lokil, you are a selfish, spoiled wayward who wants everything on their own terms. I will no longer respond to any of your posts. You don't want help to fix the damage you've done. You want our blessing. You're not going to get it here.

I don't want your blessing...

Lokil, what DO you want from us?

Meh at this pont I don't know, I do like to see how other people with similars expiriences played out. Like I said I mostly stay out of everything here, I can see why the BS sees me as the devil, i have been cheated on too, so I probably should just shut up. But I figured if that other girl came back I wanted her to see that she wasn't crazy by thinking that she shouldn't have sex when she doesn't want to. And right now I think 2 long was being helpful so I replied to his thread.

You can lurk until hell freezes over if you want to see how other people's experiences played out. Don't waste our time whining about how people see you as the devil (please copy the post that says that - I don't remember anyone calling you 'the devil'). You have no intention of confessing to your husband, no intention of rebuilding your M. You will play a game with your husband and pretend that your body is his. You and your OM will always know differently. Live with that.

*edit*

lokil,
I'm know I've mentioned it earlier in your other thread to which you made no reply, but I'm still curious how you intend to get around the STD threat that you now impose to your H?

A blood test will not show HPV(venerial warts) and HSV(herpes). That is done by an exam while you are in outbreak by a medical professional. How do you intend to protect your H's health and perhaps life(HIV) by not telling or warning him?

The most common time for an HPV or HSV outbreak is anywhere from 3 months to 2 years according to the CDC. Are you intending to roll the dice?

My Fww did. She and I both lost. And she was much like you in that, she had no intention of telling me. My doctor threw a monkey wrench in to that notion. She (and I) were flabagasted.

I hope you think long and hard about that. My doctor said 60 to 80% of people with multiple partnes(that would now include you) are walking around with either HPV or HSV. 40% of women have had it for years and have no idea. Frightening!!!

All Blessings,
Jerry

Dr. H says that he finds (often) that the WS does not show remorce for the A's. He still maintains that the M can be saved. I am not saying this is normal wired behavior, but it is a phenomina <sp? that occurs.

Just a thought.

AND that the A must be stopped

Hi Lokil,

I�m glad you are still reading here and I hope you will let us know wht happens in the next few days and weeks when your husband comes back.

I, for one, am worried about your situation and hope you do the right thing. Whatever you do and whatever happens is important for me as a lesson. Because infidelity is usually hidden one doesn�t really know the truth of what happens out there. I am convinced it is never without consequences, short and long term.

I know Dr. Harley thinks that being apart (travel) is not good for marriages but I couldn�t find any article which mentions it. I think you did right to tell your husband that he should look for another job. The fact that he has traveled does NOT excuse what you did, that was your mistake alone, but you will need his help, if he should choose to remain married, to create a new marriage.

I hope you have a plan, or you have someone to help you when you tell him. If not you can come here for marriage building help.

I will be absolutely shocked if Lokil tells her husband. From the sex thread, it was clear that she has a problem with manipulation only if its her that is being manipulated. She stated in her own thread that she wasn't going to tell DH because he has a stated boundary that cheating is a deal-breaker. It was only when everyone jumped all over her that she backtracked a bit and said she would consider it once he was home. Just lip service.

Lokil, I want to hear your thoughts on something. Not telling your husband is no better than treating him like a pet. You deprive him of the most basic right of making his own decisions regarding his life. You remove his free will and turn him into just an extension of your happiness, not an individual with his own desires, boundaries, or priorities. Then you are going to put him in the same room with OM repeatedly and let him be humiliated repeatedly as you and OM share this secret. And then there is the issue that OM could easily blackmail you into more sex by threatening to tell. What happens if your BFF learns of another of OMs affairs and they separate? What is to stop him from calling you and saying "come over or else I'll squeal?"

When your BH finds out about this, he will absolutely hate you. His dignity will practically demand it. And you will deserve it if he leaves you destitute with nothing.

How do you square this with your statement that you care about your husband? Are these the actions and events that show care?

Sleeping with your friend's husband doesn't make you a bad person, in and of itself. How you respond to this situation will define you. If you attempt to keep your DH in the dark, you will justify every bad thing that was said about you. You will be morally bankrupt and just another piece of detritus in society.

If you actually care about your husband, and not just about yourself and what you get from him, doesn't he deserve honesty? Isn't he allowed to act in his own rational self-interest to protect himself? Its time you grew up and accepted that all actions have consequences, whether we like them or not. Part of being an adult is accepting those consequences and learning from them.

Good luck with telling him. We will all be here to help you when you do.

YEP!

But first and foremost........RADICAL HONESTY is required!

lokil, do you consider yourself to be an honest person?

Thinking of you Lokil, today is the 6th february, and praying that you will do the right thing.

and that your BS will have compassion...

I will say a prayer that you have the compassion and decency to tell your husband, lokil. And may God help the man when you do, because he will need it. May the Lord help this man with his pain and grief to overcome this terrible crime that has been committed against him.

ccbis,

As a FWS, I think your choice of words here is a bit "off"...In fact, it's actually rather unkind where lolkil is concerned, because it's sets her up to have an unreasonable expectation where her BH is concerned...See, telling her that you hope her victim has compassion for her isn't helpful to the marriage at all, and it sets her up to think that her BH's natural reaction to being betrayed [hurt, shock, rage, etc] is wrong - and it's not...In fact that is what she should EXPECT - she should NOT expect compassion...Telling her that her BH should have compassion for her victimization of him only helps to fuel an attitude of entitlement, and I'm sure you would agree that would be quite harmful, right?

What she should be told is that SHE needs to have compassion for her BH, which means telling him the truth about his life...

