VST, Dr. H's plan in Surviving an Affair begins with Plan A and is then FOLLOWED by Plan B, when necessary.

The affair is your enemy. Your husband has been replaced by an alien and that is why you do not recognize him. He has fogged out his brain with rationalization and justification, so that he feels entitled to indulge himself in selfishness. He is completely blind to the destruction he is and will be causing.

YOU are the only sane person in this marriage right now, even though you feel like you are losing your mind.

You need a plan...Dr. H's plan. We can help you work through it. We can help you stay focused when you think you are losing it. We've been where you are...and have survived.

Your daughter needs you to fight this affair with every weapon available. She is counting on you to fight for her family.

Your weapons are Dr. H's plans.

Plan A, as has been said, has two parts: demonstrating a willingness to meet your spouses top ENs and bringing the affair out of darkness.

Don't concern yourself with Plan B this week. You need to learn what Plan A is and how you can implement it in your situation.

You NEED to be nice to WS during Plan A. Take every opportunity you have to tell and show him that you would like to build a new, better marriage where you both have your emotional needs (ENs) met. Read about Dr. H's list of ENs, and try to identify what his top ones are. Then think of ways you can meet them or demonstrate your willingness to meet them.

Do NOT talk relationship talk at all other than to say what I said above...I would like to rebuild a new and better marriage and I believe with all my heart we can do that once you end this affair.

Pleasant is the name of the game.

At the same time as you are sweet and pleasant, you expose WITHOUT HIM KNOWING IT IS COMING. If you give him a heads up, you might as well not even bother doing it.

Fighting the affair is about strategy and follow through. Strategize your Plan here, then follow through. Keep focused on the plan when he is spewing fog babble about your marriage, your life, etc. Ignore his hurtful words. It's the alien talking. He will make no sense because he has no sense right now.

After you get started on Plan A, you can learn more about Plan B.

And, I promise you, this affair is not anywhere near over. I was told the same thing by some very smart people here. When you've read enough stories, it becomes obvious.

And snoop in any way that you can.

VST,
You have to decide where your boundaries are. For me, refusal of the Polygraph is a sign of guilt. If H has nothing to hide why not take the polygraph.

I will also echo what everyone else is telling you...EXPOSE the affair to everyone including HR at WH's job. It's the only way.

EXPOSURE then PLAN A is the ONLY WAY!!

I'm torn now about the advice for us to be living together. With him in his "numb" state and them still working together I don't know what to do. I know he would come home if I said he could but how could I live with all that? I don't have proof but I am totally suspicious.....and if I expose him to the husband and family and friends, living with him will be especially unpleasant! I don't know for sure that the A is still going on. Any advice here?

You are going through a very traumatic time. Take the advice for your daughters sake. Start exposing. You can do this. You can do this. You can do this.

He isn't violent towards you is he?

Sweetie, I doubt OWH will go off and if he does, it's just a consequence of your WH's choices. He must not be THAT bad or your WH and OW would have never hooked up out of fear of him.

No, don't tell your WH any of your plans! Keep being nice, that's part of Plan A. Gather your intel and expose to EVERYONE all at once.

Remember...the AFFAIR is your enemy. THAT is what you are fighting against.

OF COURSE your husband is "numb". Every single BS on here had a spouse who was numb. They HAVE to numb themselves to justify the affair.

If he will come home if you ask, then GET HIM HOME. Your best Plan A happens when he is HOME. What good does it do to keep him away? How does that help you meet his ENs???? How does that help you fight the affair????

You can live with it because you know that you will not live like that forever. It is part of your plan to fight the affair.

"I want you to come home because I love you and believe we can rebuild a better marriage where we both are happy."

Yes, exposure will anger him. But it is your very best weapon against the affair because as long as it is in the dark, it grows. When the light of day is on it, it's ugly. Others knowing the truth puts pressure on the affair. That IS GOOD. They are living a fantasy right now and exposure brings a bit of reality.

Your marriage can withstand him being mad about exposure. It CANNOT withstand an OW in the picture.

Read SexyMamaBear's advice to you again and again until it sinks in.

You need to get your husband back home with you (while you're doing Plan A). It's hard but it's effective!

Read SexyMamaBear's advice to you again and again until it sinks in.

Read SexyMamaBear's advice to you again and again until it sinks in.

Read SexyMamaBear's advice to you again and again until it sinks in.

Got it?

(((VerySadTime)))

No, sweetie, it is NOT over because he declines a poly. I guarantee he is in an active affair. You can ask for a poly, but DO NOT consider your marriage over when he refuses it. And he WILL refuse it. And he WILL get angry because you don't trust him or believe him, and that just proves that this marriage can't be fixed....blah, blah, blah...it's all so typical. They ALL say the SAME things.

But it is NOT over.

I would not waste my time asking for a poly because you already know he's in an affair.

And DO NOT tell him about this website. You need this place to plan and strategize how to fight this affair.

