Some of you have had to endure their presence during withdrawal and false recoveries...they never left the home so you never had a reprieve from seeing them. On the other hand,when they leave, you miss the sound of their voice and the noise caused by their presence in the home. There's a trade off either way.
In my case, H is in his own place for 11 months now. I miss the heck out of him and the house is empty without him. However, when I do see him, I feel a distance between us because he's so foggy and when I leave, I feel relieved. I think the prospect of recovery in my case is protracted, but perhaps more tolerable. Not sure.
I miss the man I married too. Even though we reminisce and talk to each other daily, it feels platonic and friendly, but nothing more. He's like a friend to me. There's no romance because the fog hasn't lifted.
Such sloooowwww progress. Sometimes so slow that it feels like the slight movement of a techtonic plate. Eventually things are going to shake up. No one can stay in this state of limbo/inertia indefinitely.
It's hard to say who has it easier or better. I haven't yet had the chance to process my anger with him because I don't feel the marriage is strong enough to endure it. With time...
W

Hi BH,

I think what Barnboy said is something for you to think on.

But as well...

Many realise that once they start working MB there M wasn't wuite as good as they thought it was.

When both of you start pulling together at the same time to work on the M - if you decide you want to - which i think you must do, otherwise you wouldn't be asking the questions you do. Then you can decide to work on a new, better M. Both my H and I have changed so much since we have been working this plan that the new M will be different too and so much better.

Hey Barnboy, warioresse and Staytogether,
I appreciate your thought and contribution to my clatest dilemma and barnboy I really cant immagine thinking that i had lost my H love at any point, he has always shown me love in one way or another even during A, he may have said he didnt love me in anger but i could still see he did in his actions.
Warioresse your braver than i would ever be in your situation, had WS left home i would have cut him off emotionally within the first few months as no matter how much I love him im not patient and most of all I have a strong cut off system that i have had to develop since childhood, I havent had room for people that hurt me in my life and I have discarded good friends and family before when they have hurt me and never looked back. I know it may sound strange to you and may make you question weather i love my H but having been tortured in childhood (basically my mother shot my father when i was 2 after discovering he was having yet another A he survived but my mother had to serve a prison term so my grandparents brought me up and i was told they were my parents until my mother showed up one day when i was eight and took me away from them and revealed that my nan was not my mother but she was my mother, i was so distressed that i had to shut my nan off because i wanted to be with her so much and blamed her for handing me back to my mother, my mother was so selfish by nature that put me in danger repeatedly). I cant help but not want nor welcome pain and react to it in the extreme by cutting people off, I dont like this trait in myself and wish i was more forgiving and less self-protecting but this instinct has been imbedded in me for such a long time now.

Regarding missing my husband i guess what im trying to say is that i miss who i thought he was, up util the affair he was pure and sweet (I was the only woman he had ever slept with and he was the only man i had slept with), He was shy and so so caring, he was innocent and almost childlike. Now I have had to realise he is a man, im no longer the only one he has been intimate with, he is capable of making horrific decisions etc.

I dont know how else do desribe it really, hes just not the man i married and all i can do is get to know him all over again, say goodbye to the love of my life and start again with someone who looks like him but is not him.

I understand exactly what you are going through emotionally. My husband and I were the first and only for each other and after 28 years together, married 25 I can honestly say I never wanted anyone else. I told my WH husband a while ago that i was hurt and devestated to realize that I was now the first woman he ever wanted in his bed, not the only. That realization literally shook me to the bone, made me sick to my stomach. I guess I never realized what a gift I took for granted. Never having to worry about anyone else, never trying to measure up to anyone else physically or emotionally. Now all that is gone, everything I do I wonder, did she? My story as far as I know did not prgress past the EA however, i still wonder about what he thought, felt, fantisized about regarding her. He has said he wanted her physiclly, there were thoughts and desires just not the opportunity. They shared favorite songs, jokes, thoughts...she invaded every private area of my life with my husband. He too, is only in the pictures of the past, he is different, i am trying to learn who this man is so that i can love him the way he needs it. my hope is that we can oneday look at the people in the photos and realize we are better, stronger, happier and more in love then we could have ever imagined. Hope........it is the thread that holds me together

