Sounds like a perfect description of a typical addict.

[/quote
Yes, I see that. It really is. I want and need help. I cannot save our marriage without that help.

Just arrived at MB weekend. It starts this evening. Glad the site is back up. I am ready to go to work. SSS is struggling and sad about even having to be here, but we have good moments, too. One step at a time.

Hang in there, GreenMile!

For some crazy reason, I have faith in you, and I think between SSS and you, your marriage CAN overcome everything. I'm putting my money (oops, YOUR money) on the Harley's being able to help you.

If you get a chance, ask about how sexual addiction might influence recovery. Just wondering.

LOL Thanks, Believer. I believe it too. SSS is pulling for me but betting against me.

I will ask that. Heading downstairs now to the seminar.

So, any update???????????????

Yes. Sorry. I have been posting on some other threads since getting home. The seminar was simply fantastic. Dr. Harley is a brilliant speaker and makes everything seem so totally logical and understandable. It was wonderful meeting him, Joyce, Steve, Kim, and all of them in person. Having been an engineer before becoming a clinical psychologist, he makes everything flow logically, and his system is born of scientific observation and logic. There is no doubt to any listener that the MB approach that evolved from his experience is not only the only program that makes sense but the only one that works. It is based on observation and empirical data and results. With my science background, it was perfect for me.

Now for a more personal reaction: He gave me hope. Actually beyond hope. I am totally confident that if I can master this and work this for the rest of my life, that SSS and I will succeed. In fact, the odds are 100%. The only remaining doubts are 1) that SSS will not be able to heal, which in my opinion can only happen if I fail to do this and follow through, and 2) there is a risk of failure in the long term, if I do not find a personal God to surrender myself to, who will give me the tools to live a moral life. I have lived 61 years without a moral compass. My embrace of Buddhist philosophy when I was a young man helped me a great deal with the conflicts of my childhood and the demands and complications of adulthood, but it was toxic beyond belief in the context of marriage. The self cannot exist only as an expression of the whole universe when you are married. The self must instead exist as an expression of two individuals functioning as one self, both sides totally commited to the other. The universal self is bereft of moral structure, because anything goes and everything only serves the self. The spiritual part is not really part of MB, but TST spent hours with me after the seminar and helped me to understand this part. SexyMamaBear spent those same hours with SSS and helped her as well. Years ago, I never completed the 12 steps after getting clean from drug addiction. This was likely my undoing, as I clearly have an addictive personality that is very strong. An affair, sexual or otherwise, that meets emotional needs is like a drug, exactly like an addiction. TST made it very clear that I have little chance of long term success without that spiritual approach, so after completing all the lessons and mastering MB, I will be getting the Big Book and finishing the job I left unfinished years ago. I have a lifetime of work, but I am now excited and optimistic and ready to go to work. I would not only recommend the seminar to everyone but actually urge everyone to beg or borrow the money if necessary to attend one of those weekends.

Oh, GM, your words give me lots of hope. I'm so happy that you are realizing how important the spiritual side is.

I really hope that you will get the Big Book right away. The problem with an addiction is that we always feel that we have the power to overcome it. And that leads to a constant struggle, failure, and self-hatred when we fall.

Once we accept that we are powerless, and rely on our higher power, everything becomes easy. It is a hard concept to grasp, but I've seen many, many people completely turn their lives around.

I know there are a lot of people here doubting you, but hang in there and don't give up. A 12-Step program works. I've been using one for 40 years and have been clean the whole time.

Thanks once again, Believer. Since getting home, I have messed up several times already. These were moments of need by SSS that I misinterpreted. She read the first chapter of His Needs, Her Needs this morning and was triggered badly by it. She is lying in bed sobbing and won't let me be by her side in there. When I try to be with her, she threatens to leave the house. All she can feel right now is the overwhelming pain of what I have done to her and a complete lack of trust that I can be honest or that her life can ever be better. Plus she is in a deeper crisis because of some discouraging things that people wrote to her in her thread today. I know I have to be strong for her, but it is so hard when it is like this, when all she is reminded of is my horrific lying and betrayal of her. I am really at a loss what to do or say at times like this, and feeling helpless and afraid is where I am at. And last night, after I posted to you, I went to be feeling so hopeful. I can only ask for God to help her and to guide me right now.