Now, should she repent and show remorse, and IF her BH decides to attempt recovery with her, THEN advice for RECOVERY would be that both parties have EMPATHY for one another...Unfortunately, without honesty, this couple will not reach recovery...

Mrs. W

Well said Mrs. W.

Mrs. W.

I very much admire you and your advice, so thank you for your comments.

In this PARTICULAR case, we don�t actually know what Lokil is going to do yet. I have hope that she will tell her husband, because I believe that she really made a mistake and shows remorse.

I BELIEVE THAT from the tone of her posts. Most here didn�t, she was insulted, mocked, treated as a troll, and yet she continued saying again and again that she felt terrible and she knew it was wrong.

I�m not surprised that she didn�t immediately take to the idea that she should tell her husband, because she probably thought of the hundreds of people she knew who had affairs and never said anything or the betrayed spouses who never admitted the affairs.... and just pretended that nothing happened.

I live in latin america and I know what it�s like.
the MB concepts are very foreign to us.

When I found out about my WH�s affair I immediately accepted MB because it seemed logical to me once I had read most of the stuff on this site but I wondered what my mother would say...

She was horrified and has never wanted to see WH again, BUT she still thinks any other affair is probably the wife�s fault and she finds them funny and just things that happen and that you shouldn�t talk about, things guys just do etc.

I can relate to where Lokil is coming from, and I also think she wasn�t even given a chance.

we who come to MB are a very small part of all the people with marriage problems. Most probably don�t even bother to try and work on their marriages. At least Lokil tried to find a solution. She was even told to go to a spanish speaking site because english isn�t her mother tongue!

I would like her to really get into the MB concepts, but she was barely given a chance to get to know them. She�s feistier than most.

Hopefully she will come back and tell us she told her husband.

ccbis, with all due respect, you have this very backwards. lokil does not show remorse. Remorse is demonstrated by repentance and she demonstrated the opposite when she went back to parade in front of her victim [the OM's W] to make sure she didn't know what she had done to her. It doesn't get any more evil than that, my friend.

What you mistake for "mocking" and "insulting" was a righteous outrage at injustice. People here are not "mean," they are outraged at cruelty. Decent people are supposed to be outraged at injustice and cruelty of other human beings. That is not a sign of meanness, but a sign of DECENCY. And sometimes misguided, but wellmeaning, people misinterpret that outrage as "meanness." I suspect you have done this with your misplaced sympathy.

It is not "meanness," ccbis. "Meanness" is screwing your best friend's husband in her living room and then going out with her the next night and pretending like every thing is alright. That is about as EVIL and CRUEL as it gets, ccbis. There is nothing anyone here could say that would be as evil as that. Yet you focus on the words used to describe her actions instead of her cruel, despicable behavior.

You feed her entitled, wayward, victim mentality. At her expense. That is helpful to no one. there is nothing helpful or compassionate in ENABLING a person to be wayward. That is a very mixed up, confused notion of "compassion" that has more to do with the enablers desire to "feel good" than it does in helping the perp.

So please, lets not afford inappropriate sympathy and "compassion" for unrepentented, remorseless cruelty. Lets save that for her victim. MrsW is right, don't give her unrealistic and inappropriate expectations of entitlements of "compassion" from her victim. She needs to be focused on having "compassion" for her VICTIMS, not for herself.

Agree 100%. Compassion should be focused on the people she harmed, not on herself. Her husband and her friend will be devastated at what she has done, and will need all the help they can get. They did not deserve this, nor did they volunteer to assaulted in this way. lokil did this to them. What she needs is repentance and compassion for her victims, not the other way around.

And this is not true, she was given every chance - she rejected it. Many WS's receive help on this forum when they are sincere about doing the right thing. She is not sincere and was not interested in doing the right thing. She was given every chance to practice MB concepts; she rejected them. She rejected the very basic first step, HONESTY, which is a universal value. Because that is not what she came here for. She came here looking for validation for decieving her victims and as of yesterday still had not agreed to tell her victims.

Members here are more than willing to help anyone learn MB principles, but they are not willing to help someone harm and decieve others. Numerous WS's are helped here in doing the right thing and do just fine.

Don't blame board members for her REJECTION of Marriage Builders principles and her dishonest behavior, ccbis. That is all on her. People who really want help here, GET IT. Board members are very generous here with waywards who are here to learn. But they are not, and should not be, patient with an unrepentant OW who comes here to gloat about how she got away with decieving the OM's wife. That is sick and no one with any decency would help such an endeavor.

ccbis,

I can appreciate your compassionate nature, but PLEASE be careful where you apply that compassion - as sometimes if it is misplaced at the wrong time, it can do more harm than good, which I KNOW is not your intention...

I'll give you an example:

Telling an unrepentant person that you forgive them - See, doing that would actually act as a roadblock to real repentance for the person - it would ease their conscience at a time when they very much NEEDED to be convicted by their conscience...So ultimately what was meant as an act of compassion, the offering of forgiveness, becomes an incompassionate act, regardless of intention...Make sense?

I agree that lolkil has expressed remorse here, but for the WRONG REASONS...Her remorse is not about what she has done TO her BH and her betrayed friend, but rather it's about her own GUILT - She feels sorry for HERSELF because now that she has done what she has done her conscience hurts - She feels used by the OM, and she is afraid of what SHE will lose - her BH, her friend...She has remorse over HER POTENTIAL LOSSES and bad feelings, not over the victimization of her husband and friend...

Mel is right ccbis, her actions of going to dinner with the OM and her betrayed friend clearly show a LACK of proper remorse and compassion...That shows cruelty in the highest degree...I'm sure you see this, right?

Mrs. W