barnboy, you have literally brought me to tears, that is exactly how i feel, what has and did happen. knowing someone else has/had his heart, mind, eyes crippled me. I use to be able to see myself in his eyes, I think that was the hardest thing to walk through. When we were working this out, i told him that and as the months progressed with plan a he use to ask me if i could see me in his eyes yet. i don't think he will ever understand that pain. I do see myself there most of the time, but I'm not sure that i recognize his eyes anymore. how sad, when does this stop being so so so sad.....

Blindsidebetty you have described exactly how i feel about WS PA, and unfortunately not many people understand that type of hurt as normally both partners would each have had intinate experiances with previous partners before marriage therefore the loss of being the only one etc is not present. In my case it wasnt planned and it wasnt a religious reason why my WS ended up being my one and only, but as we had got together at 18 and 19 there simply hadnt been anyone who i had been serious enough about to share myself with before WS. In his case he has always been shy with girls and although he had a girlfriend before me (who is now a great family friend and Godmother to our children) it never developed into a phisical relationship as they were both too young. This special bond that we shared became more importaint as our marriage developed, we both loved the fact that neither of us had previous sexual partners and really appreciated it. Now thats gone, and it kills me when i think about it. He used the same methods that he had developed with me in bed on her and that really upsets me, for example when she was unresponsive to him in bed he kissed her neck which is something he knew to do because thats something i liked, now i wont allow him near my neck, it makes me phisically sick him even talking about it, that was something i enjoyed that now he has destroyed.
However I do feel lucky as he never loved OW, even though he told her he did, this is something that WS has maintained even through the majorly foggy state, he explained that he told her he loved her because he wanted to make her feel special after she had shared herself with him phisically (little did he know at the time that she was an easy so and so and has had more sexual encounters than a professional prostitute).


PS daily update, we read first chapter of SAA and I can honestly say WS is absorbing information incedibly well, he is interested and learning from the book in a way that has exceeded my expectations. Looking forward to coaching on thursday as if the book is getting through to him then God only knows what Steve is going to do with him.

Only worrying thing about WS (and i mean this lightly) is that he has taken to making lists of stuff to do obsessivly, he has a list of things he wants to empathise with, a list of things he wants to do to show owning etc, its quite funny watching him being enlightened by MB is like he has discovered a treasure island and cant wait to start digging for treasure so making lists of all the things he need to start digging, the places he needs to start digging etc. Im getting really exited this might work after all, but then it could just be delerium as read SAA till 330 am had 2 hours sleep got up went to work, got home at 2pm and after housework/kids etc this is the first chance im getting to sit down and im past being tiered.

my WS and i were 16 and 18, we grew up together, i know how you feel about learningn each others wants, needs, desires and fulfilling them. Even though, for now this looks like an EA just the knowledge that he thought about what he wanted to do to her, that he master........to thoughts of her that he had songs that made him think of her, how could all this happen so quickly, how could 28 years of being the only one be thrown away so fast without a second thought.

i try to keep the thoughts out of my head when we make love, he also said now and then that he didn't, doesn't love her, he did not know her that well, which always cracks me up, he knew her well enough to start all this crap! but i hold tightly to the fact that he might be telling me the truth, i hope he doesn't love her, never did and never will

Blindsbetty, I dont beleive for one minute that any WS love the OW they get involved with because Loving someone means not duping them (telling them they are single etc when infact they are married) Loving someone doesent involve getting them involved in your own mess of family situation, marriage wrecking and most of all truly Loving someone does not involve the incredible cake eating selfishness WS take part in when having an A.
I think that WS are not capable of loving in any true sense when they are involved in wayward bubble.