She is going through the normal grieving of the marriage she thought she had. No matter what you do, she will go through this.

She should have a lack of trust in you. She would be foolish to trust you right now.

I suggest that you keep working MB and also start on a 12-Step program.

Do some deep thinking about your spiritual side. I've been interested in SSS and your posts about religion. It doesn't seem like you have connected with a belief system. I would work on that.

I'm kind of the same. I call myself "a follower of Jesus", instead of a Christian.

GM, sounds like a rough day. You know there will be many more ahead, just do not get discouraged.

You and sss both have Kim's phone number from MB and can call anytime you are experiencing these tough days. You can also post directly to Dr. Harley on the MB Weekend forum anytime needed. Use all the resources available to help you.

Please remember, this is a process not an event!



Believer, your post has merit, but is not what Dr. Harley recommended for GM.

I am trying to stay as close to what he actually said;
Dr. H was specifically asked about working both the MB & AA/SA programs simultaneously in the beginning of recovery at the MB weekend. He said, You should not co-mingle approaches to marital recovery in the beginning of recovery as it is a recipe for huge problems. Stick with the MB program until the marriage is in a full state of recovery before introducing another set of ideas that could cause marital conflict and lead to LB's. MB is all that's needed if the rule of POJA is followed at all times!

That is true, what Dr. Harley said. And I took it to heart what you told me in that regard also, TST. You and Believer, like it or not, are my greatest source of support and inspiration outside of the MB team, and I appreciate it more than words can describe. That is a lot to say for a word addict like me LOL.

These kinds of days will be many, when SSS questions whether she should even continue. Though I know that, it doesn't make them any easier.

GM-
i know EXACTLY how your wife feels, bc my H had a similar history to yours. i have felt like seperating on a daily basis and still have since we got home- its TRIGGERS.

the pain is intensified since we have so much hurt from past behaviors , but sss and i need to remember that these are habits- and they can be changed - as dr. harley said.

PLEASE call Kim today - and post to dr harley. this has made all hte difference for us - and it is very hard for us on a daily basis. they are there for you -- and they will give you their professional advise. it has already been so helpful to me in just these 3 days.

i felt like calling it quits too bc of something my h did on the way home. now i am back on track.

take care, sunflower

GM, I haven't posted to you before but I have been following you and SSS from the beginning. I wanted to point out that SSS may not be able to heal no matter what you fail to do or follow through with. There comes a time in R where no matter what the WS does, heck you could become superman, the healing will be hers alone to accomplish. After all is said and done, she will be left with an upheaval of emotions that can squash her in a single moment on a day to day basis. And it will have nothing to do with your heroic effort to accomplish the work before you. So your correlation between your success and her healing is not so pieced together. And if she should fail to heal sufficiently it will not be her failing.

From what I have read, particularly your setting her up to fail throughout your M, it would be easy for you to put it on her in the end. Telling yourself "I did everything I could,but she FAILED to heal". Seems like she's being set up again. Sabotaging healing by dripping out truths will likely cause her NEVER to heal.

Sometimes there is simply nothing you can say or do. If she doesn't want you to sit with her, don't. Don't leave her in the house by herself. Reassure her you'll be there for her if she calls on you but give her some space to grieve.

Post of the day!

Thanks for that reminder of reality. I don't believe I am setting her up to fail, but I take very seriously your warning. It is hard for me to reconcile the concept of radical honesty, and answering her questions that, if radically honest, will end up triggering or hurting her.

Thank you.

GM, I just read your wife's posts.

Please remember that Radical Honesty is not a weapon.
When sss asks a question, if she say's that's all she wants to hear right now, then stop!

How was the goat walk?

Like tst said, if sss tells you to stop then stop. You don't want to crush her until there is nothing left. Don't put anymore burden on her than she can handle in the name of RH. You have a strong wife GM but you may have to bare some of this burden on your own. If you want to get it off you chest by saying it out loud, talk to your goats or dogs while you are walking them. Confess it to God. He's always listening.

I will. Many times it sounds like a question, but I have to learn to not say anything back. That has turned out to be a major challenge for me. I wish I could just go back 26 years, call a Mulligan, and start over.