I would save them, but I'm SUPERMAN...That's just how I roll...DUDE

I'm not going to make the need for an apology as a prerequisite for recovery my "hill to die on." I never meant that.

But the evidence that recovery without a remorseful WS is difficult if not impossible is all over this board on a daily basis. It permeates and dominates this forum.

I'd like to hear from any BSs whose marriages are recovered but whose spouse was NEVER remorseful and never owned their betrayal.

otter, I said all those things while under the MIS - impression that your wife had had an AFFAIR. I took you at your word. And then I saw the actual emails that revealed there was nothing inappropriate said whatsoever. It was not a romantic exchange. Sure, it was deceitful of your wife to do it, but to try and call it an "affair" is a ridiculous stretch. In light of the information that came out since I made those remarks, consider everything I said retracted. And I will state again that it is ludicrous to equate a 10 year affair with a one day email exchange with an old lover. It is absolutely insulting to me and I don't appreciate it.


Relax, otter. You can stand up to a little criticism and analysis from little ol' me. No, I don't agree with everything you write or advise. Scripture is the only written word that can be trusted carte blanche. I do not believe your word is infallible and that every word uttered from your mouth is gospel. That kind of hero worship and reverence for an individual, no matter how brilliant they are, is dangerous in my opinion. Wouldn't you agree?

Are you calling your wife a "wayward spouse," otter?

If POSOM was burning on the side of the road, I would put out the flames AFTER I knew he had 3rd degree burns on 75% of his body. Recovering from severe burns is one of the most painful roads imagineable...

This is not evidence of anything since the preponderance of cases here are unrecovered cases.[for various reasons] Those in recovered marriages tend to move on. A better guage of your chances of recovery would be Dr Harley who sees both unrecovered and recovered cases, and sees both spouses. Dr. Harley would obviously be a much more accurate judge of your chances of recovery since he has overseen thousands of cases over a 35 year period, wouldn't you agree?

The fact that you are overlooking his obviously expert, experienced viewpoint in favor of anecdotes from the internet reveals to me that you are not looking for accurate feedback but for validation.

So, you're saying that secretly emailing an old lover for four days and telling them that you still think of them is "nothing inappropriate said whatsoever"?

You want to prove me wrong so badly, Mel, that you are saying foolish things.

My wife, on her thread before it was lost, told a poster (Zelmo, I believe) that she was beginning to see that her comments and tone in her emails could have come across as "romantic." She also said the three days of emails before she apologized to her ex-lover were "unnecessary and inappropriate." Of course, she has never told ME this.

T/J....

Hey Mel, I posted that recipes for the spinach salad ....didn't know if you saw it or not....


Not2fun

ps.....I cannot believe we are going down this road AGAIN....

I don't deny that I like to be validated, Mel. There is nothing wrong with that.

But that was not my purpose for my first reply to you on this thread.

I am not overlooking Dr. Harley's viewpoint. I mostly agree with and like his viewpoint on almost every issue regarding recovery.

And THEN piss on him! Brilliant!

Of course there is always the endless cycle of drowning and resuscitations to consider.

Sorry, otter, but those emails were in no way romantic and you know it. It was her contact with an old lover that was inappropriate, not the content of her communication. It can't even be called an affair.

I am not trying to minimize your hurt from this betrayal but lets not get ridiculous here about the true nature of her betrayal. Sure, it would have likely LED TO an affair, but there is a huge difference between an affair and "could lead to."

Neither can I. I'm out of here.

I think you'd be hard pressed to find such, since if the marriage is truly recovered the couple are IN LOVE WITH EACH OTHER...Mr. W said last night that my apologies to him have never registered as an event, and I still apologize to him sometimes even now, almost 5 years later - and he will tell me he doesn't need it - what does register and what he will always need is a wife interested in putting him first - meeting his needs - protecting him with EPs - A WIFE THAT IS IN LOVE WITH HIM - THAT kind of JUST COMPENSATION is just what the Doctor ordered...All of that came to Mr. W NOT because he demanded it Ottert, but because he was/is LOVABLE...

Ottert, BE LOVABLE...Work the program...Read your posts here - ask yourself if your wife were reading them would you sound lovable to her...

Mrs. W

Man, I need to have my head examined, but I couldn't let it pass when he made an equation between my XH's 10 year affair [we are divorced and he is still with the OW] and his wife's emails with an old lover.

And thanks for posting the spinach salad recipe! I can't wait to make it.

(One last thing. I posted this over in MB 101 in reply to a poster who asked if emailing someone was an affair. This is my last word on this thread).

I'll let a couple of other posters speak for me, because I can't say it any better than they did.

This part of a post from Barnboy:



And this is from a poster whose name I can't recall who posted on my old thread. The post was lost in The Great Disappearance, but luckily I saved his words:


_________________________

Mel~

Every response (so far) that claims a continued desire to inflict some level of cosmic revenge on the OTHER PERSON has come from those who did not recover their marriage. It's not an accident. If a marriage is to survive infidelity, a measure of GRACE must be allowed to enter the BS heart. Once the betrayed spouse has assumed that GRACE, it becomes more difficult to work up a frenzy of flames and piss for the OP. The growth in spirit that must come if there is to be a reconciliation has a profound effect on both spouses. WS and BS alike. In absence of that event, continued burning/torture/shaming of the OP in effigy is possible.

In other words, you are correct.

I want to be out of here, but dear Lord...

Mrs. W

For the umpteenth time, I DO NOT DEMAND APOLOGIES FROM MY WIFE!!!

Now, if you say that me posting here because I have nowhere else to go to vent is "demanding" something of her, you may be right. I have tried to stay away from here. But the frustrations mount and I need someplace to go to get things off my chest. Plus, there are issues that still bug me and I like to come here and discuss them. It is never intended to seek validation and it is never anything I discuss with MrsOttert.

I would point out that Barnboy, nor SDCWman [that is who your 2nd quote is from] are the EXPERTS here, ottert - nor do either of them have what you profess to want - a recovered marriage...I would be far more interested in what Dr. Harley says if I were you...

Mrs. W

Mel, please show me the post where I equated your XH's affair to my W's emails with her old lover. You came up with that out of thin air because I did not do it.

Ottert, dear man, Mrs. O is the ONLY one that can give you what you need though...PLEASE, I beg of you, put your emotions aside and just work the program...I swear you'll be glad you did...The type validation that you seek here will never be salve to you...working the MB program will though...please...

Mrs. W