Let me put it this way, if i was unahappy in my marriage and was unfortunate enough to meet someone else and start caring about them, i would make an effort to end my marriage first, i would then give myself time to recover from ending my marriage and make sure of my feelings towards marriage (a year would be the minimum time) and end contact with other person while i was doing this, then if a year or so on i have sorted my thoughts out i would start considering getting involved etc, thats the only way i would truly be able to show love for another human, not by dragging them in my mess, not by letting people think they are responsible for my marriage brakedown, not by giving people the chance to hate that person and let that person bear the guilt of the end of my marriage.

So in summary rest assured your WS never loved her and certainly doesent love her now as he is with you. Could you live with someone else if the person you loved was available to you?

Update of the day,

Hey everyone,
Things are getting better by the day, WS committing (a bit too much sometimes) to reading SAA, learinig about himself and even working on empathy, got home from work yesterday and didnt even get a chance to take my coat off before i was presented with massive list of empathy items that he feels when he tryes to put himself in my shoes. Was a nice thing for him to do and to put himself through although i would have appreciated apology following empathy as he now seems to have a tiny glimpse into my pain and apologising for what he did to me would have been perfect.

Reading SAA, have got past first chapters, last time we read it WS revealed another crushing intimate detail of A (basically one night OW and WS met at her parents house, they were out so she got covers downstairs and they spend 15-20 mins kissing under the covers, this was their first sexual contact so it really burned when i found out about it, at some stage she reached down and unzipped his pants and touched him, but when she realised he didnt have an erection she stopped and just cuddled) this took me by surprise and i literally jumped out of bed saying ewww ewww ewwww, i was really repulsed by that detail and as i thought i knew everything this latest detail catapulted me into horrid images of them two doing the nasty again. WS was good though because instead of sitting there like a lemon he helped me process images and get rid of them (this is MASSIVE progress).

Feeling more relaxed overall, however getting scared of coaching on thursday. Now that WS is cooperating with the MB principals its clouding my emotions and im unsure of what to tackle first.

Great thing happened yesterday and today and this is all about feeding my vindictive side but hey i got to get my kicks somewhere, its been a tough road and im finally smiling again. Basically WS manager from a store he used to work at just transferred to my WS store and is now in senior managment (basically above WS and OW), as my WS and this manager (lets refer to him as GG) have always been great friends as he also has an italian wife and lots of children and my WS used to get his advise on family life etc all the time. WS decided that as GG is a good friend he should tell him about A before he starts at the store so he wount feel betrayed when he hears about it from other members of staff rather than his friend my WS. GG was totally shocked and wanted to talk to me on the phone so I filled him in on the details of this OW carachter and behaviour has been etc and he was pleased that my WS and I had stuck together (I made a point of telling GG how strong me and WS are now because i didnt want him to think WS would still be dealing with A backlash at work therefore he is still a good employee and however much of a friend GG is he is still a senior manager.
GG told me that he will be keeping close eye on WS and OW for me and to rest assured he would phone me the minute he suspects anything as his W (that i have met a few times) would kill him if he didnt. GG then got back on the phone with WS and said "you lucky lucky Bast....., this was in the sense that he has a strong woman at home etc. I am pleased about this whole thing for two reasons, although WS is still changing jobs (waiting for interview to come through) i am assured that when he goes to work a person whom he respects etc is keeping eye on him, secondly when ws leaves job new managment will be aware of OW caracter and should she appoach another married man in store now she will get done big time. Today saw text from GG to WS saying "just met your OW, WTF? nevermind your wife, I would have slapped you if i had seen you with THAT!" Im still ROFL about that text. It took me 6 months to convince WS OW was really guly and no matter how many people told him she was he was adamant taht she wasnt pretty but not as ugly as i thought she was, now he is getting independant opinion , i rest my case, WS tect me from work 20 mins ago saying he saw her walk past today and finally dawned on him how ugly she is. Yipeeeee he has seen the light!!!!

