I guess I'm not part of the majority here, but I don't think there's anything wrong with SW telling her boy that that woman is a homewrecker.
Sure, the WxH was the one who broke the vows of the marriage, but she was a willing partner. Nothing wrong with telling son that she played a big role in this.
Not saying to tell son to be rude to the woman, but certainly, this particular woman doesn't deserve friendship. If WxH one day brings a normal, non-cheating woman into the picture, by all means, be friendly.
Just because they lasted long enough for divorce doesn't mean you should now sanction their relationship. They are both bottom feeders, and there's nothing wrong with telling son that, IMO.
But you know what? I'm not a very forgiving person, so you might want to discount my opinion. I feel bad for your sitch, though.
That's one of the reasons I absolutely don't want to divorce.

Ok. I've thought about this all morning....not liking a lot of what you guys are saying, but weighing it carefully and wanting to do the right thing. Discussed it with ds again and discovered a few things.
1)He thought the separation agreement where his dad agreed to not have any women around ds was still in place.
2)He very much thinks I would be hurt if he wanted to be around OW.
3)He has discovered a man is interested in me and apparently he feels the same way about the OW and this man that I am talking to...basically he doesn't care...just doesn't want me to be mad at him.

So I cleared all of that up with him. Told him his dad and I are legally divorced and the rules are different now..that the only stipulation is that neither of us can have overnight guests (of romantic nature) while we have ds in our custody.

I explained that I do not care what his dad does anymore...that we aren't married and of course we will both go on to date. I did tell him that it hurts me that his dad would bring OW into his life, but that I am in no way being hurt BY ds. I told him life goes on. He flat out asked me, 'so I can be around OW?' I nearly choked but I said, 'If she is part of your dad's life son, she is probably going to be part of your life and that is just the way it is going to be.' He was very relieved by all of this. I did tell him we just had to learn lessons from things we live through and I hope he will learn right from wrong.

Later I asked him if he thinks I hate his dad. He responded immediately, 'no.' But he does think his dad hates me. I asked him why he thinks that...he said, 'oh I don't know...just the way he talks to you and stuff.' So I told him I don't hate his dad and I'm glad that he 'gets' that.

So how is that?

If anyone can find one thing I've done right I'd sure be open to hearing it about right now. I'm more sad today than I've been in 8 months.

SW...I know it must be hard, especially when there aren't enough other people around in real life to talk to, and with your son being so 'adult like' for all his years, it's still not right to try and instill your hatred of this woman on him.

You have a really smart boy there, SW...much to your credit. Even if he couldn't put 2 and 2 together right now in terms of what his father did wrong, does it matter? Does it matter that your son hate her as much as you do? Does it matter that your son think like you do? Later...later when he gets older...he will look back on all of this, and he will formulate his own opinions, and I don't think he will disappoint you. They say that we raise our children until they're about 10 years old. After that, their friends and outside influences finish raising them. Stop worrying about whether or not you've done a good job instilling good morals in your son.

You and your son have a long journey to his adulthood. If you both had to walk on foot through the rest of your time with him at home, would you force him to carry both his own baggage and yours? You'd go through it, declutter all the junk you didn't need to make your load lighter, and you'd carry your bags yourself.

Hang in there, SW!!! We really do care about you. We know it must be hard. Be good to yourself tonight, okay? Do something fabulous for yourself? A bubble bath? Favorite take out? Something.

So, ima, what kind of encounters do you envision when ds goes to be with his dad? Since, of course, the ds has no say in who his dad is around? Should he be nice to this person because of the Golden Rule? Should he be blunt with her and ruin everyone's time together and cause his father to be around him less and less? Should he set out to ruin their relationship, and set himself on a course for meddling and 'truth-telling'?

Sorry, but I choose to suggest that you say your piece and then tell your son you want him to be in a loving relationship with his father no matter what. That we will meet a lot of people we don't agree with, but they are nothing to us, because we choose to rise above such things. Far greater lesson to learn, IMO.

Stella you have the worst image of me possible. What you said above is absolutley not true. Our conversation yesterday when ds brought it up and again today when I brought it up to FIX it are the only time I've discussed her or his terrible qualities in months. I do not go around venting to my son. There is no truth to this.

And btw, you keep talking about the $10 allowance as if I must be very stupid or just doing it to make ds hate his father. It is $10 a week and I DO NOT HAVE IT. I will have it once the house sells and WxH starts paying me the full amount he will be paying me...but I don't have it.

I am not punishing him. I am trying to keep the heat on and food on the table.

There's a difference between one parent alienating another and sharing why one has boundaries about certain behaviors.

IMVO, parental alienation caused by another parent is not great on so many levels.

I grew up in an intact family. With lots of parental alienation. I grew up thinking that my marriage partner was NOT entitled to have emotional needs because of that. I grew up thinking that I had to be right at all times, and my marriage partner was in the wrong, nearly all of the time. No matter what.

It IS possible to keep opinions/name calling, etc to oneself while sharing facts with another.

That was great, SW.

fwiw, I don't think you're doing anything wrong, really. I just wish you could learn to not be so black and white. I think your church gives you a conviction of 'rightness' because you follow it so closely. But, just like your marriage, there is no real black and white. It's a very valuable lesson for your son to learn.

And please note how important it was to him how YOU felt about HIM. He needs to keep hearing from you that he can have his own thoughts, not dependent on what makes YOU happy. He is so extraordinarily close to you that he will have a hard time doing this on his own. He needs your help in that.