You've got to get yourself psyched up for this fight and stop feeling defeated.

I'm so glad that SMB, PM and others are here now telling you what I have been saying all along...

YOU MUST EXPOSE. YOU MUST END THIS AFFAIR.

Nothing will happen until you do.

Can you post your list of people who you hope to be your allies in SAVING YOUR M and PUTTING PRESSURE ON THE ADULTERERS to end their A???

Honestly, THAT is your first step...let us help you through that so that we can help you can set the wheels in motion. The state you are in now is keeping your wheels spinning but going nowhere.

Listen to your gut. You already know the truth.

You just have to decide whether you are willing to FIGHT for your family.

As long as he is working with OW, the affair is not over. They may "cool it", but it will be brewing. More than likely, they won't even cool it, they will just hide it better.

If you let it brew or simmer or let it go underground, it will hurt you even more down the road. Decide now to do everything in your power to DESTROY it.

Wow, thanks to all of you! OK but if I ask him home, then:

1. I have no reason to call the OWH and tell him he's not living with me
2. they will still be working together
3. I have no proof that anything is still going on
4. exposure would be telling that he "had" an affair
5. I'll be living with someone who isn't sure he wants to be married to me or that he even loves me.

Please someone respond to each of these to clarify. I'm a very logical person and need all the i's dotted..:) Thanks!

Also, oceanspray, there is no violence

MF, I'm wondering....

Should she ask him to come home first before exposure?

I'm thinking that if he is willing to come home, getting them under the same roof first is better.

She could snoop, then expose, all the while meeting ENs.

Thoughts???

I've got to take my daughter to practice but will be back in a couple of hours for more help. Thanks!!

You are thinking this through. Mind over emotions. That tells me you can do a Plan A. Good!



You and OWH can be allies in beating this affair. I would contact him, tell him that you are trying to save your marriage, and ask if he is willing to contact you if he notices anything that doesn't seem right.

You two can compare notes.




Part of your requirements for RECOVERY will be that they do NOT work together. But you need to get him home first.




You have your gut. That is enough for you to base your decisions on. Your gut will not lead you astray.



See, here's the thing.

I am sure that this affair is not over.

So, get him home first, which will give you more opportunity to snoop and then I would expose (I'm talking days here, not weeks).

I'm waiting to here more from others here on this.



But your goal is to have him fall in love with you again. This will only happen AFTER the affair has ended. Getting him home gives you the best chance to do an awesome Plan A.

Remember...your enemy is the AFFAIR.

Getting him home allows you to FIGHT the affair by giving you better opportunities to meet his ENs, and it gives you better opportunities to snoop.






Logi is good. Think this through... FIGHT your ENEMY.

Also, oceanspray, there is no violence [/quote]

Tough one...can you give us a little background first...how long has he been gone?

Do you think he would be willing to come home?

Has he suggested or alluded to wanting to come home?

How long has the A been going on?

Does ANYONE know...his family, friends, your family? Anyone???

SMB and MF:

To answer the Q about exposure/move home first....

First, she NEEDS TO EXPOSE to the work place. And then Contact OWH, to get more eyes on the problem.

Whether of not she continues the exposure past to family and friends, is not that important as doing the above two things FIRST.

WH can come home and the rest of the exposures occur because he continues contact and does not end the A.

Which s certainly continuing. They work together. And WH is out of the home. Whatever low level burn still continues between them, it is not extinguished yet. And detection of contact is difficult because they work together.

But exposing to the workplace TOMMORROW would lead to management attention to the matter and more eyes on them.

VST to WH's employer: "Employer, WH and scaredy-ho are involved in an physical affair. I have known since X date, and so does Mr OWH. I have reason to believe that the affair continues during company hours, using company assets, phones, email, etc. Your efforts to assist both families with putting thier marriages together would be appreciatated. Seperating the employees, either by different shifts, or even better different locations, would be a tremendous help."

That would be a place to start.

LG

Ok, I agree with exposure first. There is no reason to wait...it only allows the A to continue.

Expose now and EXPECT WH to be angry...they all are. But marriage after marriage has been saved despite the initial anger at exposure.

Mine is one of them, and I did all-out massive, nuclear exposure. And like I said, the A died THAT DAY.

<I did minor exposure 10 months before...they just took it further underground. Don't make this same mistake.>

and you know this because??????

you'd be shocked if you knew the lies your WH has told OW about you too.

Your marriage is as good as dead forever if you continue to allow them to work together. Exposure will end the affair most likely and you want one of them to get fired. Divorce will cost you far more in every way.

I would not allow him back home until he has real NC with OW. You can ride out his fog and withdrawal but if he is still in contact you will go insane.

OWH can help verify NC


You cannot agree to that.


If they work together it is still going on.


Newsflash: HE HAD AN AFFAIR. Still IS having one.


This is pretty typical at the start. His feelings will change when he has NC with OW.