All the good news over now for the depressing bit, im still not happy with what WS is doing, he seems to be working on himself all the time (HIS empathy, HIS owned list, HIS realisations) this is starting to get on my nerves, cause what about my EN's?? Hello its all good and well WS is working on being better person for us but this doesent help me right now!!! its a future thing, i want EA's met NOW!! I know i sound like a spoilt brat but the whole A was about him, the whole recovery is still about him, i just want something to be obviously about me.

Anyway thats where im at now,kids house and pets all in order again and work..... well thats a post for a different day (basically went from working in powerful company earning lots to cleaning floors at Macdonalds due to nervous brakedown post affair, where was his owning that one in his list??, I plan to train as a paramedic in December so please pray i get into the training program as its what i have always wanted to do and now i finally feel confident enough to apply)

brutally honest thank you for your response and in answer to your question, i am hoping to still be in love with this WH when he becomes available to me. he says he is now and in some ways he is. he is a different man, i hope better man as i hope i am a better woman, i hope we can be better together for each other. i can't ever imagine surviving this again. i know in my heart he didn't love/doesn't love her like he loves me, how could he. could 28 years really be that easy to erase with about 2 months? i would hope not and that is my hope. he says he's chosen to stay i just hope i can quit questioning why he is staying and how did all this happen. is it unrealistic to expect answeres?

Hey Betty, I wouldnt expect you to stop questioning anything, its your self protection mode. Have you read SAA with im. Its working wonders for us because it really explains alot.
Before SAA i though A happened to people who wanted to end their marriage but were too cowardly to tell their spouse so have A in order to make BS make the hard decision of splitting up. After SAA you realise that its actually very simple and basic, you and him both have emotional needs, if they arent met somehow you or him are likely to grab hold of someone who meets them. The EN's listed in the MB questionaire are simple and well set out, try printing out the Questionaire and doing it together, see what he is looking for and show him what you are looking for in order to achieve a better marriage. There is no such thing as crossing your fingers and hoping for the best take control of whats happening to you by understanding it.

we are waiting for our books as I type. We have done the EN questionairre, also the LB. So I am hoping that the book will give us some more direction, better defined direction to grow and recover this marriage. My whole story is on my thread, i'm swimming....but taking in water. i tell you, everytime i think i've found a harbor to float in a tsunami wave comes in and wipes me out. I guess after 7 months i want a little more remorse, apologies, heartfelt. even after reading all the threads that outline that these emotions are almost never there i still can't hope that maybe he will show some of these, like you said empathy alone just doesn't always cut it. he's willing to let me put in the hard work, don't know if he has even considered what his part in all this will be. dont get me wrong, he has come along way in meeting my needs, fessing up to what he did wrong and trying to make amends somewhat. but when the going gets tough or uncomfortable he backs off.aka NC Letter, he promises he will do it tonight after big blow-up last night. we will see, i've been waiting for this for 7 months.

Hey betty

You and me think so alike its scary. I wanted the apology groveling and just total surrender from him, and i still do but its just one of those things that the less i harp on about the more likely he might just do on his own one day.

The book surprised me so much, it just strips out all the stupid jargon that really gets you nowhere and gets you talking and communicating clearly with no room for misundertanding, Im never been the one to get self help books and was totally sceptical about this one but decided that it wouldnt hurt to try it and its been great, it explains things in a way even my "emotionally dead" WS can understand.

Have you tried getting WS to write an owned list like my WS did, that was the start of his personal recovery, just writing down the things he truly owns about the A, this means he has no way to justify etc. Maybe get him to read my WS thread to give him hope that he can do something to better the situation for both of you after all i do feel somewhat sorry for WS, it must be so hard being so much in the wrong, where do you start to fix it? The owned list gave my WS direction and has since made many lists stemming from that one that included the empathy one.