Cat I guess what *I* envision is that ds be allowed to express his feelings about this OW to his dad and let his dad make the decision about whether or not she is worth it. For you to say that if ds 'ruins' everyone's fun and that would be his fault if his dad quit wanting to be around him....? Wow....how about his dad be the responsible adult and keep her away from our son for now?

But anyway, I guess it doesn't matter because ds is so curious about this OW and her son he can't stand it. He will meet her, soon I think, and he will probably have fun with her young son...Soolee he is only about 6 so no real worries about bad influence on my son or any danger.

SW-
I think you did good.

If this were to come up again, next time, what would you think about telling your son that you will deal with your feelings, but that your son is not responsible making you feel any certain way?

I am hoping you can get that part time job soon. Then you will be able to afford the $40 a month allowance. Hey you could babysit a neighbor's child for two hours and earn that $40 bucks. You can glean foods free. You can buy day old bread. Day old meats. You can eat canned food and save money. You can sell some stuff on ebay. You can have a garage sale.

There are 1000 things you can do other than "wait until the house sells". or "wait for money from the ex".

SW I am so glad you had that talk with your son about his feelings about his Dad and the OW. That took a lot of pressure off the son. Good job there.

Sorry SW. We crossed posts. I'm glad you had that conversation with your son. Sounds like a lot was cleared up. I know it must be hard.

I'm trying to think of some way you can see your son just a little bit differently, not so adult, maybe, and I just can't. I think this is just going to be something you have to try and be more conscious of. Protecting him...protecting his relationships...trusting your work so far with him...knowing that a good judge of character at some point has to be independent of other people's opinions and influences.

It doesn't mean you lie to him. It just means you know enough to tell him that he doesn't need to know all the details at his age. He just needs to be a kid, do his homework, stay out of trouble, and be happy.

Well for what it is worth, and I'm new here; I think you did a good job with your son. If my DH is having an affair,it will take all I have not to tell the kids that he and his whore is a part of what broke up our marriage.

I guess I don't think a child's allowance is that important. Millions of kids all over the world never see a dimes allowance and life goes on. Our lives have been seriously interrupted through no fault of MINE or ds's, and we just have to live with the consequences....we are also going to have to downsize in house Stella...what should I do about that? Take on several jobs so I can keep ds in his current standard of living?

I am not sure why you are so hung up on this allowance thing.

And btw, no one around here pays $20 an hour for babysitting. I could take on a child to care for all day and make maybe $80 per week. But considering I won't be living in this area once we move, I don't think it would be fair to commit to watching a child that I might not be able to keep watching in 2 months. I've determined the best thing for now is to tightend the money belts and do without a few luxuries.

I'm already feeding us on nearly nothing. I bring home leftovers from my mom, the neighbor feeds us a lot, and I buy the cheapest of EVERYTHING we have to have. Trust me Stella, I'm the queen of frugality.

I did say this to him today. Almost word for word. I dont want to lie to him and make him think I'm all good with this OW and the relationship she has with my Wxh...but I did tell him it is not his burden to carry. HIs job is to be 9 and have a relationship with his dad and if that includes OW, then so be it.

I guess this is where I get confused about MB..because the advice I got when I discovered the affair was very much to tell ds the truth (age appropriately). I am glad I told him the truth...but I guess the rules change yet again when the divorce is final.

You gave me an idea. Maybe the son can ask his Dad for allowance. Surely the Dad would be able to afford it! I am not so concerned with allowances as a whole. It is just in this situation, blaming his father for not having enough for allowance, is sort of bad. So much has been taken from this kid, an allowance is just the topper on that cake of crap he has to live thru.

If you knew how many times in the past year I've told ds, 'you don't need to know those details.' Seriously. He is the most inquisitive kid on the planet. He wants to know everything.
What does OW look like?
How tall is she?
Is she blonde?
Where did they have sex?
What did dad tell you he was doing when he had sex with her?
How many times did they have sex?
How did you find this out?

And on and on and on.

I am really mystified that you all keep telling me I treat him too adult like. Not really sure if that is accurate....if it is I'd like to stop it, but other than things like this morning where I cleared up with him that he is not responsible for my feelings about OW....not sure what I'm doing wrong there.

I think kids need to be told the truth to the extent that it holds the morals and values in place. Our morals and values in our house is that when you make a promise, you keep it. Of course I would have to tell my DD4 that daddy broke a promise to mommy. My DS8 I could explaine a little differntly. I'm not going to lie to them. I do want to protect them but they need to know that our family morals and values were broken.

Hi Cat,
Good question. I guess I make a distinction between affair partners and dating. If WxH chose to "date" another woman, then I would suggest the boy be as friendly as he wants. But if the "date" is the former affair partner, I'd have to say she doesn't deserve a warm welcome.
There is a way to respectfully say, "Hello Ms. Skank. I just wanted to let you know that your role in the destruction of my family is duly noted, and my opinion of you is based on that."
There is no reason to tell children they have to cowtow to adults just because they are adults. It's correct to treat EVERYONE respectfully, regardless of their age, but that does not mean you have to be friendly.
Melody Lane has talked several times about how her dad had numerous affairs and remarried, etc., (don't remember all the details) but that she said she was very confused as a child because no one told her that what was happening was WRONG.
Nothing wrong with telling a child when an adult has done something WRONG, IMVHO.