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I had to give this some thought. Yes, I do fear myself. I fear that I will completely and totally lose myself, by my own hand, before I make it out of this abyss. 
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Mopey, in counseling have you discussed learning how to set measurable goals for yourself?
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Folks, Just a question. How do you define immaturity? I am reminded of the quote A child NEEdS what they want and an adult wants what they NEED. Somehow, that quote doesn't completely define "immaturity" for me as I have a sibling with some sort of personality disorder that has been present since learning to speak. This person actually seems to live in an alternate universe but is highly functioning. But, I am curious about the "immaturity" definition as several posters have mentioned that many personality disorders are represented by the difference in actual age and emotional age. JL
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Not sure, JL. I do know that these BPD/NPD types are really mean to you. An immature person is not neccessarily that way.
I have this question in my mind, as well. Was I doused repeatedly with freezing cold water in the shower(and once while fully clothed, ready to go out) because my XWW was mean or because she childishly thought this was funny?
Was I called emasculating names because she was playfully teasing me or was she trying to hurt me and undermine my confidence.
I would go to my buddies in confusion and aske them if their wives did such things, as I was so confused. Thye were aghast at what she was saying and doing.
I think there is way more than immaturity going on with these folks.
Last edited by Zelmo; 02/08/10 02:34 PM.
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Zelmo,
I do to. Mean is not immature.
God Bless,
JL
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Immature to me means that a person never thinks about how their actions affect other people. Instead they whine and cry about how put upon they are even in reasonable situations. I expect certain responses from an adult and it's not to act like a 4 yr old having a meltdown. Granted there may be moments of a childish response when we aren't in the best of moods that we can all be guilty of...but I'm looking at a pattern of consistently poor coping mechanisms.
BW - me
exWH - serial cheater
2 awesome kids
Divorced 12/2011
Many a good man has failed because he had a wishbone where his backbone should have been.
We gain strength, and courage, and confidence by each experience in which we really stop to look fear in the face... we must do that which we think we cannot.
--------Eleanor Roosevelt
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I had to give this some thought. Yes, I do fear myself. I fear that I will completely and totally lose myself, by my own hand, before I make it out of this abyss. Pep, forgive me for not getting it, but how does this mean I've made a step in the right direction? Appreciate the kudos, if I'm certain I deserve them. 
Last edited by mopey; 02/08/10 02:58 PM.
Husband was unfaithful to me before and after our marriage, at least 7 times. I found out 13 yrs into the marriage. Trickle truth for an entire year. Several different d-days, so it was more like a d-year. Difficult recovery.
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have you discussed learning how to set measurable goals for yourself? No, I don't believe so. Hard to imagine too with all the counseling I've received so far. I can see how that would be extremely helpful to me though. I think I shall make an appointment, for just myself, to ask about that very thing. Thank you, big time, for mentioning that. I think I've reached some personal/talked about goals. Because we "talked" about them, does that count? Are we talking about measurable goals in the context of say.......I didn't react negatively to something hurtful my H said to me, for x amount of days. Something like that? So that I can watch the days to make them months, years, etc?
Last edited by mopey; 02/08/10 03:05 PM.
Husband was unfaithful to me before and after our marriage, at least 7 times. I found out 13 yrs into the marriage. Trickle truth for an entire year. Several different d-days, so it was more like a d-year. Difficult recovery.
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Pep, forgive me for not getting it, but how does this mean I've made a step in the right direction?
Not everyone is willing to go there.
You recognized/named your fear.
Until you do that, you wander around with vague feelings.
Good for you !
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Immature to me means that a person never thinks about how their actions affect other people. Instead they whine and cry about how put upon they are even in reasonable situations. This has been my experience with my husband. And he doesn't really whine or cry, he just gets angry or annoyed if asked to do something that would seem reasonable to most people. Webster's compact dictionary defines "immaturity" as "with an undeveloped character". That would fit in with the article Mr. W. posted.
Last edited by mopey; 02/08/10 03:13 PM.
Husband was unfaithful to me before and after our marriage, at least 7 times. I found out 13 yrs into the marriage. Trickle truth for an entire year. Several different d-days, so it was more like a d-year. Difficult recovery.
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With measurable goals, I'd start with something relatively easy, if I were you.
Example of non measurable:
"I will have more self esteem."
Example of measurable goal:
"I will make a daily journal entry of 3 things I did that I am proud of."
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Then yes Pep. I did that.  Kudos for me! 
Last edited by mopey; 02/08/10 03:18 PM.
Husband was unfaithful to me before and after our marriage, at least 7 times. I found out 13 yrs into the marriage. Trickle truth for an entire year. Several different d-days, so it was more like a d-year. Difficult recovery.