Regarding NC letter as im such a cow i would guilt him into it, ie you owe me this, if you do this i promise not to bring up A for 2 days etc. Bargain, guilt and trick if you have to, its not your fault he doesent get the importaince of NC letter, however he should understand by now that if it means so much to you he has to priorotise it. Do NC letter or sleep on the sofa tonight!

Hey brutallyhonest28
i do agree we seem to think alot alike, meybe that is why i feel so comfortable on your thread,however; i don't want to "thread jack" so forgive me if that is what this is. I haven't read your WS thread, when i realized you both were on here i guess i did't want or care what the WS had to say . having a problem caring about what mine says.

i consider myself a "self help" expert, always been the one to see the problem, find all i can find about it and decide which direction to take to fix it. that's how i tackled this whammy, went to my dr. went on anti-anxiety med, started seeing a therapist in hopes i could keep myself focused on the healthy aspects of coming out of this storm alive. found this site after therapist recommended it and really stayed silent for a long time, just soaking in all the comments and experience others had had. finally decided to post as an outlet for myself. i haven't told anyone about this except one real good friend in another state. so i started feeling overwhelmed with all this pent up emotion. also feeling guilty that others were going through what seemed to be so much worse, my story really doesn't compare, but then i thought well, its still my story, its still happening to me, it still hurts.

it does help to hear others say how their WS reacted and to see mine is following suit in alot of ways. I don't know what i'll do if he doesn't follow through with NC tonight, i know i will be hurt, and i worry that now after all this time, i am kind of weary of Plan A, but does he deserve Plan B? are we really there?

Hey BH, I can't work out exactly how much time you 2 have together at the mo and yes your husband should be doing lots to help you heal and telling GG was a fantastic step for both of you.

I found that I couldn't really begin to give my H time until I worked on me - I tried but he couldn't see that I was trying, which actually made me angry and resentful. Once I had done some work on me I was able to think more about his needs

He has done you a huge injustice and you are wanting to be compensated. He does have to work on himself though, other wise any fixes on the M will be superficial and fall apart very quickly.

However he should not use working on himself as an excuse not to spend time with you. I'm not sure what your ENs are but I know by reading the Harley books we were able to cover Conversation, affection, admiration and Oand H, I bet some of those are up there for you?

And I know that your time together is severely limited so you need to make the most of every second, plan out your time together carefully - play a game, get out a mail order catalogue and dream up a new room or decoration scheme and select you accessories or plan for Xmas together. (and reserve 1/2 hour to go through SaA

These will help to bring you together and he will begin to understand your needs more. Try to get some UA time in which doesn't involve working on M - just having fun or being productive together ( sad to say but me and my H actually enjoyed clearting out our airing cupboard together the other night).

ST

Hey Staytogether thanks for your thoughts,

Telling GG was really good because i now have an ally in that wretched store, i am still insiting he moves jobs and he is still going ahead with that however it is taking time and therefore having someone watching him was the best solution, this has just landed in my lap, i had no idea GG was moving to store until 2 days before he did. Met GG today again as had to pick him up from station because he was going to get lift to work with WS and WS was still eating lunch when GG arrived at the station so i offered to pick him up. This gave me golden opportunity to talk to GG about A without WS present however i behaved and just asked about his family etc.

As far as time together, thats just impossible to get ILawys not helpful due to WS grandmother having stroke shortly after A and this is keeping them busy with helping her out so i dont feel i am in a postition to ask them for help with childcare, infact i have been running around translating horpital lingo to them whenever H grandmother gets admitted, they were very scared because they are simple people and have not been in hospital situation in a long time so it helped that i went with them to talk to the doctors and make sure WH greandmother getting the right treatment. This has been very sweetly appreciated by inlaws as they have been extra supportive of our marriage. I have always got on well with them however MIL hurt me badly when she agreed With WS when he told her he didnt love me and she went as far as telling him that in her opinion he never did, he was with me because he was just attracted to "sad cases" (referring to my bad childhood). This conversation took place when he went to stay with them just before A started properely (however his mothers words only encoraged him to spend time with OW and this led to A intensifying later on during his stay at his parents) during a separation that i instigated frollowing the disovery of an EA on facebook with some other woman.

