Hey TM,

Good to hear from you.

Tossin' aside my personal experiences (all of which were warranted, by the way), CAT is well versed in operating "tools" other than that 2x4......

TB

Really?

Oh, I didn't mean that in a bad way. Sometimes we need a reality check and you are really good at pointing out what is staring us in the face.

TM,

My personal response would be to "let it be" and let him contact you if he wants to. You have not told him he is not welcome have you??? Plan A would suggest contacting him, but my thought is that if he doesn't want to see you, then suggesting that you two get together would be pushing him, and most WS' don't like being pushed.

If you have a reason to contact him, like you need to know where your attorney is to send documents, then do so. If you have some other reason do so.

I would let him do the work at this point, but I would also let his family that you are more than willing to talk with him if he wants to.

God Bless,

JL

Hi JL,

Thanks for dropping by.

I wasn't really planning on suggesting a get together with WS. In theory, I shouldn't even know when he is visiting next.
The purpose of my e-mail would be to let him know that I am not not contactable. Before I knew about OW, I read SAA and gave my copy to WS. He could be aware of Plan B and think that I am in it, when I am not.

The course I hope to do is on a subject that he is heavily interested in. So it seemed like a good reason to make contact in a non-pushy way. Like a "I saw this and thought of you" kind of thing.

I do want to put the onus on him to contact me when he is here, if he wants to. I am not going to do any chasing on that front.

I haven't spoken with his family in the UK for a while but they should know that my position regarding our marriage hasn't changed - I sent them messages at Christmas which suggested as much. Plus I have been writing to his aunt who we are close to and she is being very supportive, which is nice. I try not to think of his US brother. It just makes me too angry!

Many thanks,

TM

Update:

WS just phoned, 8 weeks after the last contact. We chatted nicely for a while, just like old friends. He said people there had said not to contact me in order to give me time to think. He confirmed that the status message updates were meant for me - he has no other contacts on his messneger. He has now deleted his status update. He wanted to know how I am and what have I been doing. He seemed keen to know whether I had met anyone. He kept saying he was ringing to see how much I had moved on.

He said the situation where he is is the same. He had to spend Christmas and New Year in US (Vegas) because of US government not liking people coming back and forth too much. I said it was sad he didn't get to spend that time with his family when they might be emigrating in 6 months. He said he had fun going to parties etc.

I told him I knew when he was visiting UK next after he refused to tell me (I think he was scared I would turn up at the flat because he is bringing OW with him). He confirmed and said did I want him to take stuff from the house. I said no, his stuff doesn't bother me. I asked what he wanted, I could take it to the flat. He said he didn't know. I said there is nothing important here. We might as well wait until he his back permanently.

Again, he refuses to tell me when that will be. He says he doesn't know. It might be another year. I mentioned that his bosses should know and he said that he would tell them that a crazy person from UK might phone. He said that he already told them we are separated. I asked if they felt bad that they might be partially responsible and he said no.

He said he wants to help me heal and I said he knows how best to do that. He said well, I don't seem to have moved on at all. I said I am in a place where I am open minded. I am happy within myself and have taken this opportunity to improve myself and eliminate the things about myself that I don't like.

I told him that OW had texted me at Christmas. I said there was no swearing but I didn't like the tone. He couldn't believe a) she would go through his phone and b) she would text me.
I said well it had to be her. It was definitely in reply to the message I had sent him. He said he never got a message. Well, she must have deleted it then.

He said he didn't know when he would contact me agin - he was still dealing with the fall out from my FB exposure. I said well when people do something wrong, they have to take the consequences.

At no point was divorce mentioned. ???

Can anyone tell me what is really going on here?

Thanks,

TM

Nope...well yes I can.

He is cake eating. He is seeing if you are still his for the taking if things don't work out. He's just checking to see if his safety blanket is still in place in case OW turns out to be someone he does like/love all that much. The phone deal should have him thinking before he jumps out of the airplane that is your marriage.

Other than that I really don't have a great advice except to enjoy your life.

God Bless,

JL

I am NO VET but that is what I got from that conversation too. He doesn't want to make any concrete decisions about things and he wants to see if he still has you on the line. That is just my humble opinion but that was what was SCREAMING at me. I know that must have been hard, and part of me is glad that I am in Plan B so I don't have to deal with this kind of thing from my WH.

Hi folks,

Thanks for stopping by.

Yes, that was the impression I got as well. I think it is good that he knows I am willing to talk. However, he must also be beginning to realise from the way I speak that reconciliation will be on my terms. I am not a pushover.

When we talked about him coming back permanently, the only thing he said about wanting to stay there, is that it is sunny. Surely, if he were happy with OW, she would be the reason for him wanting to stay there?
When he again asked me how I knew so much I wouldn't tell him but did say the OW is not the sharpest tool in the box (Yeah, I know, he said!) and she leaves a 3 mile trail behind her.

I am thinking all is not well in affair fantasyland. Unfortunately for WS, he doesn't realise how much I actually am moving on and enjoying myself. I could really do with knowing when this assignment is finishing. WS mentioned another year but I don't know if I can live in limbo for that much longer. I really would like someone to love and who will love me in return and I can't start looking whilst I am in limbo.

Thanks,

TM

This can be WH just trying to keep you as his back up plan so he has a place to come back home to when job is over.

Time to plan B WH. Make him think you may not wait forever.

However after three months then you should file for D because WH appears to be a fence sitter. This will force his hand to decide where he wants to be. Then either way this mess will end.