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That's why I asked what do you do if you have a personality disorder. Is there a treatment? Because if there isn't, what's the point? I do believe many of those symptoms can describe several aspects of my personality, yet I'm pretty sure I don't have an actual disorder - just a personality. That personality includes certain weaknesses - many of which I am aware and do my best to overcome or avoid situations where they could get me into trouble. I mostly succeed but I've had the occassional blow-out that later I could look back and see that I grossly over-reacted. I don't think I'm the only person alive who has ever experienced this.
And regarding emotional immaturity, I've been thinking for some time - long before this thread appeared - that WXH had shown many aspects of emotional immaturity throughout our marriage and even beforehand. Some of the things he told me about why he loved OW so much - compared with how he used to be back when we were dating - they are very similar. Nevertheless, I still highly doubt he has a personality disorder, even today. Yes, he's immature. Yes, he's selfish with an overblown sense of entitlement. And yes, he's an all-around POS. But he's not really anything like the list of symptoms - they match me more than they match him.
In any event, if there's a way to overcome any of those symptoms I'd like to know. Some of these touch on areas I've been trying to improve on long before my life was derailed by adultery. It's called "therapy," Tabby. I am currently researching therapists who are familiar with the concept and treatment of personality disorders. Not all are. It's a relatively new field. The trained therapist administers one or more tests to measure the level of (if present) disorder and then designs treatment for it. One such treatment is known as DBT: Dialectical Behavioral Therapy. In a nutshell Basically, DBT maintains that some people, due to invalidating environments during upbringing and due to biological factors as yet unknown, react abnormally to emotional stimulation. Their level of arousal goes up much more quickly, peaks at a higher level, and takes more time to return to baseline. This explains why borderlines are known for crisis-strewn lives and extreme emotional lability (emotions that shift rapidly). Because of their past invalidation, they don't have any methods for coping with these sudden, intense surges of emotion. DBT is a method for teaching skills that will help in this task. In essence, DBT attempts to have the patient learn how to live in the "here and now" and not react to stimulus in extreme fashion, which is one sign one is BPD. Therapy of any sort is all about learning how to deal with reality. In an earlier post I reported that I have become aware of my own emotional immaturity and FOO issues. I will not solve those here. All the reading and researching in the world isn't getting me to the point where I can help myself. For this, I will need a therapist.
Preach the Gospel every day. When necessary, use words.
St. Francis of Assissi
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And he doesn't really whine or cry, he just gets angry or annoyed if asked to do something that would seem reasonable to most people. Whine and cry or angry and annoyed...they are all in the same bucket. My point was that in lieu of a reasonable response to a reasonable expectation, you get crap.
BW - me
exWH - serial cheater
2 awesome kids
Divorced 12/2011
Many a good man has failed because he had a wishbone where his backbone should have been.
We gain strength, and courage, and confidence by each experience in which we really stop to look fear in the face... we must do that which we think we cannot.
--------Eleanor Roosevelt
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Example of measurable goal:
"I will make a daily journal entry of 3 things I did that I am proud of." Thanks for the explanation. I think I can do that. It would actually force myself to do things to be proud of, so that I will have something to write. Can actually writing it down in a journal count for one? Because I hate journaling....lol....
Husband was unfaithful to me before and after our marriage, at least 7 times. I found out 13 yrs into the marriage. Trickle truth for an entire year. Several different d-days, so it was more like a d-year. Difficult recovery.
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Whine and cry or angry and annoyed...they are all in the same bucket. My point was that in lieu of a reasonable response to a reasonable expectation, you get crap. I get your point, and I agree with it.
Husband was unfaithful to me before and after our marriage, at least 7 times. I found out 13 yrs into the marriage. Trickle truth for an entire year. Several different d-days, so it was more like a d-year. Difficult recovery.
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Can actually writing it down in a journal count for one? Because I hate journaling....lol....
etc.
YES, of course it "forces" you to do things you are proud of.
I'm no dummy, yanno?
I'm just nekked.
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One more suggestion (saying this gently).
Never journal about your husband. Ever!
It's all you, baby girl. All you.
Not one word about he-who-shall-not-be-named.
Another journaling suggestion is a daily gratitude (or 3).
Today I am grateful for birds singing (whatever).
It's a way to adjust your attitude yourownself.
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I'm no dummy, yanno?
I'm just nekked. Lol....sounds reasonalably intelligent to me. Maybe you'll start a fad. YES, of course it "forces" you to do things you are proud of. You are a clever one I must say. Say...if I have the complete inhibition to sit at my computer and type nekked, that one would count for the journal too, right?
Husband was unfaithful to me before and after our marriage, at least 7 times. I found out 13 yrs into the marriage. Trickle truth for an entire year. Several different d-days, so it was more like a d-year. Difficult recovery.
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1) Today, I listened to Zelmo.
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