything coming out of joint accounts, which since we are still married, I need to know about) and its almost too difficult to have this conversation via the IM. He said, let me know, so of course the ball is still in my court.

I believe that I can sit down with him and better discuss finances, and be strong, without losing sight of the fact that I DO NOT DESIRE A DIVORCE. He can not talk me into this anymore than I can talk him into R at this point. But I do believe that he cannot imagine that I have grown and that I can forgive him if he has no contact with me to see that growth.

If Plan B is there to protect the BS, then I will use it as I need it to protect me. If meeting him is too painful, I will simply say that and go back to no contact for me. I think he has shown that he is at least willing to do that for me.

I am ready for feedback (or 2x4's) but I feel like I am ready to adjust my strategy for my own good and secure in the knowledge that I can do so with fidelity to my plan and my needs.

BF439

BF,

I know there are those who will insist on total darkness till WS either comes home or BS no longer wants them to. I'm not even sure Dr. Harley would recommend that in every case.

So of course, I haven't the first idea on what to tell you EXCEPT to ask, what is YOUR goal, your expectation, of opening up a discussion with your WH? Is it simply to sort out this year's tax situation? To iron out a broader financial plan short of divorce? Are you trying to get a "read" on where he is, regarding the permanence of his separation from you?

What, exactly, are you trying to accomplish? I think if you're honest with yourself, you can figure this out.

Also, I'd advise you to play the "what if" game with yourself.

What if--he tells you he wants to work toward divorce with the financial plan you're discussing. Yes, I know, you would reiterate that you do not WANT a divorce. But how would it make you feel to have him look you in the face and tell you that? Would your present "indifference" hold up to that?

What if--you hear fog babble (and you're likely to). For example, he "loves" OW. He doesn't love you...the situation is not harming the children, except for what you're telling them. Blah, blah, blah.

All hard things to listen to--and the things Plan B has prevented you from hearing.

There are lots more "what ifs" you could imagine, I'm sure. If you meet with him, try to prepare for any and all of them. You're feeling indifferent because of the protection Plan B has afforded you. Might not be so easy back in the ring...

I hope there are folks who've actually broken the darkness of Plan B who will pipe up and tell you how it worked for them.

Just wanting you to guard your heart!

RHW

I don't know if this is indifference or what, but today I am starting to wonder if I just plain hate him -- not with anger, just accepatance that I hate the man who did this to me and my kids. I hate that he is so resolved to continue hurting everyone despite how much pain we are already in.
I responded through the IM to some schedule questions and I let him know that I'm not sure if we do need to meet (I asked some financial questions that I had been wondering about, so hopefully he'll respond to those questions), and that I'd let him know.
That's where I am today and your feedback was very helpful. I do need to protect my heart...
BF439