Bf, sorry the soup you're in is getting thicker,sick and dealing with sick kids to boot. (((bf)))

I'll take a stab at WH's babble:

"I've been gone for 8 months, alone mostly, and I can't be alone anymore."

Alone? ALONE??? Outright wayward lie, and a pathetic ploy for sympathy. Ugh.

"Just want her to know that I love her and that I never thought she wouldn't want me in her life because I love someone besides you."

It's all about me, me, me. Why can't you people get it?

"there's been no opportunity for her to see my side"

See, I'm really a good guy, DD. You shouldn't be hurt over what I'm doing, honey, because I'm a good guy and I love you. I just don't love Mommy. What's so wrong about that? You'd understand if you knew how happy OW makes me.

Oh, God, I want to bop him.

Cannot believe you will have to host his parents this weekend. How on earth are you going to play that?

RHW

My favorite is the "alone mostly" -- so not alone, but more than he can take, versus me totally alone since I AM MARRIED!!

His surprise that the kids would not want to be around him if he leaves me for another woman is also priceless fog-babble...

His parents are actually pretty supportive of me and the kids. Unfortunately, they are also supportive of him (helping him outfit his apartment some), but otherwise have been pretty frank with him that his choices may end any kind of real relationship with his kids for good.
His mom apparently told him that if he choses to be with OW, he will have to live two lives because his children will never accept her. I don't know what they will do re: her, but they have told me that I am their daughter and although they cannot change what he is doing, I will always be part of their family.
Who knows what that will look like down the road if he and WH and OW move in together or whatever. It really won't be bad having them here, as they are easy to host and actually, they will help me get somethings done around the house.

Oh, I forgot to mention that last week during his crying on-my-shoulder thing, he said that he told OW that he will never wear a wedding ring because he feels so bad about breaking his vows to me. I also took that to mean that they are talking marriage, but that he's letting her know that he won't wear a ring. Hey, that might make it easier for him to cheat on her!!!
BF

Just found out the WH is starting to look for a larger apartment -- primarily in the trendy area he always wanted to live in.
No, he says, he and OW are not moving in together, but its just one more firm step away from R -- why do I even have hope? I feel like crying, but I've got to work...

His whole process has been a slow creep towards what he wants and it has been like being slowly skinned alive...How can waywards be so cruel?!!!?

Why can't I just see him as the selfish b*stard he is and gleefully move on?

Are you still in Plan B?

No, I'm not and I'm not sure how to get back there. Like I said before, once he indicated that he was going to hire a lawyer, I just kinda gave up. We don't see each other since I found out that he is seeing OW again (still) and we only communicate via text or email about kids and finances.
Should I reiterate the Plan B letter or just cut the contact again? I worry that I am staying in contact to get a 'fix', but then I just spiral down...
I know too much about his life!

In that case, you'd be better served to cut off all contact again, no? Talking to him sure isn't luring him away from OW or keeping him from building the life he thinks he wants...it's just hurting you.

He is so darned intent on ruining everyone's life, including his own. Maddening.

Back yourself out of the drama, bf. For now, it's the best you can do.

(((bf)))

RHW

BF,

You have been around here long enough and I'm sure you have read enough threads to know that you need to get yourself out of this painful and toxic situation. I really feel that you should be in a dark Plan B right now and you should let your attorney handle ANY AND ALL correspondence between you and WH. I'm sorry if this hurts you, but at some point you have to face reality. It is becoming less and less likely that WH is ever going to return to you. He has everything against him right now including his own family and his own children and he is still not 'getting it'. The longer you keep hoping that he will 'get it' the more you are prolonging your own misery and pain. You don't need that!! Your kids don't need a mother that is in misery and pain! They need you more then ever since they have a father that has walked out on them. Show them your strength!! Teach them that you do not let anyone walk all over you in life! Trust me, they are watching your every move right now. Time to teach them some serious life lessons about standing up for yourself and what is right. I know you can do this. Get to work!!!

MindShare

Mindshare and RHW, when you are right you are right! I have eased my way back to plan b -- without any announcement to WH. Emails and text for quick kid-related information is fine on me, but I will not talk to him or see him.
He has emailed some 'suggestions' on finances -- I responded briefly and copied it to my lawyer. I have asked if she feels all of that needs to go directly to her.
This weekend was a little odd, since I had WH's folks over and I did ask him to mow the lawn because I had so much to do getting ready for company, but otherwise it was lovely to realize that I will be able to have a relationship with them that is totally related to our affection for each other. WH was hardly an issue and they only saw him the next day for a quick breakfast.

My new mantra I am trying to stay focused on: WH is sick, I don't know if he has always been like this, but he is NOW. There is nothing I can do about it, but I deserve to be happy despite his selfishness. I am thankful for my kids and that WH has taken care of us financially, but that doesn't override the character defect he has that would allow him to hurt his family in this way.

I am trying to make the shift that it is not about ME, but about what is wrong with him!