Oh this is getting tangled let me give you timeline maybe that will make more sense.

September 08- I discover Ws having massive EA with a woman in australia on Facebook, i aks him to send NC letter, he does. EA ends. Then a few days later discover WS has broken NC because he wanted to check she was ok (never mind the fact that i was literally on the bathroom floor sobbing during this contact). A week later he confessess to broken NC, I freack as i really couldnt understand his need to check that this stranger is ok yet not give two monkeys about my state of devastation. I ask him to go stay at his parents for 2 weeks to sort my thoughts out, i ask him to decide what he wanted, the family life i could offer him or be on his own. Gave him our love letters and family pictured accumulated during M and asked him to read them and try and see if this will help him make a decent decision (something he never did becaue he was building a friendship with OW and taking time to get to know her)

October 08 - Ws moves in with parents, he tells them he doesent love me anymore, they are aware of EA and support me in their own way by banning WS from using their PC while he is staying with them. At this stage EA on Facebook is truly over however OW starts to talk to WS at work, and then escalates this to text and phone calls asking regarding stuff to do with work. So instead of thinking about Family WS gets involved with OW and while he is at his parents house uses the opportunity to take her out for drinks as he is not made accountable for his whereabouts by them. Parents IL not aware of any of this going on and MIL has above mentioned chat with WS, only convincing him further that he shouldnt come home. MIL comes over for visit with children and "lets slip" that WS will be persuing permanent separation. I freack, however keep my calm around her and have panik attack while picking up children from nursery, nursery staff call WS tell him to come from work to see to the situation, (WS tells work im not coping because we have separated, this information gets to OW and she intensifies persuit of my H), Ws arrives at nursery i have left there and gone to a friends house with the children as she lived nearby and basically couldnt breathe properely was feeling incredibly embarassed by nursery staff witnessing my panik attack and just wanted to get out of there, Ws arrives at my friends house and shouts abuse at me telling me he doesent love me etc. Friend is shocked by his behaviour tell him to take me home. I got home first (we were driving separate cars). Ws arrives and decided that due to the fact im not emotionally coping he will move back in to look after kids etc. I agree.

October 08- D Day.

I spend night after night crying about Ws not loving me anymore however go into mega plan A, I arrange dates for us, candlelight surprises when he gets in from work and much more however WS still adamant he doesent love me (despite mega tearful eyes after one date when i asked him to look at me and tell me he didnt love me and he couldnt, he also has major jelouse fit at poor 19 year old supermarket check out guy just for talking to me) We both agree to work on M and not separate. At this stage i am totally not aware of A and WS and OW are in full A mode, having PA and making plans for the future, OW told me in email that these plans included her looking after my children (something WS denies to this day).

D-Day, i look into what WS has been looking up on google and discover hotel search and bowiling ally search ask him about it WS confesses to having become "good friends" with someone at work and wanted to spend time with her, I advise him that I would not accpet that under my roof and if she was just friends why hide it from me? (he explains hotel as he was researching venues for Work xmas party i dont really think about that side of it any further). Ws admits thats wrong swears on kids lives they have never had any phisical contact and that it was purely a friendship. Tells me that when he gets to work that evening he will meet with OW and tell her that they cannot be friends anymore. I ask over and over again, if you are just friends why do you need to end it etc?? dont get much of a reply to that one. While WS is at work i get friends round for moral support they all agree something is fishy about this situation, I persue WS for details of OW, then remember that a few weeks back we had raw about an email OW sent him that i thought was inappropriate, thank goodness i saved the email in a secret directory, took email out and got all her details, emailed her the following the next day. Ws aware of me emailing her but still keeping poker faced because he thought she wouldnt reply

