Are you kidding me? You had the perfect opportunity to snoop and you gave her the respect due a faithful spouse??? tresmal, she's hiding an email account from you! What does that tell you?? My FWH has turned himself into a pretzel this past year, being o&h, totally transparent and accountable - he's the poster boy of remorseful FWH's. Do I check up on him and snoop? You'd better believe I do! And he knows I reserve the right to check anything I want to check for as long as I want to check it.

I know. I forgot about this e-mail and the other one. I think she just recently changed them. Though I haven't checked them since December......

True, yes I passed up the opportunity. However, I was also looking at covering my [censored] legally. Technically, since she's not living in the house snooping around her hotel room would be an invasion of privacy and might be considered breaking and entering. Which is kinda borderline, seeing she gave me a key to the room. But I didn't want to take that chance.

[quote=Tresmal
True, yes I passed up the opportunity. However, I was also looking at covering my [censored] legally. Technically, since she's not living in the house snooping around her hotel room would be an invasion of privacy and might be considered breaking and entering. Which is kinda borderline, seeing she gave me a key to the room. But I didn't want to take that chance. [/quote]

How would she know? Snooping can be done without pulling all the drawers out and throwing things around the room. And there's no breaking and entering if she gave you the key.

Another thing: my FWH kept text messages on his phone that were months old by D-Day. I asked him what he would have done if I'd picked it up and read them. He said he would have had to come clean, and he wondered if he subconsciously left them on there so I could catch him. Maybe that was one reason she gave you her key? Just a thought.

Promise us you won't throw away another opportunity like that.

Nope. Breaking and entering is burglary, and it requires you actually break something to enter. It's not even trespassing since you were invited. The fact that you were invited takes a key element out of any legal case against you.

So by her giving me a key to the room indicates that I was invited?

I'll try not too. My self esteem is so shot right now though. I don't know if I can handle another "D-day". She says she's trying, but I just don't feel she's being sincere. Maybe that's the devil's advocate in me, I have tendancy to look for the worst in everything. I dunno. I just feel like such an idiot right now.... I can barely keep myself together half the time. Even my DD can tell when I've had a bad day, I worked from home the other day and when she got home from school she just looked at me and said "Had a bad day?". I can't even hide my sadness from her.

Yes.

OK, so I've made the following decision. While we were at the MC last week for our couples session, WW mentioned that she wanted to move her stuff back into the house before we went to Nashville for the marriage workshop and that when we got back she would either stay in the house or get an apartment. I'm going to tell her when we go to the MC this week that she needs to make the decision as to whether she is going to stay in the house or get an apartment before we go the workshop. My thinking is that this whole thing is putting a lot of stress on my daughter and she really wants WW to come back home. If WW comes back home and then decides to get an apartment, it will take a couple days to get the apartment, mean while my DD will have gotten her hopes up that WW has returned and then will be emotionally destroyed if WW moves back out to an apartment.

So needless to say, I need to protect DD. So before next weekend, she will have to decide if she is going to move back in to the house or not and if so, she will need to write the NCL (I asked a week or so ago during a couples session and she refused). As much as I want her to come home I'm thinking this to be the best plan to move forward. I know she has stated that she has ended it with him, but without the NCL I don't trust that she has.

If there is NC and your WW is transparent and sends a NC letter that you approve and send, then let her move back before you go.

HAs your DD been told mom is cheating?

What marriage workshop are you going to for that weekend?

Who runs it?

She doesn't want to move in until after the workshop, she wants to start bringing her stuff home the week of the workshop. She refused to write the NCL, but says that she ended it with OM. I have my doubts she did, but I could be wrong. Should I require her to write the NCL before moving in or, do I take her word for it and just check up on her? I personally would feel better with the NCL written.

The work shop is A New Beginning, its run by the Family Dynamics Institute.

I have not told DD that WW had an affair. MC recommended against it. All I've told her is that WW and I are having some problems that we need to work out. WW is DD's step mom. I have custody of DD.

Dumb question, but what is meant by transparent? Right now I'm having troubles believing she is sincere about wanting to work on our marriage.

The NCL should be a minimum for her to move back in.

Right now, you hold all of the cards. Don't let her control how and if there will be R. That is up to you.

Figure out what you would really want her to do to R with you.

My minimums are, NC for LIFE, NCL, quit job, WANT to work on M, STD test and MC with the MB counselors. I have a much longer list for R to begin.

Transparent would be that she give you access to all cell phones, FB account, emails, etc. She needs to be completely OPEN to you and you to her(with exception to snooping).

I also have on my longer list that we would have a shared email addy, and I would be putting a keylogger on the computer that he would not delete and not use the access keyboard(which he did after I installed the first keylogger), VAR and GPS as well as changing phone numbers, etc. Your list might include the same things on my list but you may want to add more.

Funny you should say that, in our couples session last week, MC said almost the exact same thing, but she was talking about WW. I do want her to come back home, but at the same time I want at a minimum NCL and the transparency. MC says I don't have control whether she comes home or not. I've been the one fighting for our marriage. Back in November/December she wanted nothing to do with reconcilation, then just after Christmas she started to become wishy washy on the subject (after watching Fireproof) and doing a lot of talking. She finally made the decision to work on the marriage a few weeks ago, but I still think she's wishy washy on the whole thing. Plus she hasn't completely stated she wants to move back in, her comments were "I figured I would start moving my stuff back into the house the week of the workshop (next week). Then when we get back I'll either stay in the house or get an apartment." That's the part I'm having an issue with, because I don't want her moving her stuff in if she's just going to move back out.

Well, the way I see it MC was WRONG WRONG WRONG with regards to who holds all of the cards.
Your WW had the affair and it is up to you if you WANT to take her back and try to R. If your minimum is going to be that she write a NCL and be transparent then don't let her use your home as a free storage unit.

Don't be AFRAID that she won't want to come home. Be AFRAID that she WILL want to under HER terms and what that will do to you and your kids.


I will let the vets chime in, but that's my opinion.

That's what I'm afraid of. I caved in on this at the beginning of January, when she stayed at her parents over the Christmas/New Year's holiday. She told me she would only come back if I got her an apartment. I compromised on that and put her up in a hotel. I didn't want to put an apartment in my name, and then have her not pay the rent, skip out etc...

I have single session with MC on Wednessday, before our couples session. I've all ready e-mailed her my concerns, so I'll be talking to her about this again before we go into the couples session and bring up my terms of return.

She has to come home on your terms.

NC letter is a must.

Another must is that you stop lying to your DD. Kids can handle the truth. The truth protects them. They need to know that it's not them and not you.

All you are doing is teaching b example to your DD on how to lie, live in fear when you have done nothing wrong, and that when you have done nothing wrong you must live in embarrassment for a WS's actions.

Your MC is a quack.

Tresmal,

My W and I attended a 8 week course by Family Dynamics that is done locally by trained facilators. This coursed mostly used Harley's materials with some of theirs. Steve Harley was intimately familiar with them and had good things to say about them.

Good to hear, I know they use is Fall in Love, Stay in Love book as well as Gottman's The Seven principles for Making Marriage Work. I was doing a little more research yesterday on the workshop and it sounded like they use alot of Harely's principles. I'll let y'all know how it goes and if it's worth the money. 'Tis fairly expensive for the 3 day workshop ($1495.00) plus hotel.