On Sunday, I spent the day at a beautiful arboreteum with a male friend (who knows I am not interested in dating at all), but it was so nice to not feel like I shouldn't be there since I'm married, but to just enjoy the company of someone and be okay that they enjoy mine.

My health issues are getting better, too and I think that is part of me feeling more like myself...

I'll keep everyone posted and I will stay DARK!!

Atta girl. Raise the shields and enjoy your life. So glad you have such a good relationship with your in-laws. It's telling that a quick breakfast with him was enough for them...they're hurting too, and probably agree with you that he's caught up in sickness.

It ISN'T about you, bf. Never was. He's made it clear that he's hell-bent on self-destruction, so all you can do is let him go...and not follow him down the hole. You've done so well through all this. You've learned he doesn't define you. Don't let your few lapses define you either.

(((bf)))

RHW

Thanks, RHW, I think I need to keep posting and reading here to keep me focused. Its so easy to slip into his reality with contact with him or slip into this idea that he is the rational one as I go through this legal process (since, you know, people get divorced every day, so its no biggie ).
My lawyer has offered to stick with me even if I don't want to do it collaboratively and that she can buffer me as much as possible -- she even has two conference rooms reserved for our first meeting next week, so I don't have to sit with him!

Reading that gave me a flash of insight about how WE react to any contact with our active WS ...exactly like THEY do when they have contact with OP.

Yep. Addiction is hard to break. I realize that I was "addicted" to my H even when he was killing me with his A stuff. An addiction I didn't WANT to break...just like a WS feels about OP. Same mechanism.

The parallel breaks down, though, when we consider those little things called vows.

Glad your lawyer is protecting you. That's what you're paying her for.

I think you are right about that, RHW, because when I say to myself that I am not going to have contact, I feel better. When its grey and we happen to not have contact I feel like I need it.
It makes me feel so much stronger to just accept that he is sick and cannot be the partner I need. I thought today that it very much affects his ability to parent, but he can't see it.
For example, DD13 has asked that he quit smoking and stop seeing OW until the divorce and she'll start seeing him again. She says that his response is always about how "its more complicated than that," and she doesn't understand his side because he hasn't had enough time with her to explain it. Meanwhile, he is missing out on a significant portion of all his children's lives because of his relationship choices. That seems in direct conflict with his stated desire to be the best parent he can be. If this is the best, I'd hate to see the worst!!!

Nothing major, but wanted to share this. WH and I are communicating via email only about finances and kids. I'm staying very matter of fact and I forward anything financial to my lawyer.
I am just noticing more and more how he very subtly puts on me the responsibility for the kids feelings/actions towards him, as well as what he is and is not doing for them.
I have played the role of intermediary/primary caregiver our whole marriage and he is still trying to lay that responsibility on me and I refuse to own it any longer. He wants to parent 50/50, then he could at least make more effort to know more about their lives, instead of expecting me to keep him abreast of everything!

With distance, I am able to see him a little clearer.

Also, I have a new visualization technique I am trying where I envision him and OW as slowly shrinking in size. They were once huge in my life, consuming my every thought, and now I am working to get them down to the level they deserve -- ant level, maybe?!

He is using your business-only emails to get his digs in. Why not stop the insanity completely?

Let your attorney do his job. Unless and until H sheds WH and is ready to do the right thing, WH is your enemy.

I agree!

I thought about that, but it wouldn't be practical with some of the communicating that we have to do re: kids and money. Maybe back to my stellar IM?

Aren't you supposed to be in Plan B anyway?

Sorry BF, maybe I'm confusing you with someone else. But isn't there a divorce already in the works? Are there temporary orders in place re visitation, child support, etc?

Why AREN'T you using your IM?

Princess and catperson, thanks for responding. I feel like I have done the worst plan B ever -- like I said in an earlier post, I sort of stopped after he and I had direct contact about a car purchase (and I survived seeing him) and after he told me that he was going to get a lawyer.
I have attempted to use the MB principals to save my marriage, but when I went to a level to save myself I still had the idea that he would turn around. When he didn't, I gave up so much of what I had gained in my own self respect.
We are on a path for D, but nothing is filed. We each have lawyers and we have an initial meeting on May 12.

I have asked my IM to come back on board because I know that the contact I have with him is hurting me -- its also making me hate him. Sometimes I think that is good because it keeps me from turning on myself (i.e. what's wrong with me that he went to another woman?! kind of questions). I can have the contact with the lawyer and protect myself and not even have to see him.

One question, since I have obviously not held to my plan B letter (although at the time, I thought I was OK with changing the dynamic, but I was not coming from a place of strength!), should I write another; reference the first one or just send a message through the IM?

I want to get back to zero contact because it doesn't help me. I may have to post a lot over the next few days to hold myself a little more accountable to doing what I say I am going to do...
Thank you both...

I'm not sure what the answer is to that since I never did a plan B. What say you Plan B experts?