IMO, the only way he will ever come back to you at this point is if you file for divorce and show him you DON'T need him any more. And that cheating results in losing you. Period.

You can always remarry.

TheRoad / catperson,

Thanks for responding. I tend to agree with you. However, I really don't want a divorce, even now I would rather give the marriage a second chance. If I threaten I have to be prepared to carry it out.

I suppose, if he agreed to divorce it would indicate his true state of mind and I don't want to hold out for something that is never going to happen.

If we divorced, I think that would be it. I can't see how we would see each other again. There would be no reason to.

This is such a huge decision to make. As TheRoad suggests, I think I will be best lying low for a few more months and re-evaluate then.

Thanks for your input.

TM

Well, WS is in UK and just called to tell me that he has negotiated with his bosses to transfer over to the US offices for the indefinate future.

I asked him what this means for us, what did he want to do and he kept saying that we had drifted apart, and I don't get on with his family. I said that was rubbish and he is just making excuses for his bad behaviour.

Unfortunately, I then got upset and LB'd and tried to explain how I thought this had all happened. I know, I know it is futile.
What upset me a lot was the fact that he told his brother before he told me. I called him a coward for not telling me face to face. He said that last time he was nice and civil face to face I e-mailed everyone on FB. I don't know what he is referring to here because the last time we had a proper conversation face to face was in August when I chose to visit him in US. The FB exposure was in November. Just wayward fog, I suppose.

I said that I wasn't going to hang around waiting while he is in an affair and would need his addresses in order to start proceedings. I asked him to think really hard about the decision he is making because he would be effectively losing 20+ years of personal history because he could no longer reminisce with me. Are you prepared to lose me, I asked? He said that he has always wanted to live and work in US and I agreed and said that I assumed that sort of long term planning would be done together as a couple. He seems to think that living in US and living with me are mutually exclusive.

I suppose I could start proceedings and make it real slow. When he transfers to US he will be on US wages and holidays with no car or apartment paid for, I think. So I think things will be tough for him as he pays for OW stuff too. OW may even lose interest when he has less money but if he sells the flat in London he will have a tidy sum from that. It depends on whether he can cut all ties to the UK or not. If I get what I think as a financial pay off he may have to sell the flat to fund it.

The thing is that I am so confused because I don't want WS back as he is now. I am frustrated because I have learnt so much here that I want to practise it on DH but I don't know if he can ever be DH again, even if he wanted to. And I don't want to waste any more time pursuing an illusion.

I'm sorry for rambling on. I am not as upset as I thought I would be. I suppose I have had a long time to get used to the idea. It's just very very sad because I truly think that we are meant for each other and I (stupidly) thought we could be a success story.

Thanks for listening.

TM

I just finished speaking to WS. He wanted to discuss further what we had talked about on Tuesday (divorce).

I told him that I absolutely did not want a divorce. WS had spoken with Steve in July so I repeated some of the things that he had heard then. I expressed again my belief that now all our cards are on the table that we can make a proper attempt at a second chance because in the past when we had talked and WS had said he would try harder, that wasn't a second chance because I was still living in the dark as to what the real problem was.

He kept saying that we had drifted apart. I disagreed and said that throughout our adult lives I had told people that WS is the most clever and intelligent person I know yet now I cannot understand why he doesn't "get" the correlation between what he was doing outside of our marriage and his changing feelings inside the marriage.

He again said that he wanted to be friends and I said I wanted that more than anything else in the world but I can't talk to him knowing that OW is there, in the background. I told him some of the things that she had written on her FB page which he may not have picked up. For example, when it was his birthday she put no reference to it. The Halloween party that he paid for wasn't even called WS Birthday party. It is all about her and what she can get him to pay for.

He asked about the procedure for divorce, except strangely thoughout the conversation, he never referred to it as such. He always said if we go down that route or if we do those proceedings. He said that it seemed like I would be trying to punish him by asking for what I am entitled to. I said, no I don't do divorce I do marriage and all that would be dealt with by the lawyers.

I said although some people who don't know better have told me months ago to divorce many have encouraged me to try to reconcile because divorce is so nasty and so expensive. I said it is such a waste to throw away 20+ years just because you don't see how I would fit into the US life.

He said he likes the lifestyle, he likes OW and he is happy there.

I said I could not live in an emotional vacuum for much longer. But I refuse to commit adultery. Two wrongs don't make a right. I asked him to think long and hard about what he is deciding because if we did divorce, even if I was the petitioner it would be his choice, not mine. I left him with the words that I do not want a divorce and he will never find anyone who loves him the way I do.

Steve said that I shouldn't do Plan B so I was in Plan A (from afar) up until the end of November when I became really tired of it so took a step back. I continually update my status message on instant messenger and knew WS could see that. He started to update his status also which was intended for me 3 weeks later and then last Monday he called me. He called again Tuesday (see my post from then) and again today.

What is your plan?

My plan is to get an initial consultation with a lawyer to get my facts straight.

Then I will give him a couple of months with no direct contact from me to see if he changes his mind. If he doesn't, I will start proceedings. However, he may well decide that it is the best thing to do and ask me to go ahead. I asked him why he didn't start proceedings and he said that he had no grounds. I had done nothing wrong.

I will probably drag things out because he said himself that he has been living in fantasy land and the real world is going to be tough. I envisage his relationship with OW becoming strained with less money to spend and I have the idea that he doesn't feel as strongly about her as she does about him.

But, having said all that, I can't wait forever. I am no Queenie!

Thanks. Now I just have to follow it through.