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Hi >>>>>
you probably can figure out who i am and why ia m writing to you but please understand that i do not wish you any harm or malice i just think that its only right you hear things from my side too in order for me to move on and hopefully help you too.
I know that you have been seeing my husband and the heartbreaking bit about that is that he has told me that he has told we were separated when in fact we werent, he was here under the agreement that we were working on things and that we were trying to rebuild our life thats why this situation has devestated me.
He is still sleeping with me, he was still taking me out, he was still making an effort to spend time together and got very gelouse if i even looked at another guy so how on earth was i to psychically figure out he wanted a separation plus he was still planning a future with me.
I dont know all the details of what happened between you two but he has promised that nothing phisycal ever took plance and that is the only reason why i am looking to try and get over what he just did.
I dont blame you however i do think that maybe you should have thought a bit harder about beeing with someone who is still iving at home with his wife and kids despite the fact that he has led you to beleive he was separated.
WS has just shown me the text you sent him and i do really feel sorry for you but please give us the space and time to be able to sort out the mess you and him created. He has now wholeheartedly chosen me and the kids and although i dont know how long this choice will last i know that i have 4 little innocent children to think of so you see i have no choice but to beleive that he wants to be here and wants to make it work this time.
I am truly sorry that you got hurt in this process however its not my fault so please dont hate me , i have been begging WS for3 days to call you and explain how he lied but he is petrified that you will cause a sene and cost him his job but i still think that he is being a total coward and thats the one thing i really cant get over, i cant get over that he has supposedly risked our marriage over someone he doesent even think is worth some honesty and thats for you to sort out with him as it has nothing to do with me, i have done my bit ihave made my self known and told you my side its up to you to do what you need to do with it.
In the meantime this is my number xxxxx should you have any questions that need answers as i doubt your going to get a reply from the coward.
Please respect the choice he has made however wrong you think it is adn stop harassing him about how heartbroken you are when in fact you got yourself in this situation.
Ill ensure that he moves stores as soon as possible to minimise damage and next time you want to get together with a married man just give his wife a thought for a change reather than just think of yourself. thats the only bit i am angry with you about and im sorry if it sounds rude but lets face it you and him hurt me beyond beleif.
I dont know if i should expect a reply or even any acknowledgement but either way take care of yourself.
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OW replyes ... continued on next post hold on

OW replyes the following



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i wouldn't worry, i won't be talking to him ever again, if someone who supposedly loved me, and believe me he did tell me that, can put me and you through this, they don't deserve a hello from me, i'm not some crazed lady who stirs up trouble for nothing, the feeling was there, on both sides! Why else would i care!? We've both been lied to, obviously, don't feel sorry for me, i'm resiliant i'll bounce back nicely, i feel sorry for you cos he's still lying to you, even now, if you feel better for believing different, thats your choice and i hope your happy together, i truly do. trust me, there's no way i'd even spit on him in a fire, please feel free to ask me anything you feel you need to know, i'm an honest person and you'll get the absolute truth, i didn't do this to hurt anyone if he'd have been honest and said you was living together all this time this wouldn't have happened, believe me!



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Please note at this stage I had no idea at to this stupid cows character and i had no knowledge of the many married men she had been with before my WS so I was still being nice and sent the following





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Firstly thank you sooo much for replying because all this time he has been saying that nothing ever got that far, he said you never discussed the future, he said the only reason you agreed to see him was becasue he told you he was living with me because i was unstable and he needed to look after me which i total bull crap, i go to work look aftrer the kids and yeas i did bloody go mad at him when he pulled something this similar a few months ago when he was had to go home from work and meet me to discuss it as i had kicked his sorry [censored] out for2 weeks. then he came back and decided to stay together and work at our marriage.

I didnt think that this is your fault i just didnt understand how he could supposedly tell you he was living with me and you agree to see him which i can see now thats not the case and thank you so much for clarifying this.

obviousely not i have a few questions and please please do me a favour and try to answer them as i now trust you will be honest with me as i will be with you.

1) how long has it been going on? he says 4-5 weeks

2) have you had any phisicall contact a part from a cuddle when you have had a cigarette which is what he said.

3)what exactly did he tell you about me? cause he says he just told you that i wasnt coping which is crap.

4)what future plans you had cause he says there where none, he said it was a just lets see where this goes once he offiically leaves me (something apparently he was trying to do but never really gave me any idea as explained in my previous email)

5) did you ever go out together he says jsut once to the pub, and otherwise he just came over to your house breafly. he said otherwise you met aftrer work just for 20 -0-30 mins a total of 7 times.



Im so xxxx off cause i gave him chance afrer chance to come clean and all he does is make me feel that i am in the wrong.

thank you so much for replying xxxx i really appreciate it. i really do.

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And as this email was being sent WS was literally pacing up and down the living room so i knew there wasnt any good news to come of it, as kids were present advised we go to bedroom to talk, there he fessed up to having Sex with her, i react as described in my first post





this is the crushing email i got back from her



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no problem, i didn't want to cause you heartache, i feel for you trust me, we went to a hotel, twice, each time i had to pay on my card and he gave me the cash so you wouldn't see where the money had been spent, we slept together both times, i'm so sorry to tell you that, but i don't do lying as he full well knows, he told me he loved me nearly everytime we've spoken which was every day for the last 2 weeks or so, i still have messages to that effect, he always said that i WAS his future, hence my lack of knowledge he was never actually planning to leave you, he even asked if i was able to cope with 5 kids, as i have one myself, we went for a meal both times we stayed at the hotel and then cinema after this time, never has it only been 30 minutes or so after work, more like a couple of hours, and there was definately more then hugging going on, i'm so so sorry to tell you like this i really am, but you deserve the truth and thats what i'm telling you, i swear on my daughters life all of this is true.

And, its been going on for a couple of months now, that night he left work he rang me and told me its cos you weren't coping with separation, and to wait for him to contact me, which he did the next day and just so you know, if i'd have known any of what your saying about you working things out, i'd have stayed well away, i have more self respect then that, and certainly have been bought up with the morals not to wreck a home.

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And here it is folks yes that was the moment my heart totally broke and this is why im not moving on from A, I needed him to hate her and needed him to get his revenge for the both of us.



I know i started this post replying to Staytogether and now its escalated to details of A but I think that some of you might be judging me for being moody and not lapping up WS attempts at marriage building, All i can say for myself is that i was betrayed and lied too so much (even by inlaws that I loved so much) im not prepared to let my guards down until this WS gets off his backside and show me he is no longer the manipulative idiot who caused me the unbarable pain.



Ps also note how OW catches herself in a lie in emails first saying she didnt know he was living at home then changing it to she didnt know we were working at M. She knew full well and that�s why she never ever asked WS about the state of our M, she never asked what he got up to at home etc, she just took her pound of flesh and enjoyed the attention she was getting from any man nevermind his family or kids. I truly dispise her.



After this contact with her i did go and meet up with her and gave her cuddle as thought she had been duped by my WS and felt sorry for her and thought as both been duped by same man we could support eachother, but then i discoverd her past and her manipulations and all hell broke loose, This is why i am adamant about going to the Xmas party, its about getting revenge for her making a total fool out of me and i cant tell you what i have planned all i can say is watch this space, don�t worry I wont physically hurt her in any way but the psychological games I have planned for her that evening will have her crying for mercy.



Today I feel hate, I feel anger and I feel resentment for OW and WS. So I guess that�s my update.



Staytogether ill reply to your post when im in better frame of mind.

Was in the middle of posing this when site went down last night lucy i had saved my post on words phew.

Hi BH,

I'm trying to read the emails, but I want to wish you the best when you talk to Steve today. You are doing the very best thing by coaching with him. Please come back as soon as you can to tell us how things went.

When are you likely to hear whether H has been shortlisted for the job?